Our precious abbess asked me to give a talk this morning, so I'm giving a talk this morning. She's not feeling very well, so she wanted to just sit today. Among the various things that run through the consciousness in which I live, I sometimes mention them to you and sometimes I don't. Yesterday morning, as I was crossing my legs in this rather elaborate way before the talk in the morning,

[01:04]

The thought occurred to me that it's nice that we have in this temple, we offer this kind of mode of delivery of the sermons, that not too many temples or churches does the speaker take their legs and tie them up in those little yogic knots. And it's kind of an interesting thing that we do that and people come and they get to hear and see a person speaking and moving their arms and legs and so on, not their legs, moving their arms from that position. And I thought again this morning, isn't it interesting that I speak from this posture? I think speaking from standing and walking and sitting in chairs is also nice. But something comes from this body that's in this posture that's, well, it complements the other ones.

[02:07]

Also... I thought that the phrase went through my mind that we have been considering renunciation. And I thought actually that this morning we could consider renunciation some more, if that's all right with you. Is it? Hmm? Is it? Okay. Yes. Do I want some warm water? Yes, please. Is it okay with you, Jill, if we talk a little bit more about renunciation? Well, let's hear it. You would? Okay. Anyway, I thought that we've been considering it.

[03:24]

We've been doing some other things with it, too, I suppose. But in a sense, I thought, well, we've been considering renunciation. And then I thought, where have I heard that word before recently? And I remembered that I was studying this text on the yoga practices of bodhisattvas. And it talks about, you know, considering and... examining certain teachings. And I had a little bit of a bad taste about the word consideration, partly because later in the discussion it talks about a kind of practice where you don't consider the teachings, or rather she said, there's a non-consideration and a non-examination of the teachings. And I think in my mind, my mind classed, you know, the kind of meditation where you don't consider anything or analyze anything as the highest.

[04:31]

And it's not really the highest, it's just that that's the one that actually kind of like mirrors reality. But before we're ready for that kind of samadhi, that kind of meditation, we get there through considering things and examining them. So we're still, I think, have some more time to consider renunciation before we practice renunciation in a non-considering way. So in the, you know, considering the expression to relinquish, to renounce, to let go of control, to let go of

[05:44]

picking and choosing, to let go of checking, to let go of everything. In that discussion, I think When people think about not grasping anything or seeking anything, often they seem to get frightened or they're afraid of what would happen to them if there wasn't somebody, you know, right nearby checking and trying to decide what would be useful, what would be helpful. And actually, practice of renunciation, I think is suggesting that we actually surrender attempts to figure out what's appropriate. So as I said yesterday, to me, the thing that's most interesting to me is what is the appropriate response in each moment?

[06:56]

What is the appropriate response? But to find, not to find, for the appropriate response to happen, thank you very much, for the appropriate response to arise, I'm proposing to you that it's necessary to surrender, to give up trying to figure out what the appropriate response is. trying to figure out what the appropriate response is, is, I mean, perfectly understandable that if you wanted, if what you hoped for in life was the appropriate response, if what you hoped for was the Buddha's activity, which is responding appropriately, if that's what you want, then it would be reasonable having a human that you would try to figure out what that was, to try to check to see, is this the appropriate response?

[08:02]

To try to decide, is this the appropriate response? To try to calculate, to try to think about, what would it be? That's understandable. And it does happen. And what I'm bringing up is a practice called letting that go. And matter of fact, if you want the appropriate response, I'm suggesting that it's necessary to let go of trying to figure out what the appropriate response would be, even while you're trying to figure out what the appropriate response would be. Even if someone comes up to you and winks at you, even if someone comes up to you and smiles at you, and your mind goes, now, what would be the appropriate response? Right there, while you're wondering what it is, you just let go and don't grasp that thought. And if it goes further, I really wonder what the appropriate response would be.

