I just want to start by saying a few more words about the... I don't know if I should call it the bodhisattva spirit or what, but maybe just tentatively call it the bodhisattva spirit. And as I mentioned, after class was over, somebody pointed out the contradiction in... what he thought was the contradiction in... I think what he heard me say was, bodhisattvas help others before themselves. And the bodhisattva spirit is, again, more to want to help others before yourself and to enjoy helping others before yourself or enjoy the thought of it. Because as this person pointed out, he said, how can you help others before yourself?

[01:03]

How can that happen? And in fact, bodhisattvas don't help others before themselves, because as soon as they help others, they're immediately helped. And as soon as you think of helping others, you're immediately helped. Big time helped. So, they want to help others, and they endeavor and work enthusiastically to help others before themselves, before themselves. In Dogen's chapter on bodhisattva arousing the thought of enlightenment, over and over again he says, before oneself, [...] Many years ago I gave a talk here and afterwards someone came up to me and said, wouldn't it be alright to, you know, to help yourself at the same time?

[02:08]

Yes it is. Definitely. Definitely. The bodhisattva spirit is to want to help others, to support yourself. Okay? Okay. Also bodhisattvas want to help others, but that doesn't mean that they think that they help others. In other words, bodhisattvas walk around thinking, it would be so nice to do something for John today that would make him happy. They feel really good about that. I'd like to give something really nice to Kit today. They think about stuff like that. I'd really like to be helpful today. They think like that, but they don't think, very often, They don't think, I'm helpful. I'm not saying they never think that, because the bodhisattva can think anything. Just like non-bodhisattvas can think anything. But generally speaking, they don't go around thinking, I'm helpful, [...] I'm helpful.

[03:16]

It's more, I want to be helpful. I like to be helpful. It's great to be helpful. Now, once in a while, the thought, I'm helpful, rather than you're helpful, I'm helpful, crosses their mind. Like, you know, dialing in a destination on a bus. It just comes up, that card comes up in the mind, I'm helpful, they think of it. Or somebody comes up to Bodhisattva and says, you're helpful, and they think, I'm helpful? So at that time they kind of consider it. So that does happen, it can happen. But the thing about Bodhisattvas is when that thought arises in their mind, Because they're practicing the study of dependent co-arising and so on, they don't grasp that thought and think it's a reality. Like, yes, it's true, I do help people, I am helpful. So that thought can arise, okay?

[04:19]

Wanting to help others before yourself, in fact, you don't help them before yourself, you help them simultaneously with yourself. It's always simultaneous. It's always mutual. And wanting to help others does not mean you go around thinking that you are a helpful person. You also don't walk around thinking that you're not a helpful person. You also don't walk around thinking that other people aren't helpful for people. But if the thought that this person is not helpful crosses your mind, you do the same thing with that thought, that they're not helpful, that you would do with the thought that you are helpful. And not only that, But when you think that somebody else is helpful and you rejoice in that, you don't grab that thought either. You don't make it into a reality that they're helpful either. You just experience joy as a thought. Now also, bodhisattvas think about the suffering of other people.

[05:23]

They think about it and also they feel it. And they feel their own suffering too. Little by little, you know, a bodhisattva is really open to the suffering of the world, really open to the anxiety of themselves and all living beings and even the anxiety of inanimate objects. Shakyamuni Buddha was a very anxious person, just like us. But Shakyamuni Buddha completely settled with his anxiety at a certain point. He really opened all the way up to it and settled with it.

[06:31]

This is a fundamental step in his realization of the way so following his path is to open up to our own anxiety and we have probably you know basically almost as much as him probably the the what we call the mahayana the great vehicle, is not just compassion, though, and it's not just wanting to help other people before yourself. That's the foundation of it. That's the ground of it. It grows on that compassion and that enthusiastic wish to help others. That's the ground of it. But it's more than that. It is also a deep realization of emptiness of all things. So two things.

[07:41]

It is possible, whatever you call bodhisattva, whatever, it is possible for a person to really appreciate how wonderful it is to help others before for self and really feel compassion for other beings and really feel compassion for themselves. That is possible without the realization of the emptiness of existence. But the Mahayana, to fully unfold this compassionate spirit, requires a deep realization that things lack inherent existence. Or this, in other words, the Buddha, when talking to the bodhisattvas, the Buddha's talking to the bodhisattvas through sabudhi, bodhisattva sabudhi, the monk sabudhi, and he says, a bodhisattva must produce a thought which has no abode.

[09:00]

So he's talking to beings who have made this great compassionate vow, this great altruistic vow. Speaking to that audience of bodhisattvas, he says, okay, bodhisattvas, now produce a thought which has no abode. You need that thought, that kind of mind to be united, that kind of attitude to be united with this spirit of compassion. in order to protect the spirit of compassion and develop it. Okay, so now I'd like to... How does this relate to these precepts, these bodhisattva precepts? And in the ordination ceremony, as I said the other day, After invoking the presence of the Buddhas, Bodhisattvas and all our ancestors, after invoking their compassion and wisdom to sustain us, the first step in the ordination is renunciation.

[10:18]

So again, renunciation is, for bodhisattvas, renunciation is also based on compassion. One time, Dogi Zenji was talking to his teacher, Ru Jing, and Ru Jing was pointing out that the Buddhas and Bodhisattvas sit upright in the center of the world of suffering of all beings. And sitting there, still and upright, a mind arises in them, which is called, he called it in Chinese , which means soft, or supple, or flexible, gentle.

[11:51]

This supple, gentle, flexible mind arises in the beings who sit in the middle of suffering, of all beings. And Dongyi says, well, what is that mind? And Ru Jing said, it is the wish to drop body and mind. The wish to drop body and mind is a supple, gentle, flexible mind. or the real supple, gentle, flexible mind wishes to drop body and mind, drop all attachment to body and mind. So by compassionately, by opening to suffering and sitting in the middle of it, sitting still, in other words, not only being compassionate, but also being patient to sit still in the middle of your pain and to settle in the middle of your pain, this mind of renunciation arises.

[13:00]

And not a... It may be a fierce, kind of fierce mind, but it's very soft. It's named soft mind or gentle mind. It's the, you know, just the right touch that's required to stop touching. Do you mean the right touch? It's just kind of like the right, the most skillful way to not touch things anymore. To not meddle with things. But it's not a rough, you know, harsh, rigid, not touching things. It's a, you know, sort of ineffable, relational, subtle, ungraspable, not touching. So Bodhidharma said to his great disciple,

[14:08]

who we call the second ancestor, he said, don't activate your mind around objects. Externally, don't activate your mind around objects. Internally, no coughing or sighing. or scoffing, or snickering. You know, in other words, when you see people, when you see plants and animals, give up. Medilate with what you're seeing. Just see the object and don't, you know, rouse and excite yourself around the object. Does that mean in terms of like a projection onto the object, like expecting it to...?

