in discussing the self-receiving and enacting samadhi in which we are told to practice if we want to be on the path of enlightenment. The old Buddha Dogen says, speaks of expressing the Buddha mudra in the three actions. Remember that part? Hmm? No. He says, when even for a moment you express the Buddha mudra in your three actions, the entire earth, the entire earth, the entire earth, the entire phenomenal world becomes the Buddha's mudra.

[01:24]

And the sky turns into enlightenment. And what is the Buddha Mudra? Anybody? What's the Buddha Mudra that can be expressed with your three actions? What? The posture is one of the actions. The three actions are posture, speech, and thought. So if you're sitting, and you express the Buddha's seal through your sitting posture, then the whole phenomenal world also becomes the Buddha's seal. And the entire sky turns into enlightenment. What's the Buddha mudra? Anybody?

[02:33]

What's the Buddha mudra? Yeah. You're getting warm. You're getting close. Getting close. What? Getting colder. He was closer. What did he say? He said, I can lift this Striker, thinking I do it by myself. That's not the Buddha mudra. That's the stupid mudra of unenlightened people. Unenlightened people think they're very powerful or very weak. Have you noticed? They think... I can lift it by myself, or I'm too weak to lift it by myself, but I could lift it by myself if I was stronger.

[03:39]

Or somebody can lift, some strong person can lift this, but I can't. Or some strong person says, I'm strong and I can lift this, but weak people can't. But if they were strong like me, they could. That's not the Buddha mudra. And then he said, or you can think Buddha lifts it. Yeah, so when your hand raises up and that raising of the hand expresses that everybody is supporting this hand-raising activity and this hand-raising activity supports everybody. The Buddha mudra is everybody working together, helping everybody. That's the Buddha mudra. And mudra means a Sanskrit word.

[04:41]

It means ring. And it also means a seal, like a seal that you stamp on something. Does that make sense, seal? So when your activities have the seal of approval, sort of, of the Buddha, You know, when your activities are within the awareness that this activity arises together with everyone, supporting everyone, being supported by everyone, then Buddha puts her seal on the activity. Buddha activity are the things you do together with everyone. When you appreciate, when you receive, all that support, and then you give all that support, when you understand that, then your activities, your postures, your voice, your vocalizations, your speech, and your thoughts, express the Buddha seal, the Buddha mudra, the Buddha circle, the Buddha ring.

[05:51]

So mudra means ring and seal. or shape, the shape of the Buddha. The shape of the Buddha is how everything is helping everything. The Buddha mudra is the intimacy of all beings. So when you cough, when you move, when you speak, when you think, when you feel, when you emote, when you blink your eyes, when that activity expresses the intimacy of that activity with all other activity, then the Buddha Mudra is expressed. And then the whole world becomes that intimacy. And the entire sky turns into enlightenment. Yeah?

[06:57]

The expression does not reach it. The expression does not reach it? The expression does not reach it. any idea you have of the expression doesn't reach it. But the expression is intimate with the intimacy. So there was, I understand I made a commitment, some kind of a commitment to get the etymology of the English word commitment. And as is typical in my life, I got assistance. And therefore, here is the fulfilled commitment, which might be posted somewhere where you can read it in detail.

[08:09]

The etymology of commitment comes from comitere, which means to join or entrust, from mitere, as Brian said, to put or send, to put or send. Another etymology is, another version of the etymology which is helpful, is to bring together. From together, com, and mitere, to put or send, to put together, to send together, to join, to entrust. So today I'd like to talk a son, I have lots of things I'd like to talk about, but I'll just talk about some of them, about commitment and also about commitment in the process of spiritual initiation.

[09:22]

But before that happens, maybe Barbara wants to say something. I made a commitment too, because I wasn't really happy with the German translation of commitment. And I thought about it, I found out that I like the translations I love. So in English, the first commitment for most of its history or for the last few hundred years, commitment has mostly been a transitive verb. So for example, the first meaning as a transitive verb, it's not commitment, commit. Commit is a transitive verb. So it means to put into another's charge or trust.

[10:25]

So commit means to give something to somebody else to take care of. That's the first meaning. Second meaning is not, I shouldn't say first meaning, that's just one meaning. Another meaning is to carry out or perform. Like to perform, not just to like the precepts and want to practice them, but actually to actually practice them. But also you can commit a crime or an immoral act or a mistake. which you can commit, and it's often used for committing crimes in English. Another meaning of commitment is a pledge or a vow or to dedicate a course, to dedicate a path or a policy or a use, to commit some path or policy or use. Another meaning is to resolve

[11:29]

to remain in a long-term emotional relationship with someone. Another meaning is to transfer for safety and permanent preservation, like to commit a forest, to be a park or something. And then the other is to be sent to prison or a psychiatric hospital or a regular hospital or a trial in court. And I really don't feel like I'm talking about commitment to push anybody to make any commitments. But after I talk about it for a while, you might see what an amazingly great function commitment performs in our life. So you might feel like I'm trying to talk you into it.

[12:32]

But I'm really not. But somebody's making me talk you into it. I understand that in many forms of initiation, there is a sense of entering the initiation process and not being able to get out once you start into the process, once you're committed. that seems to be part of initiation processes, spiritual initiations around the world. There's a story about the Buddha, Shakyamuni Buddha, before he was Shakyamuni Buddha, He was a very sincere yogi, but at a certain point he felt like he was too extreme, that he had become addicted to self-mortification.

[13:48]

And so he decided to drink, eat a little bit of food, and to wear some clothes, and to wash off some of the dirt from his body. And so he accepted some food from a young woman. I think she's called a milkmaid. I'm not sure. But anyway, she gave him some rice and some milk, and he drank it. And not too long after that, he went to the stream, and I think he I think he was going to get some water, and I think he put the water container in the stream, and the water container moved upstream. Do you understand? And he thought, oh, this is unusual. Maybe it's time for me to make a commitment.