[09:08]

Don't grasp that. And don't seek anything other than a person who's sitting there trying to figure out what the appropriate response would be. Be this kind of like, as I was using the term during the last practice period, turkey. be a turkey who's trying to figure out what's the appropriate response. Now you can say what's the appropriate response, and I can say it too, and I just did without trying to figure anything out. I said that. Did you hear me? What's the appropriate response? But I wasn't trying to figure anything out when I said that. But I could have said it as a signal to me to try to figure it out. But I'm not trying to figure it out. as you may be able to see. Can you tell I'm not trying to figure it out? I'm not. Nobody is actually. And to enter into that realm of where nobody, where nobody, the realm where nobody's trying to figure out what's right or wrong, that's what renunciation opens us to.

[10:11]

That's the realm that opens up. And that's where the appropriate response which is the Buddha. That's how and where it arises. I propose to you. But people are afraid of not grasping anything. They're afraid of forgetting all about our preconceived ideas Like, for example, that there is something called an appropriate response, or there is a thing called Buddha, or there is a thing called good. Again, I'm proposing as my faith, part of my faith, is that I want to realize good, and there's no such thing. And I want to be free of evil, and there's no such thing.

[11:15]

I want to forget all about, you know, trying to figure out what's useful. I want to let go of ignorance, even though there's no such thing. I want to let go of enlightenment even though there's no such thing. I want to not prefer enlightenment over delusion even though there's no such thing. But if I really think about it, actually, then I might be scared. I might be afraid of that. And even though I want that and even though I'm afraid of it, I notice the difference in my fear and the desire to realize renunciation is that one is very, very natural and the other requires giving, being generous.

[12:37]

I mentioned earlier that there are certain ways of presenting or encouraging the practice of renunciation, which I wasn't going to bring up. I don't know if I said why I wasn't going to, but anyway, today I thought I'd bring them up. The reason why I didn't bring them up was because it seems like at certain times, you know, with different people and different societies and different times in history, if you bring up a practice that you think might be helpful, sometimes, and people are... It's unusual. It's an unusual practice, one that they... are unfamiliar with, that it might be hard for them to enter into the practice because it's hard to do something new.

[13:55]

As we have this expression, it's hard to teach an old dog new tricks. And most of the people in this room here are well-established dogs. well-trained, well-programmed. So it's hard for them to learn anything new and easy for them to just let the program roll ahead. So this is a really unusual thing, this practice of pronunciation, so it's hard. So then when this teaching is presented, there's often kind of like some kind of like you know, warm up to it, like kind of like, well, let's get them inspired, like get them revved up, you know. Get them whomped up so they'll just leap into this practice. And the way that they used to whomp them up in India and Tibet particularly,

[15:02]

India and Tibet, was in a way that's kind of negative, sort of negative. And the negative presentation is sometimes not well received in this culture. So I kind of sort of have not been mentioning it too much. Matter of fact, I'm not even going to mention it right now. First I'm going to mention the positive approach. Positive approach is, which is really very similar to the negative approach, which I mentioned before, is that, you know, what do I call it? I said, basically, to do this thing which seems dangerous, like to meet somebody and then let go of your idea of who it is you're meeting, That's what I'm suggesting, right? As you meet somebody and you got a nervous system that produces an idea of who this is, that you relinquish, you surrender, you give away that idea of who this is.

[16:10]

Sound familiar? But some people think, well, what if I meet, you know, like a real dangerous person? What if I meet like Bernd or something? Or Susan, you know? Like, what if I met Susan, you know, and then I forgot that she was, like, dangerous? Then how would I protect myself from her? I got to hold this, like, Susan the danger. Otherwise, you know, when she goes for me, I'll be unprepared, right? So, have you heard about people feeling this way? They actually think that. They actually think. Can you believe? They think if a gangster's coming and they don't hold on to, this is a gangster, that when the gangster comes to get them, they'll be kind of unprepared. Because they'll say, well, no, this is just like, I don't know what. I don't know what this is that's coming towards me. But if it's a gangster and I remember it's a gangster, that'll be really helpful.