[15:23]

Yes, like no expectations of the object, no projections on the object. That's the instruction. And internally you think various thoughts, various opinions of yourself come up, or various opinions of others come up in your mind while you're internally, or you have pain and pleasure come up inside, Don't go, and don't go, you know, don't be a wimp. All that stuff, too. Just leave your inner experience. Just leave it alone. I'll unpack this more later. This is just the instruction, okay? Just repeat the expression, no coughing. Internally, no coughing or sighing in the mind. Or sometimes translated as no gasping. Like sometimes inside you go, none of that.

[16:24]

Just sit upright in the middle of the suffering of your experience and study. So then he says, then Bodhidharma says, with a mind like a wall, thus you enter the way. That was his instruction to the second ancestor. With a mind like a wall, thus you enter the way. With an upright mind, with like an upright wall. Like an unthinking mind. Sometimes they talk about Bodhisattva's mind as a, what do you call it, a scare deer. You know, in Japan, in China, they have these, they have a bamboo tube, you know, in a garden. And it's got one end open and the other end's full. And it's set off balance.

[17:27]

And then water runs into one end. And then it fills up the closed end. And then as the weight builds up on the closed end, it tips and the water pours out. And then when it goes back to its original position, it goes and scares the deer away. So bodhisattvas are sometimes compared to a scare deer, a deer scare, or a scarecrow. They're just sitting out there, you know, in the field, mindless. Mindless in the middle of their mind. They're mindless in the middle of suffering. They're mindless in the middle of all judgments. They're non-judgmental in the middle of judgments. Thus you enter the way, he said. And then later, we don't know how much later, whether it was a second later, an hour later, two days later, or several years later, and I mean several because both Bodhidharma and his disciple lived a long time.

[18:42]

came back to Bodhidharma and said, okay, I'm not activating my mind around objects anymore. And Bodhidharma said, well, does that fall into nihilism? In other words, if you understand that when something comes up, When you experience something that you, like, reject it and don't participate with it and, like, you know, nothing's happening kind of thing, and you're cold because nothing really matters, nothing really exists or something, that's nihilism. To grasp that kind of cold extreme in relationship to things. So like you say, oh, I see somebody, but no projections, no expectations, in a cold way. Like, kind of like, annihilating those capacities of mind, annihilating the judgmental capacity of mind, or something like that.

[19:51]

Like it isn't, you know, it just isn't operating anymore. And Huayka said, no, it's not nihilism. And Bodhidharma said, prove it. And he said, I'm always just clearly aware and no thoughts can reach it. Oh, excuse me, no words can reach it. So it's not that the bodhisattva is sitting there and there's no projection or no expectation in the field of experience. Because the bodhisattva is sitting in the field of suffering. And that means the bodhisattva is sitting in the middle of grasping expectations and grasping projections and the pain and anxiety around that. The Bodhisattva is sitting in that very energetic and active scene. But these things do not reach this mind like a wall.

[20:56]

They do not reach the mind of no abode. The mind does not take up abode. does not abide in these painful habits of mind. It's completely open to them and doesn't grasp them. Just clearly aware. Not even a self that's clearly aware. Just clear awareness in the middle of this field of whatever, pain and pleasure, projections and expectations. But there is the willingness to drop meddling with all this stuff. But again, to run away from this stuff is a kind of meddling. To try to control it is a kind of meddling. To try to improve it or depreciate it, to try to suck the blood out of it or push more blood into it, any kind of meddling that Bodhisattva renounces and has a mind like a wall, and thus she enters the way. Or as Hakuin's disciple Tore Zenji said,

[22:01]

wall-gazing. In the back, a spring flower opens. So, again, according to Lotus Sutra, as I did before, I'd like to do it again. The Buddha says, Those who practice all virtues, which means those who compassionately enter into the suffering of the world, who settle in their own pain and their awareness of others' pain, those who listen to the cries of the world completely, in all the ways that they can, and are gentle, in other words, settle in, just gently settle in, flexibly settle in, and are harmonious, harmoniously settle in, and upright.

[23:16]

They will see the Buddha teaching now. So this is renunciation. practice all virtues, gently, harmoniously, uprightly, settle into your experience. And uprightly, being upright means renouncing all kinds of entanglement and meddling. You know, if I say this kind of thing, often what people say, actually if I say this kind of thing to someone and the person actually enters that place and settles into the present, they often then a moment later or a little while later say, and then what? When you enter into the place where you're not messing with projections and you're not messing with expectations, then the mind often throws up the question, well, if I don't mess with expectations, then what?

[24:40]

In other words, if I don't mess with expectations, what can I expect? And that is an example of what should be given up. Namely, to renounce the and then what mind. Renounce and then what? Live in the world where the word and then, or the world and then what, when that word comes up, that word does not reach this place. You just listen. And then what? Well, and what's going to happen to me? How am I going to live my life if I stay here? This kind of concerns. It doesn't mean you say, shut up. It doesn't mean, don't ask me that question. I don't want to hear about that. It means you just listen. That's it. Just like you would listen to someone perhaps saying, you know, you're doing just fine and we'll take care of everything for you from now on.

[25:42]

But also don't grab that and say, oh, good. Just listen to that. But that's the big question. And then what? In other words, what's going to happen in the future? Can I really be not afraid? And when that question arises, just listen to that one too. Don't say yes or no necessarily. Just see if you find a place where the question, can I not be afraid, doesn't reach there either. That word doesn't reach this place either. This is renunciation and this is based on compassion and compassion requires this kind of renunciation. Bodhisattvas, before entering, before receiving the precepts, that's part of the price of admission is this renunciation. There. That's the beginning of the precept reception.

[26:44]

And renunciation is one of the interpretations of that expression from the Lotus Sutra. That expression in the Lotus Sutra is a teaching of how to practice renunciation. Now, people have been raising their hands and so if I And I'm willing to now sort of throw it open to questions for the rest of the time or present more and then open it up or open it up and then present more. I don't know, whichever way you want to do it. Do you want to have questions now and then for the rest of the way? Choice one, do you want to have questions from now to the rest of this class? Yeah. How many people want to do that, questions from now on? One. How many people? One. Two? No, I want to hear all the options. Oh, three. Three options are open up to questions and not necessarily any more presentation.