[14:54]

So he made a commitment. His commitment was, I'm going to sit down under a tree and I'm not going to move until I, until, maybe he said, until I attain the way. And then when he sat and didn't move, large masses of what we call demons came to visit him. I believe first it was masses of very attractive demons, very lovely demons, who encouraged him to come and play with them, who offered very lovely things to do. But he didn't move, and they went away.

[16:02]

Then came armies of fierce, threatening, terrifying demons who said, if you don't move, we will destroy you. And he didn't move. And they went away. But then the super demon came and said, so you think you can attain the way? Huh? You're so arrogant. And that got to him. He didn't move, but he thought, good point. I shouldn't be sitting here thinking that I'm going to attain, I'm going to attain the way. I should be sitting here attaining the way with the whole earth and all living beings.

[17:13]

I should not move until the whole earth and all living beings together with me attain the way. That's what I should be doing here. That's how I should be here. So he thought, maybe I will ask the earth, I will invite the earth to come and join me. I've made a commitment, now I'll ask the whole world to make a commitment with me. I'll see if the whole earth does really support me and practice with me. So he took his right hand and he touched the earth and asked the earth if he was practicing together with the whole earth. and the earth cried up thousands and thousands of voices that we support you to attain the way. We support you. We support you attaining the way with us.

[18:20]

And the earth shook right and left and forward and backward and up and down." So I guess at that time he kind of moved. And then the super demon went away. And the way was attained. And when the Buddha attained the way, the Buddha said, now I attain the way together with all beings. And I see that all beings actually are impressed by the Buddha seal, but they don't understand it. This is a story of the great ancestor's commitment and how he finally understood his commitment is not done by himself.

[19:23]

And so some of you have told me that you're somewhat concerned about making commitments to practices, to precepts, to people, and that you're somewhat afraid to do so. And I say now, there's good reason to be afraid, because once you make commitments, you get in a lot more trouble than before. If Buddha sits under the tree and the demons come and he goes off with them, then the next wave of demons won't come. If you're angry and distracted, big armies of demons aren't going to come. If you don't make a commitment, they're not going to send an army after you. They've already got you that you didn't make a commitment. They'll leave you in your uncommitted state indefinitely.

[20:29]

If you start getting really good, they'll start giving you a little hassle. But if you get really good and then commit to that, then there tends to be a big resistance to that, a very big disturbance of what might come. Somebody may be practicing a precept and enjoying practicing a precept. For example, some people have quite wholesome sexual relationships, you know, where they don't misuse sexuality. They don't lie about it. They don't take it when it's not given. They aren't possessive. They don't use it to manipulate people. Some people are quite healthy in the way that they are as sexual beings. And then they commit to practicing sexuality in a wholesome way.

[21:31]

And suddenly it gets much harder. Some people don't practice. Some people are so-called celibate. I mean, they're not celibate exactly, they just have no sex and they haven't had sex for many years. And then they commit to not having sex and suddenly everyone starts inviting them to have sex. People say, oh look, there's a celibate person, let's go talk to them. You can go and tease them and you can go and, you know, get near them and go, and they won't bother you, you know. You can be real sexy with them and it's really safe. I mean, they're a human being. So you can go practice being sexy with them. But they won't do anything because they've made this vow. So let's go. Let's go play with that person or maybe even test that person. See if they're really into that. At that time, these people become demons. But they're evoked by the person making a commitment.

[22:38]

And inside you too, when you make a commitment, you invoke all the resistance. Before you make the commitment, the resistance isn't relevant. When you're angry, the demon of anger doesn't have to come. So if you're afraid of making commitments, there's a good reason. things will get more difficult in certain ways, but that's part of the process. Someone said to me in the room upstairs, they said, I'm surprised how this form of being in this room with you seems to be an occasion for the arising of lots of self-concern.

[23:48]

Or a very strong sense of self. Or, actually that's not what the person said, a very strong sense of separation of me and you. when you're at a long distance from somebody and you make no commitment to meet them, you may not notice that you feel separate from them. But if you go into a little room with them and get close, you actually might feel more the sense of separation and therefore fear. But if you don't go in the room, And don't make a commitment to go in the room later either. If you're outside the room and you've committed to go in the room, you can also be scared, which many people report. When they're waiting, they're scared because they're kind of in line to go in and it's kind of like hard to get away and pretty soon they're going to be in there and there's going to be this big separation. But if you have no commitment, as soon as the sense of separation arises, you can just say,

[24:57]

I'm out of here. This is uncomfortable. I would say this to you, that we need to have boundaries in order to be intimate. Or even I would say, we need to set boundaries in order to realize intimacy. We are intimate already, but it seems to me that humans need to set up boundaries in order to realize that they're intimate. We are intimate, but we feel separate and frightened and stressed because we feel separate. We feel separate and believe it's true. But to realize they're intimate, we sort of have to enact our delusion that we're separate by putting up a boundary.

[26:08]

But not just have the boundary there, but join, commit to the boundary. And not only that, but commit to the boundary with somebody else. So the two people start with two, self and other. Other can be represented by one person or the whole universe. The universe or the one person and you set up a boundary so that you can realize that you're intimate. If you set up a boundary by yourself, that may not be sufficient. But I suggest to you that if you set up a boundary with somebody else and commit to the boundary, that that process will help you realize your intimacy with the person. With the boundary, you will dare to open to how you feel separate, which is pretty difficult.