[17:14]

Ever heard anybody thinking about that? Have you ever heard that kind of thinking going on in your own head? But it's actually what happens is if a gangster's coming to you and you hold on to this gangster, most people just kind of like get weak-kneed or wet their pants, tense up, can't even scream because they're concentrating on holding on to this is a dangerous person. Or I'm suggesting actually, believe it or not, let go of that as a gangster and the appropriate response will come. And that's what I'm suggesting. And it's even probably frightening for you to even consider receiving that message I just delivered. So I already told you that story about Woody Allen, right? It really wasn't about Woody Allen. It's Woody Allen pretending to be somebody else in a movie.

[18:20]

I told you that story, but it's one of those kind of martial arts stories where he's in prison, he somehow gets in prison, and he's in a chain gang, or he's about to be put in a chain gang, and the head guard, you know, what's his name, George Bush, says, lines these guys up, and he reads them what we call the riot act. In other words, he reads them the rules. And then he tells them the horrible things that he implies. It's too horrible even for him to say, but he implies the horrible things that will happen to them if they do not follow the rules of this prison. And he has a very harsh quality of his voice and a mean look on his face. And he's big and he's armed. And... It looks like Woody Allen doesn't hold onto the idea that this guy's big, harsh, mean, and vengeful.

[19:24]

It looks like he doesn't hold onto those ideas. It looks like he kind of forgets who he's talking to. Because the guy says, any questions? And Woody Allen raises his hand and says, do you think it's okay to pet on a first date? Do you know what pet means, Barbara? It's kind of like you're on a date. You're out with somebody on a date. You know what a date is? And you kind of like put your arm around them and start petting them like this. Okay, nice. Nice. Nice boy. Nice boy. Nice girl. That's petting, right? Is that petting? Huh? More or less? So he asked the guard if it would be right to do that on a first date. Because sometimes, you know, first date you should be more polite. Just like, you know, don't touch in some societies.

[20:27]

So he asked the guard that. So that was appropriate response. Do you understand? That was appropriate response. Apropos to being funny. It was appropriate, and he could make that response, and it protected him very nicely. The guard was totally disarmed. The guard didn't know what to do with his face, arms, hands. He just totally melted. He didn't know what to do. He just like... That was a pretty good response, I thought. But there could be other ones that would have been good, too. They can come when you forget who you're talking to, when you remember who you're talking to. In other words, when you hold on to who this person is, in other words, who you think this person is, the responses are very constricted and your being is held back and strangled and you feel anxiety.

[21:33]

Even if the idea you have of this person is, this is the most lovely person I've ever met. You can still feel strangled with anxiety in the face of such a person. Or this is like the most famous person I've ever met. I've always wanted to meet them, and this is them. Actually, it's terrible, and yet we're afraid to let go of this is the president, this is the governor, this is a movie star, this is Mel Gibson or whatever, you know, just like forget it. What would happen to me if I met somebody famous and forgot they were famous? I say you'd make the appropriate response. And if you remember who this person is, well, good luck. You don't have much of a chance. I don't say zero, because anything's possible, but... But still, one of the things that's possible is that even though for the moment you're holding, the next moment is possible that you'll let go and there will be a release.

[22:47]

You'll let go of the idea and then your proper response can come. But we're afraid of this. That's why I say somehow we need to feel safe that it would be all right. Like, for a moment, to look at somebody and just let go of who I think he is, just for a moment. Then you can go back and say, oh yeah, this is Keith. Got it again. Nice Keith. But for a moment, just let go of it. For a moment, die to it. I heard the image one time that there's an ocean of death separating us. Between each of us there's an ocean of death. In other words, in order to meet, we have to dive into an ocean of death.

