And the time is the 6th century, the place of southern China, the court of the Emperor Wu of Liang. The Emperor asked Bodhidharma, what is the meaning, what is the highest meaning of the holy truths, and the monk said, no holiness, vast emptiness, the Emperor said, who is this

[01:09]

facing me, the monk said, don't know, and he left, which as Gyo pointed out means he stayed and walked to northern China and sat for 9 years, wall gazing. We say wall gazing but sometimes people say facing a wall or gazing at a wall, but what we mean by this is he sat like a wall, he sat like a wall sits.

[02:12]

This was his transmission of Zazen, and we call this objectless meditation, to sit, not looking at a wall, but to sit like a wall sits, to make your mind like a wall. So this was his practice which he showed and which we're still trying to do, to sit like a wall with no objects before us, just practice.

[03:26]

This is what Dogen Zenji calls the practice of immobile sitting and from the time of Shakyamuni Buddha up to Bodhidharma and onward, the disciples of Buddha have been investigating this immobile sitting. Now, tuning in a little later, we're coming into the Tang Dynasty, that was the Wei Dynasty, now we're in the Tang Dynasty. Six generations have occurred since Bodhidharma. He managed to find somebody else who thought it was interesting to sit like a wall and

[04:37]

so on. This has been going on now for about 170 years and we have reached the sixth ancestor and as I mentioned last week, the sixth ancestor had two horns. One horn is called Seigen Gyoshi or Chinyaron. If we want to get sectarian about it, we might like Chinyaron better than Nanyue, the other horn. Anyway, these were two great lights of the great mirror of Zen. The great mirror of Zen is the sixth ancestor. The sixth ancestor's name is Great Mirror. Daikan means Great Mirror.

[05:44]

What's his name? Chinyaron Xingsa, Seigen Gyoshi came to the sixth ancestor and said, What should I do to avoid falling into stages, steps in stages? And the Great Mirror said, Well, what have you been doing? And Chinyaron said, actually maybe I should say Xingsa said, because he wasn't yet Chinyaron. Xingsa said, I haven't even been practicing the Four Noble Truths. The ancestor said, What stages have you fallen into?

[06:59]

And Xingsa said, If I haven't even been practicing the Four Noble Truths, what steps or stages could I have fallen into? Kind of a strange conversation. But anyway, the Great Mirror thought that Xingsa was a child of Buddha. So it's a little strange because he says, How can I avoid doing this? How can I avoid falling into these things? He says, What have you been doing? He tells him. He asks him what stages he's falling into. And he says, Well, how could I avoid falling into steps and stages? Why did he ask in the first place? But aside from that, there you have it.

[08:02]

This is another way to put the practice of being like a wall. Practicing sitting just like a wall is to not fall into steps and stages. What have you been doing? Well, I've been sitting like a wall. What steps and stages have you fallen into? How could I fall into steps and stages if I'm just sitting like a wall? However, it is also, I think, worthy to note that if you sit like a wall, or if you practice like a wall practices, if you really do that with great devotion, you will go through a very clear series of steps and stages. However, you won't fall into the steps and stages because that's not your practice.

[09:04]

Practice is just to sit there. And naturally you will evolve. Practicing like a wall is a very pure practice. And it protects you from falling into the steps and stages which you will go through. So I'm going backwards from Yaksan, Yaksan Yigan, going backwards to Bodhidharma and now Sagan, to establish the flavor of this practice of immobile sitting earlier. So when the monk asked Yaksan, What's it like? What are you thinking of when you're sitting there still?