[27:15]

And you'll dare to... Excuse me. With the boundary and the mutual commitment to building the boundary, you will be more able to practice openness to the sense of separation, which is pretty difficult. But I see quite a few people can tolerate that. Quite a few people can tolerate the sense of separation. Building the... boundary between yourself and someone you feel separate from helps you become more intimate with the separation, which you can, again, to be aware of separation, many people are able to do. To get intimate with it requires usually quite a bit of assistance. And it often helps to be with someone else who's also having difficulty with the same separation that you're having difficulty with, namely the one between you and them.

[28:20]

And if you can deal with that difficulty, then you have the opportunity to deal with the much bigger difficulty, which is opening to intimacy, which is much more dynamic and alive and uncontrollable. And the intimacy, however, ladies and gentlemen, We do not actually set up. That's already the case. Who we are together with all beings sets that up. And some people you already feel close to are really good opportunities to try to get them to work with you to set up the boundary. To, again, dramatize. Have a conversation with the person so you can dramatize your delusion that you're separate from each other.

[29:25]

Don't deny it. Don't pretend like you don't need boundaries because you're so friendly. You love each other so much. Again, the word koan, again, means ko is public and an is private. The koan, the truth, is public and private are intimate. Yeah, an example would be If you're talking to me, you could say, I'd like to set up a boundary between us. And of course I would say, sure, how do you want to do that? And you say, I'd like to have a signal that I make when you're talking to me, and when I make that signal, you will stop talking.

[30:28]

So I would like to put a boundary on your talking. Because I feel like sometimes since you're playing this role of teacher, sometimes when you start talking I feel like, well, I can't stop you, you know, because it would be disrespectful because I'm supposed to be listening to you. But sometimes you talk too long and I kind of like need a break. So I feel like there's no boundary on your talking. So I feel separate from you, but I want to like, be able to express my separateness and say, stop. So I say, well, what signal do you want to use? And she says, I want to use this one. Do you use this in Europe? So time out. Stop talking. Or you could say, I'd like to put my hand over your mouth. But can we agree on this? And can we commit to this form?

[31:30]

And I might say, OK. And then when I'm talking, you can stop me anytime, pretty much. Particularly in the class of studying koans, which we had for many years, we studied a book of 100 koans for 14 years, and we just recently finished. But in that class, I usually would say to people at the beginning of the class, not every class, but the beginning of a series, I would say, sometimes the train of this class gets rolling along and people feel left behind. And if you feel left behind, you may think, oh, everybody else is on the train and I'm the only one who's left behind and maybe it's because everybody else understands this koan better than me. So I shouldn't bother them. But I say if you feel left behind the group in the study, you can kind of like raise your hand and stop the train.

[32:35]

So that's a form so that people feel that they have some way to participate and stay with the group. So there's other forms too, like you might say, I don't know what, a husband and a wife might say, let's have the form of not having sexual relationships with other people. That's a boundary that they set up. It's actually the boundaries between them. They mutually set up the boundary that they're not going to do certain things with other people. And that helps them often to be more intimate. If you don't do that, you might be afraid to be intimate with people if you don't have any sense of some boundary between you and between them and other people. Yeah. and between people, the psychological phenomena, how we use each other for displacing our own emotions and the fact that we don't want to be intimate with ourselves.

[33:47]

So I can project things onto you and pretend that you're actually the source of feelings that I don't want to be intimate with myself. And to set a boundary by sitting, so I actually come in contact with those things or having interviews. you help me be aware of those things that actually belong to me, rather than make prelimate to you all the time. I mean, it helps to... So what is the boundary in this case? I don't know. The forms are a sort of boundary. I mean, we all use each other. The forms, like, for example, being quiet, being silent during retreat is a form to help you clarify... what you think is yours and what you think is somebody else's. Because again, what is yours and what is somebody else's can still be going on in intimacy. Intimacy doesn't necessarily mean that other people's feelings are yours.

[34:50]

They may be happy and you may not be. We're not saying that you're happy when you're unhappy and vice versa. It's just that other people's unhappiness and your happiness are not separate. They're intimate. Your happiness and somebody else's happiness are intimate. But sometimes when you're happy and somebody else is unhappy, and you feel separate from their unhappiness, you may feel bad about being happy. And you may think that you shouldn't be happy because they're not happy. So then you need to pretend or talk yourself into being unhappy because you feel separate from their unhappiness. rather than set up a boundary and say, I feel separate from your happiness, and I feel separate from your happiness. I'm separate from your happiness. But I actually accept that I feel separate from your happiness.

[35:55]

And I accept that I feel uncomfortable being happy when you're unhappy. I feel guilty to be happy when you're unhappy. because I feel separate from your unhappiness." And I do feel separate from your unhappiness, and because I feel separate from your unhappiness, my happiness seems wrong. Or I feel like I'm not a good person. How could I be happy and look at somebody who's unhappy? I want to say one more thing before I answer all those wonderful questions. The Buddha is happy with unhappy people. the Buddha is happy to be not separate from all the unhappy people. Now, when the Buddha is not separate from all the unhappy people, the Buddha is shaped differently. And the word karuna, or compassion, means dented happiness.

[36:57]

The etymology of karuna is dented happiness. So the Buddha's body of happiness gets dented by everybody's unhappiness. But the Buddha is happy, is joyful, is peaceful, is harmonious, and all the people's unhappiness change the shape of the Buddha. Dent means like this. Put a dent, we say dent a car in a car accident, your car gets dented. But in some ways, you know, the way the Buddha gets dented is that the suffering of the world makes Buddha's face into a smile. Because the Buddha is not happy that you're suffering. The Buddha is happy to be with you and intimately in your suffering. But if you, what the people do sometimes is they feel happy

[37:58]

and they feel separate from someone who's unhappy, so then rather than recognize that they feel separate, they tell a lie about the way they are and they hide the way they are because they feel ashamed. And they also know, like I said yesterday, if you're happy and you feel separate from someone who's not happy and they feel separate from you, they might attack you. So to protect yourself because you feel separate from them and you think they might attack you, you look really depressed so they won't attack you when they're depressed. But if you put up the boundaries and say, I do feel separate, then you can start to understand you're not separate. And when you're not separate, you can be happy with someone who's unhappy. And you can show them how they're not separate from your happiness. Their misery is not separate from your happiness, and your happiness isn't separate from their misery. And when both parties realize this, they're both liberated from their state.

[39:01]

You're liberated from your happiness, and you're liberated from your unhappiness. And Buddha is liberated from being Buddha. An unenlightened person is liberated from being unenlightened person. Unenlightened person liberated from unenlightened person becomes Buddha. Buddha liberated from Buddha becomes Buddha. It isn't that when you're liberated from Buddha you become unenlightened. It's that your enlightenment grows when you give up being Buddha. And when you give up being not Buddha, your enlightenment grows too. So there were some hands raised. One, two, three. Was there three? Yes. Eva? Well, the other way around, when you are unhappy and you have lots of happy people around you, it makes you aggressive. We said that before, and that makes them afraid that you may address them. Say again? When you're unhappy and you have happy people around you, then what happens?

[40:05]

Then you become aggressive. You're not ashamed, like the other way around, but you are aggressive. You think, they don't understand me, and you feel separate from them. Yeah. Right. Or rather, we generally feel separate... And then in that situation, our separateness makes us feel even worse. And we'd like some other unhappy people to be with us because if more unhappy people were with us, then if we were unhappy and we're surrounded by unhappy people, then what do we not have to look at? What? Yeah, you don't have to look at separation, right? So when you have people around you, if you're miserable and you have miserable people around you, you don't have to look at the separation. So miserable people like miserable people around them, because then they don't have to look at the real issue, which is much more difficult. It's much more difficult to look at the separation than just being unhappy. And the happy people just want happy people around them, and the rich people want rich people around them, so that they cannot face the main problem.

[41:11]

And it's okay for rich people to have rich people around them, but then they need to set up boundaries between the rich people so that the rich people can realize they feel separate from the other rich people. And the rich people, because they feel separate from each other, they're afraid of each other too. But when rich people are with poor people, they feel the separation so that they feel scared because they think the poor people will steal from them. And the poor people are afraid of the rich people because they think the rich people will take more of their money to be richer. Or the rich people will use them more. Everybody's afraid of everybody who's separate from them. So we're doing all kinds of things to avoid facing separation. I'm saying, get it out there and work it up. Make it more. It can't be anymore. It's total, full. But make a total, full border with somebody. Be like, I saw this movie one time called A Great Wall is a movie about modern China.

[42:20]

It's not modern anymore, but anyway, at that time it was about these, you know, new wave of modernization in China. And this girl was living in this small apartment with her mother, but she still found a way to make a little kind of like separation in the room with the curtain. And her mother came into her little room and the girl says, would you please leave my room? I want some privacy. And her mother said, I think they said this in English. But anyway, she said, privacy? Privacy? I'm your mother. How can you have privacy from me? In a deluded way, we think that being who we are is a private thing, separate from other people. We have to work with that. And so setting up boundaries, setting up forms together will help us realize intimacy.

[43:25]

I propose that to you. And so then it's good, and one of the forms you can use is be with people that are different from you. Because then automatically you feel separation. But then, even then, you need to even continue to build up boundaries with them because after a while you can lose track of the boundary because you stop feeling so separate because separateness is an illusion and you start to lose track of it. Yes? So, I wonder, how is it in detail that, Well, it's not so much to realize that ultimately, yeah, ultimately realize that boundaries don't exist.

[44:33]

It's not so much to realize that boundaries don't exist, okay, I mean, it's true that ultimately boundaries don't exist, okay? But nothing exists ultimately, okay? It's the separation. But the separation doesn't even... All things do not exist ultimately. Nothing exists ultimately, okay? Boundaries don't exist ultimately. People don't exist ultimately. Tennis balls don't exist ultimately. Nothing exists ultimately. Nothing. Okay? Kindness does not exist ultimately. Health does not exist. Sickness does not. Birth does not. Death does not. Nothing, nothing, nothing. Nothing exists ultimately. Emptiness does not exist ultimately. Emptiness is the fact, the way things do not exist ultimately.

[45:42]

That's what emptiness is. But it also does not exist ultimately. It's just the way things can never be found. So you can never find anything. Nothing exists ultimately. The only things that exist The only things that function are things that exist interdependently. That's the only way things exist, is interdependently. But not ultimately. Even interdependent things, which exist interdependently, when you actually look at them, you can never find them. They can't be grasped. That's emptiness, that they can't be grasped, they can't be found. Ultimately, nothing exists. But conventionally, as dependent core risings, many things exist. But there's one thing that doesn't exist even conventionally. The separation between things that does not exist even conventionally. The separation between us doesn't exist at all.

[46:44]

The experience of separation does not exist. But the idea of separation exists. There's no such thing as separation. There is no such thing as separation. You have a sense of it, yeah. The sense exists, but it's not a sense of separation. It's a sense of you thinking of separation. But there is no separation. So separation doesn't exist at all. What does exist is interdependence. And interdependence exists not ultimately, it exists interdependently. There's boundaries as much as there's teeth. As a matter of fact, your teeth are boundary makers. You make boundaries in the food with your teeth. But your teeth are not separate from your gums. The teeth do not ultimately exist.