[23:51]

We have to let go of who we think that is. We have to die to who we think that over there is. Entering that waters of death, then we come up out of it. and we see who it is. We arrive at the shore of the other person. They're totally surprised. But you have to feel safe to enter these waters. And to enter them, if really to enter them wholeheartedly, it seems necessary that we really are full of love and feel fully loved, or that we're really willing to hold each and every being and feel that each and every being holds us, then we can enter these waters. Then we can let go of who we think this person is.

[24:52]

And there's a chance of a real meeting, a real intimate meeting where the creative opportunities of the appropriate response can arise. So the positive approach is to try to develop enough love so that you, and if you develop enough feeling of love for beings, you feel the beings love you, and then you can practice renunciation. The negative approach, which I haven't mentioned, which I will now mention, is to basically try to train your mind to reverse renunciation. your attraction to life, to try to reverse your attraction to life, to reverse your attraction to future lives, to think repeatedly of the infallible effects of karma and the misery of this world, to train your attention onto these topics.

[25:58]

until you develop a revulsion for the attachment to the pleasure of the world, and even a revulsion to the pleasures of the world. Until you get to a point where you no longer desire the enjoyments of samsara, and you are nauseated by them, like a prisoner is nauseated by her prison. When you're like that, you have produced a strong and ceaseless longing for liberation. This is the mind of renunciation. This is the way that it has been taught in ancient times to ancient peoples, but I see not nauseation for the pleasures of the world in our society, but nauseation at the idea that pleasures would be nauseating.

[27:05]

I see nauseating looks on the faces when I say, nauseated by the desire for pleasures of the world. So that's why I didn't bring this up. You see, it may not be appropriate for this society for whatever reasons, and we could talk about that, but basically I feel like maybe the other approach might be better, to try to create a situation where we feel love for each other and feel loved enough to try this practice for at least a few minutes or an hour. Do you feel love? Do you feel full of love? Do you feel full of love for somebody? Do you feel full of love for everybody?

[28:08]

Even Bernd? Bernd, I have your name written down on this piece of paper. Well, I don't answer white questions, but anyway, it's down here. And at the top of the piece of paper it says, does Zen say anything about love? And then down below I have this Chinese character which I wrote on the board. It's probably still on the board, that character ding, which means, you know, it's a character used for samadhi. But the Zen understanding is that what that ding means is to meet whatever comes with no mind. That's what we say about love in Zen, to meet whatever comes with no mind. If you really love somebody, that means you meet them with no mind. You meet them and give up your idea of them. It releases the bonds which hold us back from entering the river of holding all beings and being held by all beings, that practice.

[29:16]

That's what we have to say about love and Zen. And then on the other side it says, Berndt, on compassion and Mara, the destroyer, for melting into the earth and being resurrected by the earth as Buddha. Because he had this kind of He had this take on how Mara helped Buddha at the night of his enlightenment. Right? Yeah. I think he had that in the last session maybe or something. I'm not sure. The last session was around the time of the enlightenment day of the Buddha. Yeah. And he got this vision, you know, of Buddha sitting under the bow tree and getting attacked by Mara. But he could see how Mara actually was a bodhisattva, helping Buddha. Do you understand?

[30:21]

Is everybody following this? Anybody not? Anybody afraid to tell me that they're not? You're not following it? Okay, so... I'm talking about Buddha under the bow tree. Bernd came and told me he had this picture. He was thinking about the Buddha under the bow tree. You know that story? Where all these army of demons came to knock him off his seat and get him to give up the practice. You know that story? So usually we think that Mara is interfering with Buddha's attainment, right? Challenging him, right? But Bernd saw how really Mara was like a bodhisattva helping the Buddha. Because in a way, what Mara was doing was coming to see, testing to see, can you give up your idea of Mara? Can you let go of your idea? This guy's opposing my practice.