[10:05]

He said, What did you say, ma'am? You have 20 seconds. Did you forget? He said, I think of that which doesn't think. Remember? And then the monk said, the monk sang, What did you sing? How do you think, not thinking? And he said, Non-thinking. This is the same practice as sitting like a wall. Same practice. It's the same practice as not even practicing the Four Noble Truths. Four Noble Truths, if you look at the 37 wings of enlightenment,

[11:11]

or even if you don't look at the 37 wings of enlightenment, the first four of the 37 wings is the four foundations of mindfulness, right? Mindfulness of body, mindfulness of feelings, mindfulness of thought, and mindfulness of dharma. And dharma is studying the skandhas, ayatmas, dhatus, and then studying the Four Noble Truths. Sagan didn't even get to the study of the Four Noble Truths. He didn't say, though, that he didn't get to the study of the first foundation of mindfulness. Maybe he did get that far. In other words, maybe he did get far enough just to follow his breathing, or pay attention to his posture. Maybe he got that far. He didn't say, I have no practice at all. He just said, I haven't even got to the fourth foundation of mindfulness. Not to mention the four right efforts,

[12:15]

the four bases of psychic power, the five cardinal virtues, the five powers, the seven wings of enlightenment, and the Eightfold Noble Path, which is just sort of a big... even the 37 wings are just sort of starting out. He didn't even get to the Four Noble Truths practice. So, he can't follow in these steps and stages because he hardly has even started to practice. And I think, anyway, what I'm trying to... what Suzanne said yesterday, what I'm trying to hunker down on is a practice that we do which is really kind of right there at the beginning. It's really right down there close to the ground and like a wall. Like not even... just barely starting. Really beginning basic practice, like following your breath.

[13:17]

If you stay real close to the beginning, you don't have to worry about falling into steps and stages and so on. But you will evolve. You'll get really evolved. You'll progress right along there as you stay real close to the beginning. So this is Sagan spirit. This is Bodhidharma spirit. And this is Yaoshan spirit. What kind of thinking are you doing there when you're sitting still? I'm thinking of that which doesn't even think. It's thinking, but very basic, authentic thinking. Now, tuning in 1970, San Francisco. The great teacher, auspicious peak, said to his assembly, speaking English now for the first time,

[14:25]

he said to his assembly, let's all follow our breath. Let's count our breath. Everybody, I'll do it too, he said. So then, in January 1970, we all started counting our breath. And then in July, the great and famous author of the tofu book said, you know, Suzuki Roshi didn't tell us to stop yet, but I think he would want us to. Don't you think so, Red? I don't know. So I'm going to stop and go on to a more advanced practice. I'm going to start doing Shikantaza, he said. He actually, Suzuki Roshi, told all of us, including him, who were practicing following our breathing, all of Zen Center was doing that, but he forgot to tell us to stop. And then he died. So we're not sure if we should be stopping or not.

[15:31]

We have no way to find out. Now, the author of the tofu book, after six months, decided it was time to go on. So he did. He wrote a tofu book and left. He crossed the Pacific Ocean and went there and made tofu for nine years in Japan and became famous. The influence of his practice is noticeable still. I'm not sure, anyway, if we ever should stop following our breathing or counting our breathing, get beyond this beginning practice. But I... You know, because it's okay to go on to other practices. You do evolve. But at the same time, I'm pointing to this very simple, quiet flavor of the school.

[16:35]

Very simple, basic practice, so that even though you evolve, it's easy for you to go back to the beginning, because you never really leave it. You never try to go anyplace. Now, sometimes you do try to go places, but that's not actually the recommendation. That's not what walls do. Walls don't go places. If they try, this is a foolish wall. But sitting like a wall, you do evolve, and that's all right. As I mentioned that poem by Rumi, the minute I heard my first love story, not his story or her story,

[17:39]

but just plain story, I started looking for you, not knowing how blind I was. Lovers don't finally meet somewhere. They're in each other all the time. To sit still and practice like a wall is faith in that kind of understanding. Here's another story about Qinran Xingzi. Oh, his name is Xingzi. You know his name, Xingzi? Xingzi means walking thinking. Because he used to walk around all the time thinking. What was he thinking about? So a monk came up and asked Qinran Xingzi,

[18:44]

What is the great meaning of Buddhism? And he said, What's the price of rice in Luying? Tian Teng wrote a poem about this guy. The accomplishment of the work of great peace has no sign. The family way of peasants is most pristine, only concerned with village songs and festival drinking. How would they know of the virtues of Xin and the benevolence of Yao?

