So how do these clashes function at that time? That's to think about. Okay, so... Then the next one, which is always present, is what in the Theravada? In the Abhidhamma da Sangaha. What is the fourth one that they tell you is always present in an autism state? Daka. Restlessness. Here's one that's, where is it on the list, by the way?

[01:14]

See on the list? It's in the whatever. That's a good place for it. this word, this dharma, this mental function? Gunther defines it as frivolity, and technically it means that you don't penetrate the intrinsic awareness of the dharma.

[02:21]

You're attending to everything. This is restlessness. Somehow we talked about restlessness. It's not on the list. So this is another difference between Adamasangani and this later book.

[03:26]

It says here that... Number two, excitement. It might be, it might be excitement. So this is a characteristic of this Right here, Eric. Right there. Excitement. Oh, yeah. Excitement. So this list has a list of mental factors that are present, and they say whatever.

[04:27]

Sometimes they tell you what the whatever is. And in later texts, sometimes they include the whatever in the description. Why do they do that? Why? I don't know. At the time of the Abhidamata Sanghaha, Manasikara, or Manasikara, and Adi Moka, things like that, particularly Manasikara is considered to be always present in all states. But in the Dhammasangani, they don't even list it on the list. It's included in the whatever. Just those extra things that can be present sometimes. Why do they have a... an extra list that they don't include on their main list. They already had the things on the list, you see.

[05:51]

They already had them available to them. Why would they wait until later to put them on the list? See what I mean? I can see they keep making up new dharmas to take care of new problems. They had them already, so why would they just sort of have them over on the side there? Why would they put them on their list? They had nothing to lose. Maybe they included it in another term, although I don't know what it would be with this restlessness, because the Mala Skara, I think it was the other dhammas studies, they said that that was one aspect of why they put citta in this, the dhammas and kanyas. There's just one aspect of that called citta. Kirsten, while I'm looking at that list of right views, right intention, right speech, action, and so forth, the ones which are originally on the list, views, intention, endeavor, mindfulness, and concentration, are sort of seen as internal for speech, action, right, and what becomes externalized.

[07:16]

So it seems it may be that Or they already knew all that they need to know, They weren't relevant yet. They already knew about these functions of mind, but they weren't important in India at the time. Because people weren't asking questions about them. Or people didn't act that way, or people didn't think that way, so they didn't need them, but they knew about them. So many things... Do you have a question about why it's left out?

[08:24]

Why memory was left out? I guess we could talk about it. It's sort of a major discussion. I think we can talk about it. When we talk about perception, we'll talk about that. that question. So bring that up there a little bit. Because that fits right in there. If that's present in all unknown states, you also have quiet and balance and things like that in those unknown states and it doesn't seem to be in the same It says here.

[09:47]

It says here. Vipassana has been erroneously included in the text. Moral insight was as incompatible with immoral thoughts to the Buddhists as it was to Socrates and Plato. Hence also wisdom and mindfulness are excluded as well as faith. The commentary rules out that the followers of heretical dogmas and mere opinion can have but a spurious faith in their teachers, can only be mindful of bad thoughts, and can only cultivate deceit and delusion. Nor can there possibly be that six-fold efficiency of sense and thought, which is concomitant with good thoughts. So, What does the Atasamini say about the fact that concentration, which seems to be a virtue in a wholesome state, something you're trying to cultivate, what does it say about that being present in an unwholesome state?

[11:03]

But what else does it say? No, it says you must have concentration in order to do bad things. It doesn't say you can do bad things. It says a thief has to have it. It says a thief to be successful. Right. But what else does it say about concentration and vest? Has Van been here and went out for a minute? The reason why I think I missed you is because

[12:08]

Kathy's been hiding behind you all the while, you know, sticking her head out a little bit. Yes, I couldn't see you, you know, because I was trying to see her from behind you all this time. So, what does it say about concentration in an awesome state? John could describe it. Concentration has an ovals of state doesn't... doesn't scatter the various mental states. Doesn't scatter them. Doesn't scatter. That's good. I thought you were thinking about scattering, you know, scattering water on the ground.

[13:10]

If you sprinkle water on the ground, the sun comes and it dries it out. If you sprinkle it and you pound it down, then it'll stay wet even when the sun comes down there. You remember that one? That's the image of the concentration in a wholesome state. It'll last for, it does wet the ground, but it doesn't last. The concentration in a wholesome state calm the ground down and even the sun comes, it doesn't dry out right away. You polish it because it's wet deep through. So, concentration's present in both kinds of states, but it's not the same. It doesn't work the same in a person in a person in a person's states. It's the same with calm. You know, samatha. It's present in both states, but it doesn't mean the same thing. And here it says, anyway, It's a mistake to have grasp or vipassana in the list.

[14:21]

So, can we cross it out? I don't know. Anyway, question mark. Okay, we already talked about lobha. Oh, it says, here it says that sometimes this restlessness is associated with a puffed up state of mind. accordingly, conceit, corresponding to conceit. Here it is not used in that sense. So in that sense, sometimes restlessness is that last flood, or the second to last flood. It's a good word.

[15:26]

I read the, excuse me, the 12th Akusuluchika on the chart is, has the yu dependence on the restlessness. Mm-hmm. Right. It's under Mohan. Right. It's under Mohan. It has the kicked up state. So what's your point? Anything? Well, I'm not quite sure where this... This is later, this goes along with the Abhidamata Sangha, this chart. But they speak of these, like in the 12th morning, the Dhammasangani, the 12th state, they're talking about it with Utica.

[16:31]

They have in here. Oh, you've looked in the Dhammasangani? Yeah, in the Dhammasangani, under the 12th, Well, the state of the Bay of Consciousness is that you're doing there. It is? In the definition, but not in the Dharmas. It is in the Dharmas. Distraction. Is it in the Dharmas? Uh, yeah. Distraction. Okay. So these are just, uh, three type, like, in this first one, hate is, is not there either. in the first aid, there's no aid. But there is solution, but they only have solution of all this. But there's no aid in the first aid. But here in the, other than what, it says, these four, moha, ahirata, ah, [...]

[17:36]

Well, they say that moha is common to all types. They also say that udaka is. But here, it's in the twelfth kind that they listed in the Abhidamati Sangaha. Excitement. That's what they call it here. Is it the Dhamma Sangani? In the Dhamma Sangani, it has Udhaka as excitement. But it may be just that, for some reason or other, it's... That's why I was asking this question before. It says here, or whatever in the first one. Are you following that? In the first one it says, or whatever. It has a Dhamma list and it says, or whatever. And down the footnote it says, or whatever. And that could be like excitement, Udhaka. In the last one, it says, the 12th one, it says, associated with excitement in the description, as it says in the description, Abhidhamat Sangaha.

[18:48]

But then in the Dharma list, it also has excitement. It may be just that, you know, that reason why they brought it up. Why would they have it in the whatever list and not show it? I don't know exactly. There may... the way their minds work is not exactly systematic. But in some sense it seems to be somewhat systematic, but maybe it's just prompted by the fact that it's in the description. Somebody might think about that. Anyway, let's go through this list and see if there's anything more here. Unconscientiousness, lust, blah, blah. Okay, and now we, so... Anybody else have anything they want to talk about in this list?

[20:00]

Any other dharmas they want to cover right now? Anyway, you go down the list and then it says, next is dullness and lust, lust and dullness and covetousness. And you come to this thing called the summary. And what's the purpose of the summary, do you think? The wrong mindfulness is that you don't have any pulsing stuff, you don't have any mindfulness.

[22:00]

Well, what is mindfulness like? Literally, mindfulness means memory, right? So what does it mean? What is mindfulness? What is characteristic of mindfulness? You're not necessarily aware of what you're doing. It sounds consequential. You can be totally oblivious after what you're doing and still have that concentration.

[23:07]

And you can be in a trance and do that. You can be mindful or not mindful in the test. But I guess you can't really be mindful. Always mindful in the list for transits. See in the list for transits. Yeah. Just look real quickly. But that's right. I think that one to one point is you can have very exclusive kind of awareness. John? Well, I was going to bring it back to this idea of the book. The part is fear to do evil in fear of the consequences, fear of the way. So you can be in that state and not be mindful of the relationship with the consequences. So there's some slight difference, you can go a little bit further then, because couldn't you be concentrated on those factors too?

[24:37]

What's the difference between mindfulness then? Isn't there a presence? A presence of... He's having some... some basic... Basic meaning? In your own existence, such that you don't cross it. You don't cross it? That, to me, is... maybe the difference between unwholesome and wholesome, just the whole idea of whole, you know? Or the whole idea of not. That type of concentration, the unwholesome man, it's not coming from dead center. It's not non-waving. It's off-beam. Off-beam or partial, not whole.

[25:39]

And that's why when someone is... present in these states, they can break apart someone else's concentration. You can break apart someone's concentration? Yeah, you can deter their act, or you can maybe come deep behind their act and take the base so they have their... But I think, are we getting at the meaning of mindfulness by that? I can see how these two would function together that way, but mindfulness, we still haven't got at mindfulness, I don't think, completely. I think Mark and John pointed out limitations of a mental one-pointedness in this situation. So what can mindfulness do that mental one-pointedness can't?

[26:40]

Would mindfulness have some right views with it? Would you have right views or some other thing? Mindfulness by itself, what is mindfulness be able to, what does it do? Well, in the self-internative, it says that mindfulness is the only way that you can become mindful. And Lama Govinda, I can't really have a concluded thing. Lama Govinda opposes self-internative, Okay. So, it recalls, it brings back to mind?

[27:45]

Is it like, is it the image that keeps things from floating to the surface? Keeps things from floating to the surface and floating away? That imagery? What I see is the mindfulness itself allows you to become aware because it's always prevalent. This, the presence, that our wholesome activity comes from it. It's always within our recall. To be mindful is to have it within it. To bring that back. To bring that back. And to be within somebody's presence who is mindful of that. When you're in one person. It recalls that within yourself. So there's always some awareness of that presence.

[28:54]

If someone else brings it back, though, what good is that to you if they walk away? Maybe a mindfulness does that for people and then gives them a chance to take a fresh breath of their buddhi-meshi. But that's your mindfulness, I guess. It doesn't do them any good, I don't think. It's not floating on the surface like pumping pots into the water. Yeah, not doing that. So it... So mindfulness... Well, it enters into and plunges down to the object and it keeps you coming back to it.

[29:56]

And instead of keeping you coming back to like the point, keeping on the point, it particularly catches, it has a tendency to catch stuff as it floats away and brings you back. So it has the ability to be, mental one-pointedness seems to be, brings things in. Whereas mindfulness seems to have more of the ability to bring things back, catch things that are thrown away. There's no difference like that. If you add time to that, it means like letting go, too. Where I guess you'd have to let go to be mindful. You'd have to catch it and just sort of let it pass through you. But you would get stuck with the concentration. Where is letting go through it again? Well, to be mindful means that the aspect of time, to be mindful means that you're always aware of what you're doing.

[31:08]

So when you recall something, to feel the next instant, you have to let go of the essence. Whereas it seems that concentration, you could get stuck. It's not moving, the concentration. Yeah, yeah. Maybe it's the motion leading to the body. It's how people say that mindfulness is me of honor. I don't see how that's the situation. Well, you retain the water. It seems like he's stuck with me. Or that there's greed in the body of God. There's focus. Concentrate.

[32:09]

You mean when you're one point at this? Yeah, at one point you can just say something like that. List that with something and concentrate. Whatever it is, it changes. I mean, like if you're one point at a certain situation, that situation is going to change all the time. Maybe at one point in this has a quality of excluding things in the sense that it was focused and had a focus that excludes many, many possible abilities. But mindfulness is actually not inclusive. and the quality of bringing things back means an awareness of presence. So 360 degrees or whatever is around can all be brought back or be viewed in the sense of being a presence.

[33:14]

So the one-pointedness could be oblivion. There's unawareness of possibilities. Mindfulness actually would include. The mental one-pointedness also has to do with one-pointedness of the other factors. So once you bring it back from whatever realm you have it, it then can be operated upon by mental unpointerness. Then mental unpointerness can be used on whatever it is, whatever the realm that you're watching. You can collect the energies of various mental functions on the object. And actually,

[34:19]

I think we would study this later too, but then there's two other factors that are important. One is, three others are important. One is Chanda, the other one is Adimoka, and the other one is Manaskara. So they also fill in the idea that Chanda keeps you interested in the object, keeps you working towards it. Manaskara turns makes the original, the initial turn towards it. And adimoka is the, what's adimoka? Determination? Determination. It's an ultimate facing of the object, keeping on and selecting that object and staying with that object, making the ability to stick, you know, that object and stay with that object as being one. So these are several aspects that work together. And most clearly, all can be, all except for mindfulness can seem to have the ability to work for either a neutral or a positive or a negative end.

[35:37]

But anyway, anything good needs chanda, needs mindfulness, needs manaskara, needs adimokka, needs mental wellness. In order to perform any good act, or progress towards a path you need all of those functions. So I'd like to quickly run over this summary here. When we looked at the first state of consciousness, we didn't go over the summary. There's a summary section and the emptiness section at the end. We didn't do it. So you might, at this point, look back at the first moment of consciousness on page, I believe, 27, is it? 26 and the other summary there. Okay? And then you can turn back to 103. So you have the summary.

[36:43]

So what do you think the purpose of the summary is? Yeah, yeah. So on that occasion, the skandhas are four, and what are the four skandhas? What? