May I speak about the issue of being a disciple? He is in the expression, my disciples at Tassajara, and during a talk, and afterwards I asked him about it. Have you heard that story? No? You want to hear it? Linda's heard it, right? Should I tell it again? Once upon a time, 44 years and one month ago, I was at Tassajara and the founder of Tassajara was giving a talk about his disciples.

[01:02]

My disciples, blah, blah, I don't remember. But when he said it, I thought, I wonder who his disciples are. So after the talk, I said, Roshi, you mentioned your disciples in the talk. And he said something like, I don't like this, but this is the way my mind works. It sees two kinds of students at Tassajara. One kind are here just for themselves. The other kind are here to help others. Those are my disciples. So I asked him about it, what it was, and then he told me that.

[02:03]

But I didn't know which category I belonged in. I wondered. And I continued to wonder. I think I wanted to be his disciple, but I never actually knew, and I don't know now if I am. He said to me one time, you are my disciple. But even though he said that, I still don't. It's not like I didn't believe that he said that.

[03:13]

And it's not like I didn't believe that he was a full opportunity. for non-grasping. I kind of felt this nice feeling when he said it, but I wasn't sure that I should, what do you call it, go for that bait. So even though he said it one time, I still don't know if I am Can you hear that? I don't. And I still... I would also like to be a disciple of Dung Shan. I have attained the state of half agreeing with Suzuki...

[04:19]

Some of the stuff that I read and certainly some of the stuff people tell me, I half agree with and half don't. Or I don't agree with or I do. But on the average, about half, maybe more than half. Anyway, I still want to be his disciple. And I also... Did you hear the story about one time he gave a lecture and said he wasn't enlightened? Did you hear that one? A little bit. A little bit? Want to hear it again? One day he... When he was giving a talk at Sokoji Temple over in Japan Town before he moved over to 300 Page Street, he said, I'm not enlightened. But I still wanted to be his disciple. Now you might say, well, if you're not enlightened, you are. but I didn't even know if I wasn't enlightened.

[05:24]

I thought maybe I wasn't. But anyway, I did want to be, and I do want to be his disciple, but I don't know if I am. The next day? The next day was about a week or so later. And he said, in another talk, he said, I am Buddha. And I thought, Good. That's better. But still I didn't know. I wasn't thinking in terms of am I his disciple or not. I actually didn't think of it until he said it. Like, who his disciples were. I think I wanted to be with him in such a way that he would realize that I'm there. just in case he wanted to offer me something.

[06:27]

I put myself in his life so that he wouldn't miss me, just in case he wanted to offer me something. I wasn't exactly trying to get something, but I knew I needed something. So I put myself in a position so that if he thought I needed something, he could give it to me. And I could tell after a while he knew I was there. Partly because he would try not to run into me. Maneuvering around me so I could tell he knew I was there. Kind of like a cloud chamber kind of a thing. And I don't know if I... am or was his disciple, but I think he appreciated, you know, in his way, sort of like, I think he appreciated that I was, I was like making myself a part of his life. I think that, I think he really appreciated that.

[07:35]

I think he wanted more people to do it. And I don't know the reasons why I got the chance to put myself in a place where he would see me and have to deal with me. But it happened. It seemed like it happened. And then since I knew he was there, if he didn't pay attention to me, I knew it was because, not because he didn't know I was there, but because he didn't pay attention to something else. So then I could deal with that. It wasn't like, well, he might have said something to me if he knew I was there, but he didn't know I was there. No, he knew I was there. And then I could see how I related to me, because I was there to relate to.

[08:46]

One of Suzuki Roshi's teachers was his second teacher. he became a successor to. His second main teacher, he didn't become a successor to, but he studied with him for a long time. His first teacher was Gyokujun Son Daisho. And he lived in the same temple with him when he was a young boy until Gyokujun Son died. Well, actually, Joko Jonson moved out of the temple and went to another temple to become the abbot. And Suzuki Roshi stayed in that temple and became the abbot of his teacher's temple. So they weren't living together to the end of Joko Jonson's life. But they lived together for a big part of Suzuki Roshi's young years. Then after Gokujin Son died, Suzuki Roshi studied with a teacher who lived nearby his temple named Kishizawa Iyan Roshi.

[10:07]

Kishizawa Iyan Roshi, a noted scholar of the Treasury of True Dharma Eyes by the ancestor Ehe Dogen. So in English we call his most original work, which he wrote in Japanese, we call it the Treasury of True Dharma Eyes or Shōbō Genzō. And Kichizawa Ion, Suzuki Rishi's second main teacher, was a scholar. of that, a great scholar of that extensive text, Treasury of Truth. Kishisau Iyan also was a scholar of the traditional ceremonies to practice intimate entrustment.

[11:18]

There are ceremonies Intimate entrustment. For example, we have the ceremony of going into the room, going into the teacher's room and meeting the teacher. That's one of our ceremonies. And sometimes we call that ceremony going into the room. And sometimes we call that ceremony dokusan. And doku means alone or solitary. In this case, it means meeting. So it's a meeting alone or it's a solitary meeting. So it could be understood as that you're going into the teacher's room and meeting the teacher alone. Or another understanding, you're going in there and one person there

[12:21]

you and the teacher as one person. So we do that ceremony of intimate entrustment of the teaching of suchness where there's two people who are one. Another ceremony which is also done going into the room, is a ceremony called, of transmitting the Dharma. And Kishisawa Iyan was an expert on the traditional procedures. And is certain documents, and in one of the documents there's a diagram, and the diagram says, the iron person lives here. The iron person is somebody who walks along the iron path, which is thousands of miles long.

[13:32]

And the iron person, no matter what happens, they keep going along the bodhisattva path. They don't give up, no matter how difficult it is. They keep going on the path of liberating all beings. So, Suzuki Roshi's second teacher, Kishizawa Iyan, heard his teachers teaching about this iron person. Now, his teacher said to him on occasion, you are not my disciple. And do you know what Kishisawa Ion said when he said, you're not my disciple?

[14:36]

Do you know what he said?

[14:39]

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