[19:46]

I brought this poem up last practice period. The accomplishment of the work of great peace has no sign. Or you could say, no special sign. How you sit, how you accomplish the work of sitting like a wall has some sign, but no special sign. Each of us do it a different way. There's no particular way of how you sit like a wall. So the way of, the family way of peasants is most pristine. The family way of, the simple way, the simple way of Zen life here is most pristine.

[21:13]

Only concerned with our village songs and festival drinking. We are concerned with our village songs and some of us are pretty disgusted with our village songs. They're chanting too high or they're chanting too low. I can't get down there or I can't get up there. Anyway, we are concerned with the village songs, how they're going and how we can join them, how we can participate with them or not. This is our concern. Now some of us don't particularly want to be concerned with it, but nonetheless we are.

[22:18]

It's hard not to be concerned with the village songs unless you leave the village. But if you're in the village and you go to the singing sessions, then there you are face to face with the songs and the way they're being sung by these particular people. So, you've got a problem. You're either going to join it or not. If you don't join it, you've got a problem, and if you do join it, you've got a problem. How are you going to join it? Anyway, this is our concern. I'm not saying what you should do, I'm just saying this is the kind of problems you have when you live in a village. When the people get together to sing, either you go with them or you go against them. But this is what happens. Either you sit with them or you sit not with them. These are the kind of concerns that are being pointed to as the kind of concerns of the ancestors.

[23:26]

They're concerned with what's the price of gas in Spleenus? Is the coffee rancid or not? Is your back straight or not? Is it chanting high or low? Fast or slow? These are the issues that are involved in accomplishing the work of great peace. No special signs. And so if we can stay quiet with these concerns as they come up, this is like sitting like a wall. This is thinking of that which doesn't think. This is what it's like when you're sitting still.

[24:29]

Silence. Is that simple enough? Silence.

[26:28]

Influential, did you say? Yes, this is the same tradition reaching Suwakikota Roshi, Moojibuchi Amaroshi's teacher. This is Suwakikota Roshi's words too. Katagiri Roshi says that too. Zazen is settling the self on the self. He said it. Settling the self on the self, by the self, through the self, of the self. This is that same wind blowing all the way up to Suwaki Roshi, Moojibuchi Amaroshi, Hokai Roshi. The same poison. Yes. Ask me next time you see me.

[27:43]

Silence. I... Respond to the breath in non-thinking. In non-thinking? Uh... Respond to the breath in non-thinking. Yes. Non-thinking is a nickname for following the breath and vice versa. No. Silence. Laughter. Yes. I've been worried there for a while. After that, Rodrigo gave up his question.

[28:48]

Silence. Rodrigo's... I asked the Spanish-speaking people to teach me Spanish and Rodrigo's been the most... What do you call it? Taking the most initiative, the other people probably thought I was kidding. But, you know, another example of our lineages. I told this story many times. Suzuki Roshi spent his precious time teaching me how to count people in Japanese. Why would this nice Zen teacher spend his time teaching this kid to count people in Japanese? Doesn't he have something better to do with his wisdom and compassion? And doesn't Rodrigo have something better to do than teach me Spanish? Don't I have something better to do than learn Spanish? What am I going to use it for? To talk to Rodrigo. I'll never get that good.

[29:52]

It's a village song, right? That's all. But still, in my head, there's some idea. You know, shouldn't the Zen teacher be teaching me something a little bit more about Zen and this? Of all the things he knows and can teach, why is he spending his time doing this? I, anyway, think that sometimes. I think, um, I need clarification on the connection between the village song and the sitting with the wall and like the wall. I'm trying to figure out how those two are connected. Well, sitting like a wall, the story about sitting like a wall is one of our village

[31:00]

songs. Also, sitting like a wall, for us, is like peasants in a village getting together and singing village songs. So the stories about Bodhidharma are our village songs, plus the actual practice of sitting like a wall, that's our village songs. That's our festal drinking. Plus, literally, the actual songs we sing, and the food we eat, and the billboards we wipe, those are our village songs too. In other words, it's the activities of our village. For us, sitting like a wall is just quite ordinary. It's not a kind of a special thing. But we think, because we've heard about the benevolence of Yao, which peasants don't even know about, we've heard about the great attainments and the great holy ones.