[28:00]

The other would be open up to questions and then after a little bit of questions go back to more presentation. And the other would be more presentation and then questions. Okay, those are the three options. Middle way. Middle one? Okay. Okay. Go ahead, questions. Yes. It's not an exact question, but on this concept of renunciation, yesterday when Lee brought up renunciation, I went and looked it up, you know, in the dictionary, and it's actually really interesting that the Indo-European root of the word is something like a word that means to shout. Because a messenger would come in a big room and shout the message. So then it came to mean message. So like announcement, you know, renounce. So renunciation means to throw back the message. So it has a lot to do with language and naming and conceptualizing and then throwing that back. So, like, you renounce the throne means that you say, you know, by saying, I give up the throne, by making that statement in public, you throw back the message that you are the king and you renounce the throne.

[29:12]

I thought, that's exactly what you're talking about. It is exactly the sense of renunciation and Buddhism, so it's interesting. But, so it goes deeper than giving something up. It's giving something up on a really fundamental circle, almost level in consciousness rather than a physical thing that you're giving up. Right. The outward sign of it. Right. It's deeper than that. Which is part of the... subtlety of the Bodhisattva way is that, you know, you can have somebody who has, like Vimalakirti, who has a wife and a family, but has really renounced sexuality. And you can have somebody else who has a gentle sexual life, but is totally caught up in it. He's a death kneller all the time. He's totally pushed around by it. Has not renounced sexuality at all. It's the deep inner release and reversal of habit that we're talking about here.

[30:18]

It's not so much our position that counts, but our willingness to turn. So it's in the turning. It's not so much that it's better, it's not exactly that it's better to be a woman than a man. What's better is if you're a woman to be able to give it up and if you're a man to be able to give it up. In other words, to change, to turn. It's in that turning from what you are into something else that the real practice happens. And another word in the Latin for renunciation is metanoia, which means to turn around, to reverse, 180 degrees, first of all. First of all 180, then 360. You know, on your way to turning 360, you turn 180. But it's good to stop at 180 per second to see what that feels like. Because if you turn back all the way to the beginning again, you may not notice that the revolution has occurred. So feel the various stages in the revolution.

[31:22]

Any other questions at this time? Liz? In the exchange coming back at Bodhidharma asking his disciple about nihilism, what was the language of that? Because you said it, and then I thought I first heard it with, I'm always just clearly aware of it. You said, no self-deliverance. Yeah. He said, I have no further involvement. And Bodhidharma says, well, doesn't that fall under nihilism or death? And he said, no. Pulled me down and said, prove it. And he said, I'm just clearly aware, or I'm always clearly aware, and no words can reach it. In other words, you... He said I'm, yeah. Huh? No words can reach that I'm. No word... The word I doesn't reach... The word self doesn't reach that I. It's like we say, when Shakyamuni Buddha said, I, together with all beings in the great earth, attain the way.

[32:27]

That I was not Shakyamuni. That wasn't him that he's referring to there. That I is where all Buddhas come from. And no words reach that I. That mind does not abide in any word. But again, if any words are tampered with or pushed away at all, you're abiding in the word. If you meddle with any words, like a sleazeball, get the sleazeball a little bit farther away from me. The slightest pushing is a tiny bit away from me. Selfish, arrogant, whatever. power-hungry, blah, blah, blah, any kind of messing with that word, it's got you. Pulling it close to you, like wonderful, you know, humble, gracious bodhisattva, pulling that a tiny bit closer to you is also meddling with it, and the word's got you.

[33:30]

But when all praise and blame swirl around you and you just listen gently and harmonize with it, that's renunciation. That's being upright. And that's how the bodhisattva generates and develops this mind which has no abode and finds the true place to sit in the middle of their compassionate vow. Yes? I keep wondering about this feeling that there being two things, that the mind has no abode and the various things that it doesn't necessarily... Two things. It sounds like two things. Two things. Two things are the word. Two things occur to your mind. Okay? You think that. Fine. I can do that too. I just did. Two things. Okay? Now, what do you do with those two things? You bring them up, talk to me about them just now. That's enough. To try to figure out whether there are two things or that there aren't, that would be meddling with the words two things a little bit.

[34:33]

Can you live in the world of words like that and just be like Your mind is embracing the totality of human intelligence and all its dynamic energy. It's all there. But somebody is really stupid in the middle of all that and doesn't mess with it at all. Now, that's already the case, that there's somebody like that. You don't have to make up this stupid person. who doesn't get involved in any kind of meddling at all, no matter how subtle and beautiful, wonderful things are. That's already the case. What you have to do is be willing to give up your participation and attachment to the grand show that is going on constantly. So, you know, case 21 of the Book of Serenity, what's his name? Yun Yan is sweeping the ground

[35:35]

And Da Wu comes up and says, you're really busy. And he says, you should know there's somebody who's not busy. Okay? You hear that? And then when you hear that, what do you think? You think, sounds like there's two. Right? There's the one who's busy, and then there's somebody who's not busy. Sounds like there's two, you might think. That's what Fu heard. Not just exactly what Da Wu said then. He said, well, then are there two moons? the world where we're participating with words and the world which no words reach, are those two moons. And Yunyan raised his broom and said, which moon is this? Which moon is this? If you say it's the unbusy one, that's the busy one talking. If you say it's the busy one, Well, it's the busy one talking.

[36:39]

It's not that it is the busy one, it's just the busy one is the one who says there's one or two moons. So the busy one hears this story and thinks, oh, it must be two moons. Or the busy one can also think, oh, there's one moon. That's the busy one. What about the one that those words don't reach? You should know that one too. Of course, you can't know that one because it's not that busy. No words reach it, therefore you can't know it. But it's always present. How do you realize the unbusy one? You realize the unbusy one by renouncing the busy one. But renouncing doesn't mean you kick the busy one in the butt. It doesn't mean you demote the busy one. It means you respect the busy one. Truly respect. Truly love and care for and enter into a dialogue with the busy one. It means you recognize the busy one is the power of all our minds. It's not to be slighted in any way.

