Earlier in this retreat, I asked the question, echoing the scripture, if a bodhisattva wishes to cultivate the heroic stride samadhi, what dharmas, what things should she cultivate? And the Buddha answers that if a bodhisattva wishes to realize this samadhi, he should cultivate the dharmas of an ordinary person.

[01:01]

If he sees that the dharmas of an ordinary person are neither united with nor separate from the dharmas of a Buddha, then he is cultivating the heroic stride samadhi. However, we may not yet see, we may not yet understand fully that the things of an ordinary person, the things of ordinary people, are neither joined nor disjoined from the things of the Buddhas. When we see that, then we're cultivating the samadhi.

[02:15]

In a sense, before we see it, when we're cultivating the things of an ordinary person, we're kind of preparing for cultivating the samadhi. But if we're taking care of the things of an ordinary person, still, without understanding that the things of an ordinary person are not united with the things of a Buddha, nor are they separate, even if we don't understand it, they still are not united and not separate. This is a fact, according to this samadhi. So, when an ordinary person is cultivating the samadhi, he is cultivating the samadhi

[04:01]

of a person who sits in an ordinary way, this phenomena of sitting is not joined to nor separate from the things of a Buddha. The person sitting is not apart from the sitting of a Buddha.

[05:10]

The person sitting is not apart from the walking and talking of a Buddha. Now, if a person is not sitting, if a person is standing or walking, this standing person or this walking person is also not apart from the standing and walking of a Buddha. There are no walking Buddhas apart from our walking. There are no walking Buddhas apart from our walking.

[06:30]

There are no walking Buddhas apart from our walking. There are no walking Buddhas apart from our walking. There are no walking Buddhas apart from our walking.

[08:00]

There are no walking Buddhas apart from our walking. How do we understand, how do we penetrate the fact that the things of an ordinary person are not united or separate from the things of a Buddha? We do it by practicing the things of an ordinary person. In our daily activity, which during this week is sitting in this room quite a bit,

[09:35]

walking around the temple grounds, and other activities, these activities, these ordinary activities, they are done with a grandmotherly mindfulness. I want to take care of the Buddha, the things of a Buddha, by these ordinary activities. Whether I take care of these things of the Buddha, whether I'm mindful in all my activities, to take care of the things of a Buddha at the same time, whether I'm mindful of that or not,

[10:50]

the things of the Buddha are not separate from what I'm doing, nor are they joined. They are not other than my activity, and now my activity is not it. And I take care of this, and this is the Buddha way. Although the Buddha and the Buddha way are perfect and all-pervading, still, unless you take care of it, unless you take care of it, there is no Buddha way.

[11:51]

It's not like you don't take care of it, and somebody else here takes care of it, so there is a Buddha way someplace. The only way the Buddha way lives fully is if you take care of it in this dynamic, wholehearted way, with the understanding, while you're doing whatever you're doing, that there's no kind of wonderful Buddha someplace else. People talk about the wonderful Buddha, and they're totally sincere sometimes, and they even know what they're talking about. But that's not, there's no such thing separate from turning this page of the scripture,

[13:13]

and turning it back again. When you take care of paper like that, that's the Buddha way. If you don't, there's no other Buddha way. And at that moment, the Buddha way perishes, but the Buddha way is also, like all things, not annihilated, so you get another chance each moment. So, we can take care of our moment-by-moment activity with this mindfulness. Sometimes we say like taking care of our own eyes, but even more than your own eyes,

[14:21]

taking care of the eyes of your grandchildren, taking care of the most precious thing gives us a hint of what it's like to take care of our activity, to make sure that we are wholeheartedly mindful of how our activity is helping the Buddha way live. Our activity is given 100% only to that. Even though the way is all-pervasive and perfect, it does not live unless we practice, and there's no Buddha way other than the practice, even though our practice is pretty puny a lot of the time.