[32:05]

So sometimes we think, well, maybe sitting like a wall or cutting carrots is not good enough. So, we start looking for our lover. When we hear about these people, we're hearing about something that's already in us. But we sometimes go off, rather than just stay here and take care of the village songs called sitting like a wall, not following the steps and stages, not even practicing the four noble truths. Thinking of that work doesn't think. These are all different names for our village songs. Right. That's what we're concerned with. That's part of our problems, is how to do that.

[33:09]

Because, in fact, here we are and we have to listen to that. So we're concerned with that. Excuse me for launching off into this somewhat intellectual statement, but as I mentioned to you, I'm reading this, still I've only read about two or three pages, but there's this book called Outer Revolution. And this guy named Eugene Rosenstock Hussey says, in order to get people out of their rugged individualism, their various songs, their various stories, to get them to get together on something and to establish something, you have to find out what passion do they actually share. What passion do we all share here?

[34:12]

If we could find out, what is the song we all love and we'll sing together? And what tune or what key, even, will we all go for? So we can not only sing the same song, but all together, one, two, three, in harmony. Or, you know, what disharmony or what dissonance do we love? This is what we're looking for. We want to find that, that thing we all want to do. And when we can do that, wow! Watch out for Buddhism! But it's not easy to find that. And a couple of years ago, or three years ago, whatever it was, and Zen Center was in the midst of a certain ... there was a lot of disharmony going on. Various people were shouting out, let's sing this song, let's sing that song, we don't need any songs, let's not sing, let's sing, let's hire a band! And this man, this very eloquent man, very intelligent, big-hearted, former owner of

[35:34]

Midas Muffler Company and advisor to Zen Center said, he was dying of cancer at the time and now is dead, he said, to solve the question of what you really want to do will not be arrived at discursively. Oh no, to solve the question or to find out what you want to do in the midst of evolving contingencies, you know, evolving contingencies. In other words, today you want to sing this song, yes, and she wants to sing that song, but tomorrow you both change your mind. And you agree and then she disagrees, and then to solve, to find out what you want in the midst of evolving contingencies will not be solved discursively. So we would like to know, what do we really want to do here, you know? We want to find that out, but we can't figure it out, we can't, with our thinking we can't

[36:37]

figure it out. Now, of course, I knew the answer to the question, but still I asked him, well, how do you find it out? And after he said that, privately I asked him, he said, well, you just face the discomfort of not having it worked out. And facing that discomfort, an epiphany, he said, will occur. I really believe that. So we just have to sit here, practice together, feeling the discomfort of not all of us really finding that one thing we all want to do. We haven't found it yet. And until we find it, it's going to be uncomfortable. And we can try to figure it out, but we won't be able to figure it out.

[37:38]

It's too complex, because everything is changing all the time. But just living together, staying together in the pot, feeling the pain of the dissonance, and living with our rugged individualism, as it goes in all these different directions, and trying to stay with each other, trusting the treasure of the sangha, insight will occur. We will see what we want. I don't know when, but I agree with him. And that's the way we have to go. Meantime, we keep singing songs, several different songs at once, or in three different keys, and we experience what that's like. That's what it looks like. So, we bring forth as much as we can of respect, and trust, and love,

[38:57]

and listen for the teaching of the gentle buddhas. And in the meantime, also, we have to take care of ourselves, so we can live through this day by day. I told some of you that a few weeks ago or so, I heard this voice inside that said, I love you, Revy. Revy, I love you. And I heard that voice right when I was feeling real kind of squished and oppressed. Somebody was talking to me, and I was getting kind of like... And this voice came up, and it kind of like soothed me, and it put this kind of balm around my body, so I could sit there and I felt comfortable.