[47:58]

Gums do not ultimately exist. Food does not ultimately exist. And there's borders and boundaries between teeth and gum and between teeth and food. There's boundaries there. There actually are dependently co-arisen boundaries. And these boundaries you can use to flush out something that doesn't exist, namely separate people. You can flesh out something that doesn't exist. In other words, you can flesh out your delusion that you're separate from people by using dependently co-arisen things like boundaries, limits, agreements, forms of practice. You can use all these things to flesh out your belief that you're not intimate with people. and realize that your belief that you're not intimate with people does exist, but the not intimacy does not exist. And when you're sure it doesn't exist, you're in really good condition.

[49:01]

I don't know. Do you think you can? Do you need any help? Do you need any help to rephrase your question? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay, I will. I'll give you permission, too, if that helps you, right? Want some water? Okay. Yeah, good. What is it in practice that gives us insight that this image of separation is not real? Well, one of the things in practice that gives us insight or supports insight is to look at the separation quite a bit.

[50:30]

In other words, to study this phenomenon? Yeah, to study the phenomenon and hope. Well, not so much to see how it's unreal, but just to see how it is. If you're already saying it's unreal, that may not be, that might be okay, but that's not necessarily the way. Main thing is to look at it in a calm state, in a relaxed state. So you have this, I talked to you before, right, about, where did I say, I have these notes here about, you know, to, oh, there it is. I say we need... Where is it? Oh, there it is. It's in the original description of the course, right? To see how... No, it's not in the original description of the course. It's... I didn't do this part with you yet.

[51:34]

I did mention about trusting, but now we can say committing. Okay? So you have this phenomena. It's not really a phenomena, but it's an image of something that doesn't exist. You see an image of separation. So you, first of all, you commit to study it. Then you relax with it. Then you start playing with it. Then you start being creative with it. then you understand it. And when you understand it, you'll understand that it's not there and you'll be liberated from it. So that's how to practice with it. But I would add now into that, from our discussion, commit to study the separation, formally commit to study the separation, but formally commit to study it with somebody. So that the form of the study is also dramatically enacting that you don't even study the separation by yourself.

[52:43]

The separation, you can see it by yourself. You can walk around with nobody around and you can see the separation. But actually, everybody's supporting you. And you don't see it because nobody's around. So what you do is you invite some other people to come and see if they can see the separation too. So then two of you can see the separation. Do you feel separate from me? Yeah. I feel separate from you too. Okay. Let's look at that together, okay? Should we commit together? Yes. Should we commit to each other to help each other study this? Yes. Should we set up boundaries together? Yes. Okay. Now, can we relax with this separation? No, I can't. Okay, but do you want to work with me together to try to learn how to relax with it? Okay. And then two people are practicing relaxing with this thing we want to become free of, this separation. Then two people play with it. Then two people be creative with it. You're not creative with it by yourself. Actually, the sense of separation is playing with you, too.

[53:44]

The sense of separation is playing with you. The separation is not playing with you, but the sense is. But it's nice to get a person in on it, because they even enhance the sense of separation. And then both of you being creative with it, and then both of you will understand it, and then both of you will be liberated, which is actually the way liberation happens anyway. It's not you by yourself become liberated from this illusion of separation. It's actually you together with other people because you're not separated from them. So that's basically a short version of how to study it. But there's infinite varieties about how to relax and how to be playful. Okay? And you still had a question that we didn't respond to? Yes? Yeah. Yesterday we were talking... Pardon? It will take some time. Yeah, well, it's okay. We have some time before lunch.

[54:47]

Yesterday we were talking quite a bit about not being under control of doing anything. And that somehow catched my mind together with things being predetermined. And I just was now listening to your speech, always like assuming or listening to your words and always having in mind that we are not under control at all about our responsibilities, about our responses, about making commitments, and so on. And still you use words, which is of course fine because you're not under control of them either, which make us the idea that we can control something, like I can accept something, I can open myself somehow. However, if I always put the thing on it, okay, but I'm not under control about it, I mean, it's time to use these words for things

[55:53]

you usually use with our normal thinking that you are under control of it. We wouldn't say, OK, if you accept that, then you may roll or fall down if I let you go. And still, I don't see where it is something else than if we are not under control of anything. It just makes a strange feeling for me, because I'm not under control of any response. I'm responding, sure. I see that. But I'm not at all under control of that. It's clear to me that you're not under control. That's what it looks like to me. But although you're not under control, still I was able to talk to you. And when I started talking to you, you stopped talking. But I wasn't trying to control you to stop talking, but when I said, you're not under control, you stopped talking.

[56:56]

So, in a sense, we are somewhat determined because the way we are in a given moment, you could say, is controlled by all the conditions that give rise to us. But I wouldn't call that over-determinism, and I think there's still freedom there. The freedom is in realizing emptiness, because realizing emptiness is understanding that you can never actually ultimately find any of these things which have been determined. Wait a second. You are free to realize emptiness. The whole universe is working to help you realize emptiness all the time. And you're free to do that. It may not happen, but you're free for it not to happen too. It may happen, but I'm not free to do it because I'm not under control to do it.

[57:59]

Well, you can't control yourself to realize emptiness. That's right. I cannot control anybody else. And really, you're not controlled. You're not controlled to realize emptiness either. You're not controlled to realize emptiness, and you can't control yourself to realize emptiness, and you can't control me to realize emptiness. However, you are supported to realize emptiness. I have a feeling from what you said I'm controlled by causes and conditions to realize maybe emptiness at one point. You're not exactly controlled by causes and conditions. You are created by causes and conditions. I don't see the difference. Well, the difference is that I think when we use control, we're talking about something controlling something else rather than everything controlling something. So in one sense you could say the whole universe is in control of you. The whole universe makes you. But you could also say the whole universe, the way it controls you is in an interdependent way.