[37:41]

And also, it doesn't need any promotion either. It's full-scale, vital right now. How about leaving it alone? That's called renunciation. And that's how to realize the one who's not busy. And when you realize the one that's not busy, you let the busy one be busy. And it's wonderful what it can do. When it's coming from its root of the mind which has no abode. Any other questions now about renunciation? Yes. Again, sorry, it's not a question. It's okay. Personal story, which, tell me if you remember this, but when you brought up that line, I think it's from Hoshiyoki about... You, Shin, do you remember this, that maybe 10 or 15 years ago when I was reading that text,

[38:44]

I came up with that term, and James Codera translates it as meekness of mind. Remember this? And I said, I don't get this. This doesn't sound right to me. And I was chewing on it, chewing on it, chewing on it. And then I said to you, would you please tell me what this means? Would you look it up? And please give me some guidance on this. And the best part was that you did, and you came and told it to me. at greens, we were at some kind of party. Remember this? And the place was crawling with people, and it was, you know, this big social gala thing, and he walked up to me and he said, it means flexibility. And I said, yeah, that's right. Meekness doesn't make sense. So, and then I think that that's such an important thing in my practice, the idea of flexibility as well. And I forgot that story when you, today when you brought it up, you reminded me of it. So, thank you.

[39:48]

And so flexible that it could even be meek. Yeah. Once you get flexibility, then you don't mind meekness. Right. So flexible and so meek that it could be not meek. Good. The bodhisattva could be sometimes, you know, pretty, you know, heavy. Sometimes that might be helpful, to be a little bit, you know, strict. But you don't inhabit the strictness. You don't abide in the strictness. Like one of Suzuki Roshi's Dharma brothers, so to speak, who's still alive, his name is Noemi Roshi, lives in Japan, and I wanted to visit him, you know. I was in Japan and I told Suzuki Roshi's son, Hoitsu Roshi, I said, I want to visit Noiru Roshi. He said, what? I said, could you call me? He said, no. I said,

[40:48]

You go to visit Naira Roshi, like, you know, he's sitting in his room someplace, you know, you go visit him, you know, and his Gita comes and knocks on the door and says, Naira Roshi, and he's sitting like this, and you go... You call him on the phone, you say, oh, Naira Roshi and nothing, right? You want to visit him? Well, maybe not, right? Yeah. I said, no, I do want to visit him. Because, you know, he was Suzuki Roshi's close friend. And actually, Suzuki Roshi suggested I go study with him. You know, before he died, he suggested that. And it turns out, Hoisu did make an appointment with me to see him the day after I was scheduled to leave. Anyway, he described Nayuroshi as... How did he say he said? I think he said... I can't remember exactly. Michael can help me with the Japanese.

[41:53]

Maybe I think he said, kibishi nai wa nai, and yasashi nai wa nai. Does that sound like Japanese? Nai wa nai. Kibishi nai wa nai, yasashi nai wa nai. I think that's what he said. In other words, huh? What? Dei wa nai? Dei wa nai, yeah. Kibishi dei wa nai, kibishi nai, dei wa nai. Yasashi nai, dewa nai. Okay? That's how you describe noriroshi. Kibishi means stripped. Okay? And yasashi means easy. Easy going. Kibishi nai means not stripped. Yasashi nai means not easy going. Okay? Noriroshi and dewa nai means not stripped. was not not strict and not easy going.

[42:56]

That's even more awesome than being strict. Of course you could sometimes say, oh, Narayurashi is strict. I mean, everybody could see that about the guy. Always practicing Zazen, you know. Everybody afraid of him. Always strict. But also he was very flexible to be able to do that. You could certainly see he was strict and you could certainly see that he was easygoing. But actually he wasn't either one of them. This is the bodhisattva's mind of renunciation. You can be strict, you can be very strict and you can be very easygoing. And Suzuki Roshi, you know, was very strict and easygoing. I... I told you about this before one time. I saw a picture of him, a picture of him on his back. He was out in a field in Vermont. There were horses in the background. He was talking to some old ladies. And you could see his back and the ladies' faces. And the ladies were going, smiling and laughing, you know.

[44:04]

So I guess either he just told a joke or he was smiling and laughing. And they were having a good time, I guess. They were seeing his easygoing front, I think. But if you look at his back, it was like there was an iron rod going through his spine. He was very easygoing with some people, very gentle and easygoing. And he was also very strict with some people and with himself. But really he wasn't strict or gentle. I mean, fundamentally, he wasn't abiding in either one of those. I remember when the Moon and Dewdrop came out, there's a frontispiece of Dogen's Enji, which is on the back of the book, and when David Weinberg saw the picture, I was nearby, and he said, you know, I think it's a self-portrait, and one eye of Dogen is like looking up, and one of them is looking down. And David said, looks like he's looking at Nirvana with one eye and a hamburger with the other one.

[45:09]

So there's two sides. This is the mind of renunciation. Not abiding in being a strict Zen monk. Not abiding in being a monk who can't even remember what school he's in. Not abiding in either one of those. But you could be. You could be a Zen monk who comes up to you and says, I'm sorry, I forgot. I'm going to call my teacher just a second. Or you could be someone who would come back with the big proclamation, who would shout the Sha-Zen of the ancestors with great strength and clarity and confidence. But you don't walk around abiding in strength and clarity and confidence. You don't walk around abiding in not knowing. You can just easily move from one to the other because you've got this flexible mind. How do you get this flexible mind? You don't buy it. In a way you do. How do you buy it? How do you buy it? You buy it by paying the price of being you.

[46:13]

Of feeling your pain. Of settling with your anxiety. And thus facing your own anxiety. Open your ears to the anxiety of the whole world. At the price of real willingness to let go of and then what? If you feel 100% Maybe not even 100, maybe just 16 times you feel how painful it is to get into and then what? Maybe more than 16, maybe 75, maybe 40, 40 billion times you have to feel how painful it is, how expensive, and what a stress it is to think about and then what? If you experience that over and over, and then what is really a pain, and really doesn't help anybody, you gradually might be going, well, maybe I could let go, and then what? Maybe that would be possible. If you're in the middle of great pain, you sit in the middle of great pain, like maybe at the hottest moment of a session,

[47:26]

or your pain and anxiety are really red hot, and you found a place in the middle of that where you can sit still. And if you, at that moment, if you think, I wonder if this is going to last for another minute. At that moment, you'll experience big flames flash up and burn you all around. And you learn that when you're in a lot of pain, and when you're open to a lot of pain, you cannot afford to think of and then what. It's too painful. You learn that way. Then you come back to the present. You realize, well, it's still rough, but I can survive here in the present. This is patience. In the present, you have a capacity to feel your pain. And in that present, the mind of renunciation rises. I think I would be willing to give up and then what? I think I would be willing to give up being strict or being lazy or being a man or being a woman.