[15:24]

We're just doing some little puny thing, but if we do it with this attitude, there's no other practice. So, this puny practice is the place where the Buddha way is now thriving. Last time I talked to her on Sunday, I talked about my grandson, and my daughter heard about it, and she said, What did you say? Tell me what you said. And I just couldn't remember. She doesn't get to hear all these stories about her kid. So, anyway, I told you... No, I didn't tell you, I told you about Sunday afternoon, when we were down in the garden,

[16:26]

we're coming back up to the garden, and Risa says, What's that? And he says, she points to the statue of Avalokiteshvara on the road, the garden road, and he says, Buddha. And we said to him, Do you want to bow to the Buddha? And he said, No. He started bowing early at the dinner table, and he does bow every now and then. He may come to service this week, you can see. But anyway, he said, No. So I bowed, just standing there on the road, I bowed, and he watched me. I wasn't in a very good bow, in a way, just a kind of...

[17:32]

standing there on the road, little old bow to the Bodhisattva. And then I walked away, then he bowed. And so then I came back and joined him bowing. This grandmotherly attention to our daily activity makes our daily activity into monastic training. Right now, if people looking into this room would see us, and see us through the rest of the day,

[18:36]

some of them would think we're doing monastic ceremonies. Monastic ceremonies of sitting in a traditional yogic posture, facing a wall or a floor, together with others. It's a monastic training. Training one thing. Training one thing. We call it the Buddha way or the middle way. You're training, you're working together, you're helping others learn the Buddha way by learning about themselves, about their activity, and learning about whether they are mindful of taking care of the Buddha way through their activity, or making their activity the Buddha way.

[19:36]

Are we learning to do that? And are we learning that we have a little thought in our mind that there's something else besides, that there's some other Buddhism besides our activity. And that old story at the end, that's quoted at the end of the Genjo Koan, about Bao Che fanning himself. The monk comes up to him and says, the nature of wind is that it's permanent and reaches out to the wind, and reaches everywhere. So why do you fan yourself, Master? And Bao Che said, you understand that the nature of wind is permanent,

[20:39]

but you don't understand that it reaches everywhere. What is the meaning of it reaching everywhere? And Bao Che fanned himself. The Buddha way is all pervasive and perfect, and it reaches everywhere. And when it reaches everywhere, you practice. And when it reaches everywhere, and you don't practice, you don't realize that it's reaching everywhere. But it does reach everywhere. So you do practice. You are practicing. But if you don't be mindful of this, you don't understand that it reaches everywhere.

[21:43]

But it does. You can't do anything to stop it from reaching everywhere, and you can't do anything to make it reach everywhere. It already does. But if you don't do this thing called practice, which you don't do because it's already happening, if you don't give yourself to the practice which is already occurring, to the Buddha way which is already reaching the world as your activity, then you are already. Now some of you are sitting cross-legged, and others are sitting knee-holding legged. And in some monasteries,

[22:46]

you're not supposed to do that during lectures. You're supposed to sit cross-legged during the lecture in full lotus. But even if you're not sitting in full lotus, the Buddha way is permanent and all-pervading. It's reaching your posture. But are you grandmotherly caring for your posture as the way the Buddha Dharma is reaching the world now? If you are, then you understand how it reaches. Now how does this practice

[24:14]

kind of talk relate to another kind of talk which has been going around? The kind of talk of meet whatever comes with complete relaxation. And then, if we can relax, we have a chance to play with whatever is happening. How does this relate to, for example, you're involved in some daily activity, and you relax while you're involved in the daily activity. Daily activity of breathing, sensing pain or pleasure, sitting up straight,

[25:14]

thinking many thoughts. How does relaxing in the midst of such phenomena and thereby being able to enter into playfulness with it, how does it relate to this grandmotherly heart, to this grandfatherly, grandmotherly mindfulness? Do you see how they relate? In play,