[59:06]

So it's not just controlling you, but it's being controlled by you. So it's not really it controlling you any more than you're controlling it. So it's really, I think, controlling is kind of like makes it harder to understand. So it's easier to understand interdependence if you let go of the idea of control. I'm just thinking then about, if I look in the physical world, I don't use control, and I agree that that is very strange. I just use, like, act and react. I'm reacting to the universe, and the universe is, of course... It's not even so much that you're reacting to the universe, but you are actually a response to the whole universe. Every moment what you are is a response to the whole universe, and the whole universe is a response to you. The whole universe is based on you. The whole universe is a response to you. And you are a response to the universe. And in that universe that you're a response to, everybody else is also doing the same thing.

[60:13]

So there's not really control, but there is support and being supported. That's going on. And you are supported to realize emptiness because the way you are created directly shows emptiness. It shows that you're interdependent and it shows that no idea of interdependence reaches interdependence. Interdependence cannot be grasped and that's its emptiness. So you are actually being supported to realize emptiness all the time and it's just the question of how can we all help you and how can you help all of us And we're watching now. How do we help each other? And one of the ways we help each other is by being aware that we think we're not helping each other, which you can see. You can't see how you're helping me realize emptiness, really. You can just have a story of it, which I'm happy to hear.

[61:15]

And I can have a story of how I'm helping you. But how I'm helping you, which is going on, I have to open my eyes to. And the way I open my eyes to it is by seeing how... I think I'm not helping you realize emptiness or how you're not helping me realize emptiness. And to commit, to commit to watch that drama of not helping each other, the more you study it, the more you'll be free of it. And when you're free of the drama of not helping each other, your eyes will open to how you are helping each other, to the drama which is beyond any pictures. And then you realize emptiness. But I'm not under control of committing that and to open my eyes. That's what I mean. I mean, if I really think through, I'm not under control. I think it's good to remember that. It is nice to talk about it, and that has additional causes and conditions, but it feels really strange because

[62:19]

Of course, if I think normally, I would say, okay, I can commit to that. But if I really think that through, what you said yesterday, I'm not under control. Yeah, so go right ahead, go right ahead, and just work with that. Work with that you're not under control. And remember that. Remember that you're not under control and you can't control anybody else. Just remember that. If you could be controlled, Buddha would just control you into being a Buddha. But Buddha cannot control you people into realizing the Dharma. But Buddha is constantly assisting you, or to put it the other way is, the way you are being assisted to realize the truth is is Buddha. And you are being assisted to realize the truth. And so I'm here talking in a certain way about commitment because one of the conditions for realizing the absence of separation is to commit to looking at it.

[63:22]

It's a kind of a little thing which doesn't control anything, but in fact meditating in that way supports the realization of the emptiness of separation. But it's not control, it's just cause and effect. Cause and effect is not control. And without commitment, the cause and effect keeps slipping in such a way that you don't realize the emptiness of self. But it doesn't mean that if you make a commitment that suddenly you're moving into a place where everything's under control. It's just that some of the conditions for the arising of liberation have been satisfied. commitment is necessary. So, it doesn't mean it controls things. It just means certain things don't happen. Like blood is necessary for a heart to function normally. Hearts are necessary for blood to circulate. But hearts don't control the blood circulation and the blood doesn't control the heart.

[64:24]

But they support each other. So it's good to watch out for the word control Just watch out for that. And notice that when you start slipping into being concerned about control, you're starting to move into believing in separation without noticing it. It's a form of belief in separation that we don't usually notice. Whereas being close to somebody and committed to certain forms with them make you be aware of separation. So getting into control is a distraction from the main medicine, which is to pay attention to the cause of the sickness. Yes? Under all conditions, you are supported to make commitments. However, sometimes the support is not sufficient for the commitment to happen.

[65:27]

And when the commitment happens, you are completely free to do it. But you're also free not to do it, too. So you're free to make commitments, you're free to not make commitments, and yet you're supported by certain conditions. And then the commitment arises. You don't make the commitment. I don't make the commitment. I support you to make the commitment. But even though I support you, the commitment doesn't necessarily arise. But sometimes I support you to make the commitment and the commitment does arise. When the commitment arises, it happens because of the support of all beings. When it doesn't happen, it happens with the support of all beings. And yet, here we are in a room together talking about commitment rather than not talking about commitment. Okay? And I want to tell you this story again, if I may, about this. I want to tell you the the Christmas story again, but I'll tell you a little bit better. Not better, but a little clearer.

[66:32]

So this woman is committed. She's committed to her family. And she's unhappy. And she thinks that if they had more money, she'd be happier. And her husband thinks if he had a bicycle shop, they'd be happier. And she thinks he's wrong. She thinks that they'd have less money if he started his bicycle shop. So she doesn't like his idea because she thinks that that wouldn't bring more money and really what they need is more money. So they have a fight. And she goes outside and takes a walk around the block. And while she's walking, these terrible things happen. She loses her husband. They lose their money. She loses her kids. And one other thing happens is that an angel comes and takes her to where Santa Claus lives.

[67:36]

And when she went to where Santa Claus lived, I thought Santa Claus was going to give her some money and bring her kids back and her husband back. But Santa Claus did not appear. What appeared was she went into the place where they have all the letters that kids have sent to Santa Claus over the centuries. And they looked through the files and they found her letter that she wrote to Santa Claus when she was a little girl. And she saw her heart, her child's heart, that wrote that letter to Santa Claus. And then she... woke up and realized she was still walking around the block. And she went back into her house and she realized how happy she was to have not much money and two kids and a husband. She made the commitment and then the commitment got more and more intense and more and more intense.