[48:36]

I'm willing to give up. Actually, I think I'll give up. Just drop my body and mind. I'd like to. That'd be a good idea. If you're willing to, that's all you've got to do. You've just got to be willing to. It happens all the time, this dropping off. You have to be willing to. How do you get willing? How do you become willing to? By gradually, gently, repeatedly... Entering into your experience, feeling it with your whole body. That's what it can do for us. Any other questions on this now? Nope. Well, then I'll go on to the next phase of the public ceremony, which is confession. We talked about, in Shantideva's presentation of the six perfections, he has chapters on disclosure of evil, or confession.

[49:52]

which he talked about some and may talk about more. I just want to say a little bit more about it in the context of receiving the precepts, which is the same as in the context of receiving the perfections, because the perfections are the same as with bodhisattva precepts. So, confession. Well, you know, what is it? It's just... First of all, just to acknowledge what's happening Just acknowledge what's happening. And particularly also to acknowledge your actions. It's a little different from just feeling your pain. It's that, you know, it's that too. It includes confession. It's a declaration of also just what's happening. But also, it's a confession of action. It's a disclosure of action. Body, speech, and mind. That's the formal side of confession.

[51:01]

The formal, you know, verbal confession, the formal verbal disclosure of your karma, body, speech and mind. Is that witness then? It can be witness or not witness. If it's witness, then there's possibility of reflection. So, formal confession, it's best to practice it all the time, which means you may or may not feel that you have someone else there with you. but you shouldn't arrange to never have anybody with you when you do it. In other words, sometimes it's by yourself, and sometimes it's with another. So Zen practice, in some sense, maybe you've heard this, has these two aspects, and you could think of them in terms of confession. There's intra-psychic confession and interpersonal confession.

[52:06]

So with you just by yourself, you confess, you admit your karma, you notice it, you acknowledge it. And then you go and you confess it interpersonally with another person. Yes? How do you respond if somebody points out what they see as a bad action that you have done, and yet you can't see that it's bad action, but it still troubles you that they see it as a bad action? How do you respond if someone else graciously points out to you your faults? If you really cannot see that it is a fault. Oh, someone points out a fault to you that you don't yet understand is a fault? How do you respond? Is it possible to acknowledge your action at that stage or do you have to see through it first before you can acknowledge it? If someone criticizes something in me and I don't yet understand either that what they're saying is true or that what they're saying is a problem, in both those cases, the practice of confession would be, again, coming now from renunciation, right?

[53:20]

When somebody says, you know, you are a terrible Zen student, of course, I guess that one, you could see that that would be a problem, but wouldn't understand how it applied to yourself, maybe. But anyway, they're saying this thing, you're a bad Zen student. In that case, you can see, well, that would be a problem, I guess, but I don't understand how it applies to me. So, in that case, if you practice renunciation, what do you do with that? Hmm? You don't do anything with it. Well, not quite. A little bit more than nothing. Or a little bit less than nothing. Huh? What? Is that so? Yeah, you say, is that so? In other words, you contemplate, you wonder about it. Well, what's happening today? Thousands of people are telling me I'm a bad Zen student. What is this about? Is this some kind of like surprise birthday party? Yeah, you know. What is the meaning of this? What's this about? That's, you know... In other words, don't meddle.

[54:25]

Here's this external object, right? A sound coming to you in English. English words. You are a terrible blah blah. Don't meddle with it. Now, you said, what if you can see that it is true? Well, I would say, take a step back. And it isn't that it's true... When I review my karma, it isn't that I'm saying, I did this and that, and that's true that I did this and that. No, that's again meddling with it. That's too much. It's rather, I think, I think this way, I thought this way, I spoke this way, this is what I think I said. Someone else may say, you didn't say that. Does that mean they're right? Then again, you're getting into meddling. Now, who is right? Can you stay in the present without like meddling with?

[55:26]

And meddling with means attributing reality to your confession or attributing unreality to what other people are accusing you of. Or what some people do is they switch and they say, what other people are accusing me of, that's reality, but what I think is not true. Both of those are meddling with the thought. How about being able to live with the fact that you think you're pretty good and somebody else is telling you you're pretty bad? How about letting them both be objects of your awareness and don't meddle with them? How about clearly observing that? Clearly, they're telling me that I'm terrible. Listen to that. Or as you're sitting in Zazen, people tell themselves, my Zazen practice stinks. They hear that inside. How about just listening to it? Some people say, my Zazen practice is great. How about just listening to that? Somebody else says to me, your practice is great. How about listening to that? And not attributing reality to it. In other words, don't activate your mind around it. So if someone else points out to me that I have a problem, the thing is, let the word, you've got problems, man, let those words just sit there in their wondrous, radiant, temporary appearance.

[56:38]

And don't meddle with them. Don't manipulate them. Don't tamper. Don't try to fluff them up into supreme reality. Don't try to push them down into the stupidest thing that's been said. Just let it be and wonder at it. Wow, just sit back. When they say you're terrible, just sit there and listen and experience. Also, when they say you're great, do the same. That's what I would recommend when other people say things about you and when you say things about yourself. Now, somebody said, well, if my confessions aren't reality, why should I even make a confession? Yes. What if you experience, whether it's true or not, what they said, where you have a bad Zen student, what if you experience pain as a result of that? What do you do with that? You mean, if I'm sitting in meditation and a thought comes up, I'm a lousy Zen student, what can I do? Or somebody told you, but in any case, you experience pain as a result of hearing that.

[57:44]

Right, right. Hear your question? Everybody hear it? Okay. If you say to me, that I'm a terrible Zen priest, and I feel pain at that, okay? If I think, you know, this is my experience, you check it out for yourself, I usually find that what I just did there, when she said I was a terrible Zen priest, what I did was I meddled with it. And when I meddled with it, it hurt. pain at hearing that you're, when you're being criticized, the pain that you feel from that is that you meddle with it a little bit. Not when he starts to tell me I'm a great Zen priest. Will I experience pain with that? You say, well, that's pretty comfortable to hear that. So before you get to a point where you're absolutely not meddling with it, I mean, it's going to be a surprise when you do meddle with it and you feel some pain. So when you feel that pain, what do you do?