[26:17]

we have a chance to see how the way we are made, we have a chance to see how we dependently co-arise. In play, seeing dependent co-arising, we see the Buddhas together transmitting the inconceivable Dharma. Playing freely in this samadhi, playing freely, being relaxed and playing freely in this samadhi of an ordinary person who is not separate from

[27:21]

or united with the Buddhas. The Buddhas together are not separate from or united with each other. They are transmitting inconceivable Dharma together. And they send word of their activity to us I'm a messenger from them telling you what they're up to right now. They're entering into and playing in their non-separation and non-joining

[28:26]

with each other and with us. You've got some daily activities, no shortage of those. Now we make them into monastic exercises by wholeheartedly devoting ourselves to having them be our way to enter this transcendental space of transmission of the Dharma. And my words are

[29:29]

offered as a resource for you to feel permitted to relax and be playful with the things of an ordinary person. Cultivating the things of an ordinary person in a relaxed and playful way help us penetrate into their non-separation and non-joining with the Buddha things. But do you need anything else so that you may relax and enter? Do you lack any resource that would make you dare to relax and play

[30:32]

in this samadhi? If you do, please say so, maybe we can find it. If you don't, then you're all set. And you can just sit, just stand, and see that this ordinary activity is intimately related with the Buddha activity.

[31:35]

And again, intimate means it's not intimate to be separate and it's not intimate to be joined. Intimacy is neither. It's already going on. What do you need to enter? Yes? I can certainly understand why intimacy is not separate, but I don't understand why intimacy is not joined. Yes. Okay. If you would like tie yourself to somebody else, okay? So, you know, I don't know,

[32:38]

the rope or whatever could be various lengths, but if you would tie yourself to them, that would help you understand how that's not intimacy. So being bound to somebody might help you understand that being bound to them is not the intimacy. Can you see how that might occur? I can see that if you were bound to somebody, you could either be intimate with them or not, depending on your attitude. Well, we are intimate with the Buddhas. That's not an option. Okay? The intimacy is already the fact. Okay? So, not being separate from them, that makes sense to you, that that's not, that that would go with intimacy. But what you don't understand is that if you were joined with them, that you don't understand how that wouldn't be intimacy. Hmm? That's right.

[33:40]

I still don't understand. Yeah. The intimacy is not like what they call it, it's not a bond. I mean, it's not a bond like a chain or a rope. It's not that kind of bond. But if you are chained to somebody or roped to somebody, you would find, you would discover your bond in the process, and it wouldn't be the rope. Do you understand? If you were bound... Like if you tied yourself to somebody here for a while, the rope is not your bond. It's not the way you're actually intimate with each other. But the rope might help you find that. That's why getting together in a situation like this where we agree to some precepts might help us realize our actual, you know, intimacy.

[34:40]

But it's not because we're tied together. It's because we're interdependent. And a rope might help you realize how interdependent you are with somebody. When they want to go to the bathroom, you have to go to the bathroom. And it would help if they would tell you that they were going to go, so you can get ready to move. And then you have to, you know, figure out what to do when you get there, and so on. But the rope isn't the joining, the joining of you isn't the intimacy. The rope or the joining would be easy. The intimacy would be rather challenging, because it's so dynamic. Are there two things in intimacy, or just one? Are there two things in intimacy? There's just one. What is it? What's the one thing in intimacy?

[35:42]

Detachment. Detachment. Congratulations. Yeah, there's detachment in intimacy. Is that surprising to you? A little. A little? Getting used to it? I would have said relationship or love. Relationship or love. So, there's some people who we have a relationship with, and so the proposal is that among the relationships you have, the ones that are intimate are the ones that don't have attachment. Attachment.

[36:48]

And the ones where there is attachment, attachment is being pointed to as obscuring the intimacy. But obscuring the intimacy can also tip us off to the intimacy. So, is the joined situation an attachment? Pardon? If you are joined, there's attachment. Yeah, kind of. If you're joined, there's kind of attachment. So, we're not joined to the Buddhas, but we're not separate from the Buddhas. Also, we say, what is it, turning away and touching are both wrong. Touching the Buddha is wrong. Turning away, those aren't our true relationship, our true relationship is neither, for it's like a mass of fire.