[68:46]

and more and more intense. And in the end, she opened to it completely. And then without changing anything in her life or Santa Claus coming to fix anything, she realized that she was not separate from her children or her husband or her poverty. And without anybody fixing anything, she just woke up. She wasn't under control, obviously. Nobody controlled her. But the kinds of things that come up once you make commitment transform you and open your eyes. And then you see that the way the world is without moving anything is this realm of peace and harmony where everybody's working together. In other words, you realize Buddha. But without commitment... such a story doesn't work. And also such a story doesn't occur. You don't get pushed and pushed and pushed until you realize, you want to fix things?

[69:52]

Well, okay, we'll take away that. You want to fix things? We'll take away that. How bad do they have to get before you stop trying to fix it and open your eyes to that you're not separate from this world? If you're sick and you're separate from sickness, you're in trouble. If you're healthy and you're separate from sickness... you're in trouble. If you're healthy and you're separate from other people, you're in trouble. If there's separation, you're in trouble. How do you make a commitment to get over that? You don't do it. But I'm talking about it. And maybe if I talk about it and you listen and you talk to me and we cry together and laugh together and lose our children and our husbands and our money, maybe we'll open our eyes. Court jester? A commitment hasn't happened? Yeah. And it took hold of you?

[70:56]

Out in the marketplace, what? Which one? What commitment do you lose? I don't know what commitment you mean. Okay. Well, the thing that comes to my mind most quickly is not very interesting because I already said it, and that would be in the marketplace, set up boundaries with people. So the commitment to become free of the belief in separation is the final goal. But in the short run, the commitment needs to be to study the separation. Because we don't usually get over the separation if we don't notice it. Because if you don't notice it, it's one of those things, if it's in the back, the feeling of separation is in the back for most people. They feel separate from others, but they don't know it.

[72:11]

We've got to bring the separation out in front. So one commitment is to become free of the separation. But in order to become free of it, you have to bring it out in front. And one way to bring it out in front is to set up boundaries with people. And to set them up mutually, I think, even makes it clearer. And you can study separation in the marketplace, because people are feeling like, that's your money, and this is my money. That's your job. This is my job. That's your responsibility. This is my responsibility. Your responsibility is separate from my responsibility. How to dramatically enhance that in the marketplace, some people are willing to do that. And even those who aren't willing to say they are, in fact, they're part of the drama of separation. So study that, which is quite available in the marketplace. Yeah.

[73:17]

Yeah. Or are you asking how can you, for example, how you can remember the commitment to study the separation? That one? Well, again, it helps if you have partners because sometimes you're talking to someone and you're talking in such a way and they say, oh, Andre, did you forget about your belief in separation? And you say, oh, my gosh, I did. I was acting like I felt separate from you, but I didn't notice that I was acting like I felt separate. I was telling you how I was right and you were wrong, remember? But I forgot that that was like me the right one was separate from you the wrong one. So then the person who you're calling wrong says, remember we agreed to meditate on the sense of separation? Did you remember it? And you say, no, I forgot. Thank you. So even with people who have no interest in

[74:28]

theoretically have no interest in such things as understanding how to be free, they still might be agreeable to play this game with you because you're kind of, you know, handsome guy and, you know, you could pay them money and... You know, you might be able to find a way together with them for them to support you. I think we cannot do this by ourself. We cannot remember... the teaching by ourself. And in fact, nobody does remember the teaching by themselves. But we do remember the teaching with help. Sometimes there is a remembering of the teaching and the reason why we remember it is because everyone supports us. But we sometimes remember it but don't remember that everybody supported us. So it's good to set up forms to remember that, to enact that, which dramatized that, and to learn to catch yourself when you speak about, you know, that somebody did something all by herself or himself.

[75:40]

Like, there's a beautiful staff up in the room upstairs, and I wondered, actually, I was going to ask Vanya, I thought, this thought, I would ask Vanya, did you make that? But I thought, better question is, tell me a story about how that was made. And he might tell me a story that he made it, but it's a story that he made it. He didn't actually make the staff, of course. Of course, the Earth is bamboo, right? The Earth made the bamboo. But not just the Earth. The sun made the bamboo. But not just the sun. The oceans made the bamboo. But not just the bamboo. The bamboo made the bamboo. Not that bamboo, but the mama bamboo and the daddy bamboo. They all made the bamboo. And then also some humans touched the bamboo and cut the bamboo and wrapped the bamboo. And so now there's this beautiful staff. So tell me a story about the bamboo, how it got to be that way. And again, after I hear the story, I want to hear the story. I want to hear him tell a story.

[76:46]

But I would like to hear other stories about the bamboo too. But still I want to hear his story, because it's his room. But that would just be a story. That will not be how the bamboo was made. And so you can ask people to tell you their stories. And the more people you ask to tell you a story, the closer you get to realize that you're not separate. And when you ask people to tell you stories, that helps you feel separate from them. You know, you feel separate from them anyway, but you don't know it. It's in the back. But when you go to people and you ask them to tell you the story, then you start feeling more separate. Like, this is not a very good story that they have. This story is going on too long. that their story is going on too long, which is separate from mine. But if you don't ask them to tell the story, they might not. And if they don't tell you, you may not feel so vividly how separate you feel from them. But the more they tell you the stories and the more you tolerate that sense of separation, the closer you get to realize that they're telling you their story.

[77:55]

So that's what you can do in the marketplace. And you can commit to do that. You can commit to ask people to tell you the stories, and then you're in trouble, because now you're going to have to listen to a lot of stories. It's not that you have to listen to the stories. It's that you committed to listen to the stories, and then if you commit, then you're going to either listen to them, which is going to be quite a big job, or you're going to not listen to them. But if you don't listen to them after you commit, you're going to feel bad because you committed. So when you're ready, commit to ask people to tell you their stories, and that will help you become free of the illusion of separation. But it'll make your life harder if you commit to that. It's hard to commit to listen to people's stories. Psychotherapists do, but they get paid for it. So maybe you should become a psychotherapist, because then you get paid listening to them.