[58:46]

You just sit and meddle with it. Right. Feel the pain, feel the pain. And then again, the pain you feel, the pain I feel when criticized, or the pain I feel when praised, either one. The pain I feel there shows me my attachments, shows me my mind which has an impulse, and makes me more willing to say, this mind that has a boat is not actually my friend. I would be willing to sort of like, of course I'd be willing to like trash it, but I mean I would be willing to like let go of it, which is much harder than trashing it, and much harder than promoting it. Like just, I would be willing to like drop this mind which cares about what people say about me. And the mind which cares about what people say about me is the opposite of the mind which cares about what people say about other people. In a way. Not really. But anyway, if you're only concerned with the welfare of others, and concerned that others are happy, then again, that's the same thing as renouncing this mind of self-concern.

[59:56]

If you're only concerned, primarily and only concerned with the welfare of others, then you're not so afraid of giving up this, and then what, mine. Or, is this true about me, mine? But if that's not enough to give, if you don't have that kind of heat around the welfare of others, then you may need this other kind of heat, which is the heat from feeling the pain of self-concern. So, somebody criticizes me, it hurts to sit in the middle of that pain, You know, if I just wouldn't have cared about myself, that wouldn't have hurt. I think maybe I'll consider dropping this self-concern. And until I get to that point, I'm going to hurt. But if I keep going back there... By the way, in case I didn't mention, all the Buddhas are sitting there too. So when you go to that place, you're going to have some really nice company. It's a really nice club there. Bodhisattva Social Club, sitting in the middle of all the suffering in the world. So it's not just a lonely, you know, cold, you know, kind of like exile. It's a wonderful place there in the middle of the pain.

[60:59]

And the real wish and mind of renunciation will be born there. Yes? Where would, perhaps within something, in that kind of a situation where somebody says something like that to you, If you become concerned with them in the situation, become concerned, are they being heard? Are they being heard? Yeah. By you? They're obviously coming up to you with this issue. Right. They have this stuff. Right. They're coming up to you with some angst. Right. Instead of reacting to it on your... As a reflection of you. Yes. To think about that. Yes. How does... I don't know, but that thought has came into my mind as you were talking, and I'm not sure if that fits yet, but... Yeah, it fits in perfectly.

[62:05]

That's the point, is that you're... You're a bodhisattva, right? You practice renunciation. Now you're practicing confession all the time too. And now somebody comes and maybe says something about you, that they had a problem with something you did. If you're concerned with them, one of the greatest things you can do for them, which is oftentimes all they want is you to listen to them. They don't want any smart comment from you necessarily. They just want to express themselves often and have you, among all people, you hear it. For you to know how what you did was experienced by them. Listening is wonderful to do at that time. And just listen. And kind of like give up being smart at that moment. And just listen. How does this not become a defense? Just listening not become a defense? Um... I mean, when I hear you speaking this way, I'm thinking, I can see this almost being a method to not take seriously what somebody's actually saying, and it becomes a defense.

[63:23]

So, not take seriously what they say. Again, first I presented renunciation, then confession, okay? Not taking seriously what somebody said is, you know, is going against this renunciation. It's, again, attributing not seriousness to what they're saying, unreality to what they're saying. Well, that's just your opinion to what they're saying. If you do any of that, it will hurt. If you're present, you'll notice that hurts. It hurts just when somebody comes up and says something to you, for you to flap back with some words that you think actually apply to what they say, That's meddling, that's activating your mind around the object. Also, just to attribute reality, to say, oh, finally somebody says something true about me. Finally somebody got my number, positive or negative. That's also going too much.

[64:26]

Because it's aggressive. No, it doesn't need to be aggressive, it could be aggressive, but it's just meddling. I know, but I mean, somebody says something to me, and say, You show up late and you're not committed enough. Well, maybe that's true. I mean, it's not that I hate myself because she's right. But it's also true. What is true? Let's say I did not make a commitment. I was being tardy, careless. That was actually, that corresponded to... let's say, my state of mind. I mean, I'm not saying it's a particular situation, but it could be. Like you have a job, you have a job, and you didn't make a commitment to being on time. Yeah, get to the office at 1.15, so I show up at 1.20. And is this a case where, your example, you did not make a commitment to come at 1.15 anyway? No, that was my, let's say, that could have been my commitment.

[65:31]

It should have been my commitment. I had an obligation, let's put it that way. Well, again, you're the one who gets to define this, right? You're coming from your world. Did you make a commitment or not? In your own mind. Whichever example. As I said, this is a hypothetical situation. Yeah, that's what I mean. So you can do whatever you want. Let's be specific about an example. Did you make a commitment or not? Yes, I made a commitment. So if you made a commitment to be on time, and you arrive late, the person says you're late. So what's the problem? I don't know. So then this person says to me, you're late and you were, you have committed, you didn't make a full commitment, because if you had made a full commitment, you would not have been late. No, that's not really so true. If you didn't make a full commitment and then be there at 1.15 and you arrived at 1.20, if you didn't make a full commitment, then if they say you're late, you say, no, I'm not late because I didn't make a full commitment.

[66:42]

I didn't really say I would be here at 1.15. That's a different situation. But if you made a full commitment to be there at 1.15 and you come at 1.20, then if they say you're late, you say, yes, right, I am late. I agree. But, you know, you could also not have made a full commitment. You could say, I didn't make a full commitment. And they could say, you came late. And you could still say, okay, I hear you saying that. And I could go along, I could go along, yeah, I'm late. I might hear that. But this is all determined by your own attitudes and your own commitments. Well, what I'm trying to say, I guess the problem that I'm having here is... That could be very useful, in a certain sense, to hear somebody say, well, this is what actually happened. Yes. And I want to be as receptive to that kind of a useful remote as possible. But in your description a few minutes ago, I could also sense

[67:50]

I can see myself taking what she said, not that I meant it this way, but taking it in the sense that, well, I accept that, but I don't attach myself to it, or I don't meddle with it. But then I also lose the significance of it in doing that. Do you see? Yeah, well... Let me just say a couple other words here about confession to help you not misuse renunciation. I think part of the way he's saying is maybe you could use renunciation as a way to insincerely confess or insincerely receive feedback. You could misunderstand renunciation that way and use renunciation as a defense. That would be what Bodhidharma accused Huayka of.

[68:55]

That would be nihilism. Okay? What you're saying about me does not have inherent reality. Therefore, say whatever you want. That would be nihilism. You know? Everything you people say about me is empty of inherent nature. It's not reality. Therefore, say whatever you want. It doesn't bother me at all. That's nihilism. Okay, so how do you protect from nihilism? How do you not fall into nihilism when you don't attribute reality to what people say to you, nor attribute unreality to what they say to you? How do you not do that? So he said, no words reach it. Including no strategies to defend reach it. Okay? But there is, in confession, there is a quality, I would say, I have three words to help you get what I mean by confession. Three words. Remorse. Regret. and disgust. For me, this is my way of practicing confession.