[37:48]

But, how do you have the proper relationship with this mass of fire? Neither separate nor conjoined. Tenso? Temporary tenso? What? Spontaneous presence? Yeah. Spontaneous, non-attachment. Did you say detachment, by the way? Did you say detachment? No, non-attachment. Non-attachment. Did you say non-attachment? No. What did you say? I said detachment. Let's change to non-attachment, please. Okay? Yes? I'm just trying to get the difference. Between D and non? Like it's not there, okay. D is a little coarse.

[38:52]

So, non-attachment is spontaneous presence. There is one dynamic, though, in relationships. Detachment usually does come up and then you let it go by detaching. It's not just non-attachment on its own. That's how I find my life. Participatory non-attachment. Yeah. Wholehearted attention to the non-attachment of our relationships. Again, it was like with my grandson. I pay a lot of attention to non-attachment with him. It's a big issue. Especially when he's around. Like I went to say goodbye to him the other day. He was... I was going to... I don't know where I was going. Anyway, he was still in bed. He just woke up.

[39:53]

I was going to do some kind of Buddhist thing. So I went to kiss him goodbye and he pushed me away. Yeah. So where is the intimacy at that time? It's there. The intimacy is there. Now where is it? Yeah. Now some grandmothers are out to get kisses. It's true. But this grandmotherly mind is the mind that wants to kiss the grandson goodbye and take care of the Buddha at the same time.

[40:56]

And it's there. How do we enter? Is there a hand over there? Just one? Could you raise the other one too? Yes? Which one? Neither. You feel that if you confess your attachment that that helps to develop intimacy? Sounds pretty good. But

[42:13]

you know the other day I was talking with some people about what codependence is and I was kind of saying that it seems like if you confess your addiction to somebody or if you're with somebody who has some addiction that they're involved in and you tell them that you feel that they're involved in that and you have trouble with it then you don't have a codependent relationship. But someone pointed out that you still could be up to some kind of secret business there. So you've got to be careful when you confess your attachment particularly like if you confess your attachment to a Zen teacher you might actually be confessing your attachment to get something from the teacher. Like, oh you're a good confessor. So there still might be some and they used the word

[43:15]

I believe collusion even in honestly acknowledging the addiction. And then we looked up the word collusion and the root of the word collusion is to play together. But the denotative meaning of collusion is to conspire in secret. So we're actually breathing together living together with the Buddhas and with each other. But when we're in collusion we're being secret about how we're playing. So confessing our attachments a good start and is there any hidden play there? So if we can disclose fully

[44:16]

our playfulness and admit our lack of playfulness which is attachment controlling trying to get some outcome then I think the confession would be even more intimate. How is not playing controlling? How is controlling not playing? You're not playing when you're trying to when you're trying to achieve an end. But if something's, let's say, addictive

[45:19]

If something's addictive? Right. You mean if you're using something to as an It could be a relationship or the secret playfulness that you talk about. Yes. If that play gets stopped how is that by what you just said it could mean that it was controlling? If you stop a certain situation that is not healthy. If you stop a certain situation which is not healthy yes, then what? So how is that? You used the word codependent control along with play and relaxation. I'm trying to understand how that all works. I'm confused. The way you were just talking was kind of playful.