[31:22]

And I think Bernd saw that he did give up his idea that Mara was opposing his practice. Actually, Mara helped him really sit down. So all the challenging things that come to you, all the things that you just can't stand to let go of your idea about them, they're challenging you. They're pushing you to really let go. So Barron's one of those bodhisattvas that's coming to meet you to see if you can let go of your idea of him. And maybe you'll grab another idea of him, but let go of that too. See if you can meet him with giving up all your ideas of him. And Michael's like that too. Aren't you, Michael? Come in to help me let go of my idea of you. Aren't you? Thank you. And it's not just letting go of your idea of every being, but that's the most important thing to let your idea of.

[32:32]

But letting go of your idea of every feeling, every concept. Let go of your concept of all your concepts. Let go of your ideas of all your ideas. Let go of your ideas about your feelings. Let go of all your ideas of yourself. Let go of your ideas of everything and see how you can enter away with this mind like a wall. When you sit in this room, when you stand in this room, when you walk in this room, every moment you have some idea of what you're doing, fine. That's what you let go of. When you're sitting, you may have some idea of what the sitting is. Let go of the idea of what you're doing. And we must, when we're sitting, let there be just sitting.

[33:34]

Of course, there's ideas about what the sitting is. They should be surrendered, given away. I don't know who's going to pick them up, but anyway, they're put on the altar. and made sacred by the act of releasing them. In this room we've probably got lots of good ideas about what this practice is. Let's just, you know, put them in a big pile and give them to anybody who was short on ideas about what practice is. And then we all sit here not adding anything to the sitting which is just sitting. not adding meaning or significance to what we're doing. This is pure sitting. So in this way, the teaching which I often bring up from Shakyamuni Buddha is the same as, you know, Soto Zen, just sitting.

[34:41]

Namely, in the seen, you train your attention in this way. In the seen, there's just a seen. You don't add anything or subtract anything. And when in the seen, there's just a seen, you let go of the seen. In the heard, there's just a heard. In the smelled, there's just the smelled. In the tasted, there's just the tasted. In the touched, there's just the touched. In the thought, there's just the thought. This is not grasping the seen. This is not seeking the seen. This is not grasping the heard or seeking the heard. This is not grasping the thought or seeking the thought.

[35:51]

This is having the vast spacious mind of renunciation and receiving everything that happens without closing in on it, grasping it, trying to figure out how to use it. And when it's that way, that in the seen there's just the seen and in the heard there's just the heard and in the thought there's just thought, then you don't identify with it. And then you do not locate yourself in it or outside of it. And then there's no here or there or in between. You have no location.

[36:53]

It has no location. This is just sitting. The sitting is just the sitting. You don't locate yourself in it. You don't locate yourself outside of it. You don't do it. It doesn't do you. It's just the sitting, and there's nothing more. Do you feel enough love? or for the world and from the world, to be able to just sit for a little while, to try it for a moment, to just let the sitting be the sitting. One more example. This is so I can fit.

[37:57]

When you gave your example with meeting someone dangerous and you came across gangster, quote, unquote, kiddies in a gang, that's how I saw it. You weren't implying that all kids in gangs are dangerous. Say it again. In your example you gave when you talked about coming across a gangster, you weren't implying that all kids or people in gangs are necessarily dangerous or one-sided. She said, when I said that coming across a gangster and a gangster is somebody who's in a gang, she said, you weren't necessarily implying that everybody in a gang is dangerous. No, I wasn't implying that. What I was meaning to say is that when we meet someone who's in a gang, we may have an idea that they're dangerous, or we may have an idea that six of them are dangerous and three are not. Whatever idea we have about them, if we hold on to that idea, that will block us from enjoying the appropriate response to these beings, which are so-called gang members.

[39:05]

That's what I'm saying. I'm not saying anything about the gang members. I'm just saying we always have, we're always, whenever we meet a gang, we always think about the gang. We don't just, I shouldn't say always, but first of all, we meet the gang, then we think about it. And then we hold on to what we're thinking about it. And that makes us awkward in relating with gangs. But if we can meet gangs without, you know, what do you call it? What do you call it? Attaching to your view of the gang. If we can meet the gang without a fixed view of the gang, then we can really rumble. You know? Hey, man. What do you do? Like, Hey man, let's protect some life. That was pretty friendly, I thought.