[79:03]

It's still hard, though. My wife's psychotherapist is still hard. It's still hard. But it's a form. But paying helps you actually be able to buy lunch. He's getting really close. But I was thinking of calling on Nancy, if that's all right. What do you think, Nancy? Yeah, that's what I'm supposed to say? Well, you could, if you want. You want to tell a story about some other things I could say? I'm living here in Switzerland.

[80:06]

I'm not speaking the language. And when I go into the marketplace, the grocery store, I feel very separated from the other people. And I can't make a commitment with them to be together because I can't speak to them. Well, you can make a commitment with me that you'll go to the marketplace and experience separation. Yeah, so you and I can do it, and then you can go in the marketplace with these people who speak Swiss German, and then you'll feel separate. And maybe I'll go with you sometime. I'll feel separate too. And we'll go to the marketplace, you know, several hours a day and just concentrate on how separate we feel from these people who speak this wonderful language which we'll never be able to speak. But although we'll never be able to speak it, That helps us feel separate, and feeling separate helps us become free of feeling separate.

[81:11]

And we'll stay in the marketplace until finally one day in the marketplace we will get over feeling separate. Just like the sixth ancestor. I've experienced that occasionally, because I'm so intently... Trying to understand what they're going, what's happening with them. Yeah. And watching, you know, grocery market is a wow because they're doing their thing and I'm doing my thing and I'm trying to stay out of the way and all this is going on and then all of a sudden I said, their feelings are the same as my feelings. No, that's true. Their feelings are not the same as your feelings. You have different feelings, but your feelings are not separate. You're not me, I'm not you, but there's no me without you and no you without me. And there's no Swiss people without American ladies walking around in the marketplace.

[82:16]

And there's no American ladies walking around the marketplace without Swiss people. But you're not Swiss, you're American. and they're not American, they're Swiss. But Swiss are not separate from Americans, and Iraqis are not separate from Americans, and the suffering in Iraq is not separate from Americans. There's no separation between anything, but we're not the same. We're different. And there's boundaries between us, but the boundaries don't separate us. We make the boundaries together. The boundaries are our babies. Our children don't separate us. Our boundaries don't separate us. Our food doesn't separate us. Our language doesn't separate us. There is no separation. It's an illusion. There's zero separation. But there is difference. And there is unity. And they're not separate either. And we need to put ourselves, we need to commit to put ourselves in situations where we'll

[83:19]

study this and become free of it. But when you're ready, because if the conditions aren't ready for you to make the commitment, then the commitment will not arise. But you can still listen to such teachings and meditate on them. And, yeah. Is that enough for this morning? Brian's got his hand raised, but aside from Brian, is that enough? What do you say? Should we have Brian's question or should we conclude? What? How many people vote for Brian's question? Let's see a raise of hands. How many people don't want to hear Brian's question? Well, that's great. Yes, Barrett, did you want to say something?

[84:21]

Wait a second. I asked you if you want to say something. Because if you do, we have to ask people whether we're going to listen to you. I would like to say something. Okay. Well, after we listen for Brian, we'll see if people want to hear you, okay? Brian? If we have a relationship... Yeah? That was pretty simple already. Why don't you make it simpler? Just say, suppose we have a relationship with a boundary. You can't do that. You can't remove your side of the boundary. If you remove your side of the boundary, you move their side of the boundary. You ever try to move a fence between you and your neighbor?

[85:26]

If you move your fence, you move their fence. You can't remove your side of the boundary without moving their boundary. It's impossible. And you can't set up a boundary all by yourself either. You have to have support. Because when you set up a boundary, the other person's got a boundary in their face. by realizing this, by learning this, say, this week in this beautiful retreat, that a neighbor or a man in the office or a woman in the office or whoever it might be, does not believe in this sort of thing and treats me exactly the same as before. Yeah? Because they hit my gut. And so I removed it. That's why I said, I've removed my side of the barrier. I feel not in compassion with this person. It's not to remove the barrier. It's to remove your belief that you're separate from these people who hate your guts. That's... It may not change it the tiniest bit.

[86:35]

So when this woman walks around the block and she goes back in the house, she has just had an argument with her husband. Her kids are upset and they want lots of Christmas presents. She didn't want to buy them. It's a big mess in there. Things have not changed. But she doesn't feel separate from them anymore, so she's very happy to be with these people who hate her guts. But they still hate her guts. But she went on a little tour where everybody helped her open her eyes. Now she's back with people who do not have that experience. Nothing has changed. But you are awake to the fact that these people who hate your guts are not separate from you. So you're fine. And they actually aren't separate from you, even if they don't realize it, they're wrong. If they think they're separate, and therefore they hate your guts, or whatever, they're wrong, that's all. They're misinformed. And most people are like that. But when you don't believe that anymore, they are totally part of what you realize, but they may not realize it.

[87:42]

And now do you want to hear from Berendt? Do you still want to talk after all that? I do. Great. But I want to say something else. Wait a second. Do you want to hear from Bernd? Say something before the thing he wanted to say? God, these people are very supportive, Bernd. Wow, this is amazing. It's difficult, because using separation creatively, I can split myself up in practitioner, being very interested, who has a question, which would prolong our talk. And then, by all of you, I'm being put into this world of caretaker, of the meditation hall, and I would suggest an end, thinking also of people. Yeah, would you like us to forego the usual end of lecture and just go right into service?

[89:10]

Would you like to do that? Okay. Is that okay with everybody else? All right. So let's set up for service.

[89:19]

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