[46:24]

The way when you relax with the situation of, for example you know, hiding the playfulness of the relationship So let's say we're not admitting how we're playing and we're using the relationship or, for example to get some result to maintain some program like maintain the program of I'm an alcoholic or maintain a program of I'm a good wife or a good husband. These are certain programs we might be trying to maintain by not admitting how we're playing this game with somebody. And when we relax and start to become playful we listen up the deceit and start to get in touch with the playfulness of the situation

[47:37]

and as we get in touch with the playfulness of the situation our roles start to deteriorate and the one who is the addict and the one who is the supporter both things start to become undermined and actually you've got to be relaxed because this is very dynamic this kind of change this situation is changing your sense of the world your sense of the world is demonstrating its impermanence to you your inner sense and your outer sense start to move and change So, how do you mean by play? How do you mean by play? Well

[48:42]

it's not exactly I can say what play is but it's the way we act it's the way we act it's the way we start to notice we are when we relax and certain things start happening like we start getting surprised and we start we become very we start feeling more and more vulnerable we start to feel the precariousness of our world we start to feel the precariousness of our sense of what's going on and what the external world is and there's activity in this place and it's the way we are when we're between

[49:48]

the way we usually figure out how we are so if you ask me to say what play is then if I respond to you to give you a better idea of it then I'm putting you in the bleachers of the playground because the play actually happens between your sense of what play is and my sense of what play is and what I say play is and you hear about and understand and check with me and then I say yes that's right so then we have this shared idea of what play is plus we have our own individual ideas about what play is but all that is not play that's just your ideas my ideas and some shared idea isn't play spontaneous? it's not about checking out yes and you just asked me what it was

[50:51]

you just tried to check it out which is fine and I'm telling you that I hesitate to say what it is I'm more just saying where it can happen and how it can happen we don't have to say how it happens also to ask what is love? we don't have to say what it is we're trying to set up the situation for it what is intimacy? we're trying to set up the situation for it intimacy with the Buddha how do we set up the situation for it? well there's some hints not conjoined and not separate not my idea not your idea and not our idea so we have some shared ideas about what Buddha is we could like establish them like is Buddha compassion? what do you say folks? yeah so okay we got that down is Buddha wise? is Buddha skillful?

[51:54]

sure somebody disagrees? okay we don't agree but at least we got the wisdom and compassion down is Buddha tall? is Buddha short? is Buddha 16 feet tall? does Buddha have a golden body? we agree oh that's Buddha but each of us has our own sense of it which nobody else agrees with these are the this is the set up we have an inner reality you have an inner reality she has an inner reality she has an inner reality she has an inner reality he has an inner reality I have an inner reality he has an inner reality and we have shared realities like probably most of us would agree we're in The play is giving up, let go of, relax with the zendo, relax with your inner sense.

[52:57]

Play can happen in that space between when you relax with your realities, and that's where intimacy happens, because when you start to play, if you can play with somebody else, you start to realize creativity of your relationship, and there's where the intimacy is, which you can call love, too, if you want to. But love sometimes means attachment to some people. Does that make any sense? Yeah? Earlier you said, you asked us if there was any resource we lacked for experiencing things in a more human person, in a playfully relaxed way. Yes. And I thought that it seems like authentic experience of play relaxed, playful and relaxed,

[54:12]

playful and relaxed experience, you need to have some sort of sustained experience of that, and that could be lacking, if you've got a lifetime of conditioning of not playful and not relaxed. Yes, yes. So you've got a resource to suggest for that. Yeah, so if you haven't been able to relax, as far as you can tell, and haven't been able to play, then what does a person like that need in order to be able to relax? Well, they need somebody to, I think, come and, somebody who knows how to play, to come and meet them. But the person who knows how to play won't necessarily be able to teach them how to play in one lesson.

[55:15]

But they do need to meet. So you need to meet somebody who wants to meet you. And then the question is, when you're with the person, do you feel, by meeting them, that there's anything that they could do that would help you relax? And if you can't meet them, is there anything that would help you go to meet them? So right now, for example, you're kind of meeting me and a bunch of other people. Is there anything you need to relax right now? The attention off of me. The attention off of you? Would be very helpful. It would help you relax? Yes. Okay. The attention is now off her.