[40:11]

I just thought that. I let go of that. Wasn't that friendly? It was weird. Who is this cat? Now, I saw this picture recently. Someone showed me this picture. And, you know, in the context of renunciation, when I saw that picture, I thought, wow, that's quite a nice picture. And I thought, I want to share this picture with people. But then I thought, now they'll think this is just like a proud grandfather. You know, and I thought, you know, where's the nauseation with the pleasures of the world here? I saw this picture of this little kid, you know. It was a picture of this little boy who was dressed up for Halloween. And the outfit was, he was dressed up as the Dalai Lama. So he had like a gold, you know, under robe, like a skirt or, you know, under robe that wrapped around his chest and gold socks or yellow socks.

[41:21]

And he had a little mala and sunglasses. And then a maroon robe over his, I showed his mother to put the maroon shoulder over the left shoulder, but she put it over the wrong shoulder, or he put it over the wrong shoulder. So anyway, the over robe's on the wrong shoulder. But anyway, so they showed me this picture of this little guy dressed up as the, dressed up as the Dalai Lama. And I looked at it, and, you know, I just thought, God. I was quite touched. You know, he has very short hair, so he has this, like, little bald... And he's got the lamala around his neck, and he's got these big yellow socks on that are kind of, like, coming off his feet.

[42:24]

Anyway, I just, you know... The more, the more, it's true for me, the more I let go of my ideas of who he is, the more I love him. And sometimes he just comes up to me and the way he is just knocks my ideas of who he is away and then I see who he is. And I find it's the same with everybody in this room. The more I let go of my idea of you, the more I love you. And here's another picture of him before he put the outfit on. And I guess most of us look like this too before we put our robes on. Just, you know, covered with skin. We're just naked little creatures, naked little animals. And then we can put on these cute outfits. So anyway, if we can practice enter into renunciation, we can give up.

[43:33]

what's holding back the love. And then the love can come out. And then it can develop and develop and develop and develop until we have perfect wisdom through interacting with these beings who keep challenging us to let go of our idea of them. Because the kind of creatures we are is that we very naturally, we must, you know, come up with ideas of who this is we're meeting. And all we've got to do now is let go of that. And also let go of our idea of what the practice we're doing during the Sashin is. See if you can let go of it, if not every moment, if not moment by moment, which is the ultimate, that we could do it moment by moment. Just let go of what you think this sitting practice is. Let go of what you think Zazen is. Let go of that you think Zazen is sitting.

[44:36]

Let go of that you think Zazen is standing. Let go of that you think Zazen is anything. Whatever it is, give it away. I hope you feel safe enough to practice that at this point in your life. So I watch to see, do I desire a pleasure of his company? And if I do, I feel good about letting go of my desire for the pleasure of his company. I feel fine about it. And I actually think that that helps me be more ready to be of service to him as his so-called, you know, one of his two grandfathers.

[45:46]

And I appreciate that his mother makes an effort to let me meet him so I can let go of my ideas about him and let go of my pleasure in seeing him, and let go of my desire to see him again, and let go of my desire for him to play catch with me, which my daughter was never interested in doing. Got these mitts and everything. Okay, Dad, here comes a ball. Like one throw, that was it. But he seems to have, I don't know, for some reason, he seems to have more interest in balls. But anyway, I'm trying to let go of all that. And I feel like blessed enough to give it a try.

[46:50]

And I feel blessed to be challenged by things which make me really enjoy this world and challenge me to let go of these enjoyable things, these enjoyable feelings, these enjoyable sights, these enjoyable sounds, these enjoyable thoughts, to let go of them, these enjoyable theories, these enjoyable teachings, these wonderful things, all these wonderful dharma treasures, to let go of them, to let go of them, to give them away. all day long, give them away. They're so wonderful, and it's so wonderful to give them away. They are intentions.

[47:53]

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