[40:04]

So, we have to find out some way to take care of ourselves, do something for ourselves, so we can stand the irritation of all these other living creatures who aren't in complete accord with us, who don't know how to read our minds. Who don't adore us sufficiently, or whatever. Who don't know when to stop talking, or start talking. It's not easy, but it's a simple way. It's so simple. You don't need to make it complicated. Let's see. Got a bus to catch. Yes?

[41:08]

Why did you call our song Poison? It was such an homage to it. What? Because I'm a dirty guy. I'm a little devil. What about, as you mentioned, meditation, beginning meditation, and removing yourself from your existence. How would a wall remove itself? Remove? I didn't say remove. No, no, [...] no. Put this lubrication around yourself. Take care of yourself in the midst of the irritation. Don't try to get out of it. Recognize the problem, and take care of yourself. If you've got a burden, take care of yourself.

[42:10]

Don't try to put it down. Well, you can put it down, it's okay, but... The point is, take care of yourself in situ. I don't recommend trying to get out of it. So, like I say, at the beginning of session, I sometimes say, please follow the schedule, sit straight, don't move, and have a good time. So what if I'm really going to go across the river? What do you mean you're going to go across the river? He never really left the Emperor. He never left the Emperor, definitely not. His going across the river and sitting was his way to help the Emperor, and all of us. So, in a way, relatively... Yeah, relatively you may have to walk out the door and go sit sometimes.

[43:11]

Yeah, but you don't really... You feel like this is your way to take care of the situation. You're not leaving the situation. You're staying in there, with the pain, meeting the problem, growing. That's your spirit. Even though you may have to walk out the door sometimes, that's okay. And you walk out the door, and I also try to feel that you didn't walk out the door too, that you're still with me. If you leave me, I feel the same way as if I leave you. We only grow through these problems. Pain reminds us of what we're here for. I'm not saying you should, I wouldn't say, just, you know, be a masochist. I'm just saying, pain reminds you of what you're here for. Pain is not the whole point. Pain reminds you, I'm here to say, I love you, Brian.

[44:12]

Brian, I love you. That's what I'm here for. That's what the pain reminds me. It reminds me that I'm here to help. I'm here to help other beings. Without the pain, gee, what would I do? I don't know what I'd do. I guess sometimes when the pain's gone for a certain amount of time, I know what I'd do. It's not what I came here for. Basically, I just get off the ground, you know. I get really spaced out and heady without the pain. The pain brings me back down to the wall. The practice of being a wall. It brings me down to the humus. Well, maybe not all the way, but, you know, a little bit of all over.

[45:26]

A little bit of all over. Maybe it's in nature, walls to crumble, I guess. Walls crumble. So crumble like a wall crumbles. You never have a problem in your life. You think all these problems perfectly. You get it? No, I wouldn't. Fortunately, if we ever get to that place, it won't last. But also, we, yeah, yeah, people, yeah. People will hear about this great song and they'll come running and ruin it. People, you know, thousands and millions of people will come in and say it won't last.

[46:31]

But we still, you know, we still want it. Or rather, there's something we want and when we find it all together, it will be wonderful. And then we all go to sleep and we'll wake up the next day and that'll be that day. And we'll find it again or we won't. Loretta, was this a simple lecture? Was it simple? Pretty simple? I want it to be a simple one. Okay, what? I don't know. Did the intention sensei village elder or idiot? Pretty simple too.

[47:32]

And, was it pretty? Was it useful? I hope so. That's what I want. I want something simple, something pretty, something useful. And maybe even something beautiful. But I want to ask about that one. Satsang with Mooji

[48:53]

Satsang with Mooji Satsang with Mooji

[49:33]

@Text_v004
@Score_JJ