[56:23]

Yes? I had another question. If one has a relationship of love with anything, whether it be another person or an activity or something one cares deeply about, and that might be a very non-attached kind of love, a selfless love, but still if that thing, if you lose that thing or that person dies, you suffer. And I guess I've tried to understand how one can have non-attachment in relationships, certainly, but do we only suffer because we're attached and we shouldn't have been attached? I'm not saying you shouldn't be the way you are. And I haven't heard Buddha say you shouldn't be the way you are. But just that when you're this way you suffer and when you're that way you don't. I haven't heard a Buddha suffering when someone dies.

[57:27]

I do hear a Buddha suffering when someone who's dying suffers while they're dying. Buddha shares your suffering, but Buddha doesn't suffer because of the same reasons that you're suffering. But Buddha shares your suffering. So the Buddha, basically, when the Buddha sees you, the Buddha says, Welcome. And when you leave, the Buddha says, Welcome. You're well gone. Nice going. Mentally and physically, if you just stay near something for a while, particularly physically, some part of your body, probably, something in your body starts to associate with the thing.

[58:34]

Like some people, you know, when they change milkman or something, they get upset. So, the Buddha does not grieve people dying. Because the Buddha hasn't lost them. The Buddha hasn't lost them and the Buddha didn't gain them. When the Buddha met them, the Buddha didn't get something. And when the Buddha became Buddha, Buddha didn't get something. Buddha is basically understanding that we don't get anything, that there's nothing to get. And that understanding that there's nothing to get is not separate from the people who think there's something to get. So the people who think there's something to get are intimate with the understanding that there's nothing to get.

[59:42]

We who think there's something to get and something to lose, we are intimate with the understanding that there's nothing to get and nothing to lose. And for us, grieving helps us get ready to be intimate with not getting anything and not losing anything. So grieving is medicine for those who don't see their actual intimacy with not gaining, not getting, and not losing. But we're never going to get any closer or farther from non-gain and non-loss. We're always intimate with it in this dynamic way. Intimacy is very dynamic. It's none of the possible relations we can imagine. But if we're healthy, we have the medicine of grief to antidote our attachment to what

[60:57]

is gone. Buddha is not attached to what appears to have gone. Questioner says, but you said the Buddha suffers with us when we suffer, so the Buddha can suffer in his compassion. The Buddha is intimate with our suffering. The Buddha intimately suffers with us, more intimately than some other people who are very close to us and who think they got something when they met us, and who are afraid of losing us in our suffering, or who are afraid, maybe who are attached to our happy self and have

[61:57]

trouble with our sad, our unhappy self, our sick self. But they do love us, they are attached to us, we're very important to them, but they're not intimate with us, and that's part of what's frightening about intimacy is that we if we get intimate with someone, we notice that we wouldn't grieve the person going away. We wouldn't grieve this lovely young person becoming old. We would let the person grow old. We wouldn't grieve this person going, we shouldn't say we wouldn't grieve, we're not attached to this person not going insane. We will be intimate with them no matter what they go into, no matter what they change, how they change, we will be devoted to that manifestation.

[63:01]

And in being, so we're devoted to the person, but we're actually primarily devoted to the Buddha in this relationship. Now as an ordinary person we have these habits, which are that we sometimes seem to be almost more devoted to the appearance of this person than realizing the Buddha in the relationship. So we confess that. But we're trying to learn to be devoted to intimacy rather than attached to the appearance, and we're somewhat afraid of that. Even though we have some positive regard for the idea of intimacy, that doesn't mean that

[64:04]

we would actually contemplate being a person who would be up for whatever the person became and be up for the cessation of their current appearance. The ordinary person has a lot of trouble with that. The ordinary person has a lot of trouble with the child, your child, getting a scratch on their cheek. It's very difficult, rather than being intimate with them now. And we say, well, how am I going to protect the child from having the scratch on the cheek? Well, anyway, people seem to already know about that root.