[69:57]

For me, there is remorse, but not regret, and not disgust. Remorse means to taste again. To re-munch. To munch again on the action. Taste it again. That's for me what confession is about. Taste it again. But taste it. And sometimes it tastes bitter. And sometimes it tastes salty. And sometimes it tastes nauseating. There's various tastes. We have various tastes. I shouldn't say nauseating, actually. Not one of the tastes. Nauseating is too close to disgust. What a lot of people do is they're disgusted with their behavior and disgusted with other people's behavior. Disgust means to spit out, to disgust, to dis-eat, to spit it out.

[71:01]

You admit you did it, but then you have disgust. Therefore, you actually throw it away and say, well, I'm disgusted with it. You don't really let it in when you're disgusted with it. It's like, taste it again. Just taste it. Taste it doesn't mean it's real, unreal. Just feel it. And a lot of times when you taste your karma again, it's bitter. It's salty. It's sour. Sometimes it's sweet. Taste it again. Regret. Regret means again. And regret comes from, you know, it comes from to lament. I think lamenting is a little too much. It's crying over spilt milk kind of thing. I would say a lighter touch. If you're too heavy, you know, the lamenting is better than disgust because you're still hanging in there with it a little bit. But it's a little too much. You can also distract yourself from the actual experience by wailing away. What was I crying about again?

[72:05]

No, no, more quiet. Taste it. Stay quiet with it. Really feel it. Taste it. Hear it. Look at it. Smell it. And of course, smells, you know, many people smell. Smells like a skunk around here. Something's rotten in the state of Denmark. Smell it. Okay? That's a quality of confession, too. And if you practice renunciation, you have to watch out that you don't turn into nihilism. So it isn't that you take things seriously or not seriously. It's that you try to take them as they're coming to you. You watch. If you make a commitment to be on time and then you're late, you taste that again. If you didn't make a commitment to be on time and somebody says it, you see the difference in the quality of each set of conditions.

[73:11]

will give rise to a slightly different experience. Your job is to feel and be present for what's happening and watch to see how this is happening. And if you don't activate your mind around what's happening, it's easier for you to have revelation about what's happening. But, you know, As you said, there's a potential in the situation of being helped by what a person says to you. That means anything anybody ever says to you, you respect. The spirit of compassion is like that. The spirit of confession is anything anybody ever says to you is an opportunity to be helped. But I'm suggesting to you that in the spirit of renunciation, if you really respect Everything anybody says to you, respect means look again.

[74:15]

So when someone tells you you're a lousy bum, look again. Maybe this is a big help. When somebody tells you you are the greatest, look again. Maybe this is a big distraction. Look again, respect this. What is this about? What is happening here? Give everything it says. So, if somebody's criticizing you, saying you're not punctual, you don't have commitment to the job here, listen to that. And not just listen, but respect what you're hearing too. This could be the big moment of your life, what you're hearing now. If you really respect, not so much the person, but the experience. And I would say that this mind that's clearly observing and no words reach, that is a place from which you respect everything. If words reach it, then you respect some people's comments and not others. Like some people respect adults and not children.

[75:19]

Some people respect children and not adults. But if you're in this place of renunciation, you listen to everything everybody says to you with respect. Okay? And that respect protects you from turning renunciation into nihilism. Because nihilism says, things are empty, so what? No. When you're clearly awake, every living being is a domicile. Then it wasn't just nihilism, but it was also dualism. Nihilism and dualism, right. Nihilism is dualistic. And realism is dualistic. But clearly observing stupidity of the unbusy one is non-dual. And the stupid, unbusy person isn't smart enough to figure out who's better than anybody else and therefore respects all beings.

[76:22]

Not in the same way, but with equal reverence and love. Because they can't figure out who to love less. If they could, they would, and part of them can't. David? I want to make a brief pitch for regret. It comes out of just my own experience, but as I think of what you've been saying, it's also, it reflects this not only intra-psychic confession, but inter-personal. At least as I understand regret, as lamentation, there has to be some expression if another person is to witness the confession. You have to say something. So maybe it becomes kind of a quantitative problem. You say it once, maybe you say it twice, maybe you say it once to each member of your family or community or whatever is appropriate, but you don't say it three times or four times.

[77:27]

Or is it Ein Rombauld? When I was willing to grab the unwrong side, I got the unwrong side. I went to the root of the word, you know. I think being sorry, I think being sorry is okay. You know? Not only being sorry, but saying, I'm sorry. I think saying I'm sorry is fine too. And apologizing is definitely good. But apologizing is an expression that comes from confession. It's not actually confession, strictly speaking. But it definitely should be practiced. The Bodhisattvas naturally do that. They apologize when they do something that they taste again and feel the bitterness and harmfulness of it. They apologize. They say, yeah, I really feel bad.

[78:32]

I feel bitter and sour about the fact that I got angry with you yesterday. That's how I feel. I'm sorry I was angry. I'm really sorry. That's what they would say. Not really lamentation, but maybe it is. But the confession itself is not lamentation. The confession is just purely recognizing what it is. If after recognizing you want to lament, then maybe that would be fine. I'm just saying, to me, that expression should wait until after you admit. The expression that follows from the confession of saying you're sorry and lamenting over your mistake and shortcoming. That's different from, that's an expression of following up from. But the remorse, I think, is closer to the core of confession. Okay, so does that make sense? That lamentation is more like a follow-up than the essence of the confession process.

[79:35]

Thank you, that was helpful. I think Charlie and... I just want to ask all these people, this wall's a hot wall here, what's over there? Real quick, I'll get to what you were just saying, because I think I've got this note in here, and maybe it was from Norman's class, who'd gone in the other day, and he wrote about regret. He had something about regret as opposed to guilt, and I wrote down, guilt is about I, it's self-centered, and regret is about you and other souls. And in terms of this idea of thinking of the other person first, and then this time, there is also exactly how much to get into that, you know, regret when that... I would say, let's get into this a little bit. Let's explore these words, you know, and get into these feelings of regret.

[80:35]

Remorse, I'm sorry, apology. This is the realm surrounding the practice of confession. So Bodhisattva has entered this world of confession which has, you know, guilt flying around there someplace. What's the proper relationship to the word guilt, to these words? Guilt, regret, remorse, apology, I'm sorry, lamentation. All these words are flying around all the time. And when you go to the word confession, those perk up a little bit. Let's look at these words. Let's discuss these words. This would be good words for you to discuss in your small groups. Charlie and Judith? So to avoid attributing inherent existence or falling into nihilism, could you say that confession is studying the dependent co-arising of what's karma? If you're ready to study dependent co-arising, then you won't fall into nihilism or realism. And you'll come back, I think, with the most help.

[81:39]

You will be helped most by the recognition of your karma, and you will be the most helpful from that place. Yes. Judith? I just had that regret is not letting go of the confessions or the apology, like holding on to the past. He felt that word has a little bit of that connotation. Yeah, I think it does. I think it has that connotation too. So that's the trick. How can we get in there and own up to what we did without holding back a little bit? Like people come often to talk to me and I sometimes find myself almost saying it too. They come and they say, I'm sorry I'm a little late. And I often get, how come you said little?

[82:42]

I don't usually say it, but why say little? I mean, if you're going to all the trouble to say, sorry, I'm late, why add little? You know, so, or I sort of made a mistake there. I was a little and how, who needs a little puppy? Anyway, without taking away or adding a little bit too much to it. How can we admit our karma just right on the mark, just what it is, without activating the mind around it? Well, then letting it go. Yeah, and letting it go is what happens to it if you don't know it. How can we get in there and bring something up and let it fulfill itself and then watch it go? That's the trick. What a lot of people do is... Because it's so hard to admit what we do in that skillful way, they stay away from the whole area. If you confess for something, if you confess something and do it halfway, you sometimes get punished for it. And if it's an overdo, you punish yourself.

[83:47]

So a lot of people, because it's such a bristly, intense area of confession of shortcomings and faults, our own, it's the only kind we're talking about now, because of that, A lot of people stay away from the whole field of confession because it's so fraught with negative connotation and fear and bad memories and all that stuff. So I'm inviting us to go as bodhisattvas into that field again and start practicing confession. And try to do it in a way that we gradually find that upright, gentle, harmonious way of doing it. It's hard. I don't know, I was thinking more with regret that it's once, like even if you confess, that then you attach to it again. Yeah, it's possible, right. Yeah, so some people say, if that's going to happen, I'm not going to bring it up, right? So it's dangerous stuff, this recognition of our past errors.

[84:53]

It's dangerous stuff. It's more dangerous to deny it, I would say, generally. And when you first start handling it, you may get hurt by handling this material unskillfully. But that's how you get skillful, is learning how to handle this. And it's tough. It's hard to learn how to do it. Yes? I guess I'm confused. Between how you go from not meddling to saying I'm sorrow. Maybe if you... Maybe there are different steps, but somehow when I hear you say not meddling, I hear you saying not meddling is about not trying to figure out what's right. Exactly. Well, not meddling means that as a human being, you and I live in the middle of intense dialogues of trying to figure out what's right. either in our own mind or all around us. People are talking, oh, what's right, what's right, what's wrong?

[85:54]

All the time, it's all around us, okay? Not meddling means that when those discussions of right and wrong come up, you don't activate your mind around them. You don't activate your mind in relationship to the words which are discussing right and wrong. Okay? So then what is this leap to be, if I'm trying to do that, what is this leap then for somebody to say something to me and me to respond to that in such a way that I say, if somebody says, you know, just some criticism of something you did. And so then you say, oh, I'm sorry. Isn't there a you're right there? Or can you say an I'm sorry where there's not a you're right? Yes. Or I'm not. So what are you saying? What is sorry? What is sorry? So what do you think it is? If it comes from this place, what is it? I guess the only thing I can think of is you're hurt. And so you're making some expression to what you're... Or I'm hurt.

[86:59]

I'm hurt. Yeah, sometimes I might get angry at somebody. They might not feel hurt. And they might not even come to say anything to me. But later I feel lousy. So I'm sorry means, could mean, I'm hurting. So I could go and say, you know, I'm hurting over what I said to you yesterday. But that's not activating your mind around. It doesn't need to be. It has to be the case that bodhisattvas from this place of a mind that has no abode can talk. And what do they say? If the mind has no abode, what would they say? Same thing, they'd say, but the mind didn't. No. No, but they could say anything that the mind of a Bodhi can say. And it would be completely different. But they can say anything. Because their mind has no Bodhi, they can go around and say, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I'm sorry.

[88:02]

And they could mean it, and it totally feels sorry. And have no attachment to that, and feel it more deeply... than people who really think it's true or something, or false. This, I'm sorry, comes from, you know, complete sincerity. And then they can't remember what they said a second later. And they were totally meant it. And it's all cleared. And now they're ready to say, I'm glad to see you, or whatever. Anything can come from this place. That's the point. This is the place of freedom. This is a place where you can help people. And sometimes you meet people and you're just a puppet in a way. You just go, I'm sorry. I love you. What can I do for you? You know, I'm in pain. This kind of stuff comes flowing out of the Bodhisattva. All kinds of songs and dances. Totally in terms of the situation. All things coming forward. Boom. Bodhisattva goes, I'm sorry.

[89:03]

Bodhisattvas can even say I hate you but this I hate you is not their I hate you this is the I hate you of all dharmas coming forward and realizing them as I hate you and that liberates beings that I hate you that's just exactly what's helpful in that situation and so many Zen stories are about teachers saying I hate you and the monk waking up Because they're coming from this place where they are not inhabiting or abiding in I, hate, or you. It's just pure, you know, skillful love. And sometimes they say, I'm sorry. And sometimes they say, it's so miserable. And sometimes they say, blind ass, and so on. All these expressions coming out of this mind, this compassionate mind, this loving mind which has no abode. And sometimes what it has to be, it cannot skip over, these bodhisattvas do not, they are not, what do you call it, immune, exempt from the ordinary practice of confession.

[90:18]

That's the ordination ceremony. The ordination ceremony is, okay, you have these compassionate beings, these fantastic compassionate beings, and they have to practice confession. And they say, I will practice confession even after I attain complete perfect Buddhahood. they will still be in the soup with everybody else going, I'm sorry, I'm in pain, I did this, I did that. They play that game, they sing those songs, they do those dances with all beings from a place of renunciation, a place of compassion, and while they're speaking with complete sincerity and complete devotion and complete respect, they also realize the lack of inherent existence of what they're doing, which allows them to be full-hearted, They do not skip over confession, even though they really have nothing to confess. And it's because they understand, when we understand that we have nothing to confess and that we are nothing other than who we're confessing to, then our confession is really, really good.

[91:30]

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