[65:17]

That's the ordinary root. That's the ordinary person who's trying to figure out how you're going to protect your children from getting scratches on their cheek. And someone said, well, can Buddha protect people from getting scratches on their cheeks? And I don't say, yes, they can, and I don't say, no, they can't. I say, Buddha is to be intimate with people, and if they're getting scratches on their cheek, to be intimate with them, that's the Buddha part. Buddha is not engineering the world, as you can see, to prevent people from getting scratches. People are getting scratches, to various degrees. Sometimes people get scratched out. Buddha does not prevent this.

[66:18]

Buddha is not controlling the creation of the universe. Buddha is teaching how to see creativity and be free in the midst of scratches and not scratches. Meantime, there's plenty of ordinary people concerned with how to prevent scratches. And sometimes we feel that way. We're very concerned with that. But do we abandon the Buddha in our caring to prevent scratches? It's not necessary. If we can enter this samadhi, we don't have to abandon taking care of Buddha, even while we are concerned with preventing scratches or putting antibiotic cream on scratches. The ordinary person is not excluded from this samadhi.

[67:23]

But while we're being concerned in this way, are we meditating on the non-duality of the person who's concerned with this worldly affair, this ordinary thing, and intimacy with the one who is... What? Who? Who is seeing and maintaining the actual intimacy of the relationship, which means that even if there is a scratch, there can be freedom from suffering. And even if there isn't a scratch, there can be freedom from suffering. That's the ball that's hard to keep the eye on. And the non-duality.

[68:29]

And that's what Dogen was asking Gikai to work on. Because Gikai was really good at preventing scratches. He took really good care of the monastery. He was very talented at taking care of the monastery. Better than Buddha. Almost no scratches in the monastery while he was doing his ordinary thing. But what he thought, he thought actually, that there was some Buddha other than this ordinary person. He actually was very good at being an ordinary person. He was the best ordinary person among all Dogen's disciples. Dogen's disciple Ejo, his first disciple, was not as good at taking care of the monastery. He asked this young person to take care of the monastery,

[69:35]

because this young person was so good, was better at being an ordinary person than anybody. But he thought, this person who was very good at being an ordinary monk, actually an extraordinary ordinary monk, he, that extraordinary monk, thought that there was some Buddhism other than an ordinary person practicing. And Dogen said, in order to enter this transmission of the teaching, you have to get more of this grandmotherly mind. You have to take care of the intimacy with Buddha while you're taking care of the monastery, to enter into the transmission process. And I'm certain you will, he said. If I come back from Kyoto, I will be able to do this ceremony with you.

[70:39]

But he didn't come back. So Gikai didn't become Dogen's disciple. But he did finally understand this point pretty well. Yes. I'll stop you now then. Did you say no? Wait a second, you just said anytime. You just said anytime, I take you up on it, you stop now.

[71:47]

No, now. I think this is a good time. You shouldn't have said that, yeah. Actually, I think it was really nice that you said that. I appreciate it. Do you want me to make an exposition? I think it's pretty good. Do you want me to make an exposition? I don't want to, but I just wondered if you want me to. Pardon? Yeah, well, I don't want to. Okay, I won't make an exposition then. Okay? Is that alright with you? No. Right. It's not alright. What's the matter with it? You're making me really angry. I am? I'm making you angry? Extremely.

[72:48]

You're extremely angry? Yes, very. Very. Have you fully expressed your anger? Not quite. You have my permission to do so. You do? You do, yeah, I'm a big boy. I have a broken leg, but, you know, I'm ready for you. No, I don't trust myself. No, it isn't quite that. Pardon? I'm kidding. Fine. Do you want to play or do you want to make an exposition? I don't want to make an exposition. I don't want to make an exposition. Okay. I'd rather play. Okay, have you been playing with me? Have you been playing with me? Yes and no. Are you ready to let go of the no? Yes. Okay, great.

[73:50]

May our intention equal...

[73:57]

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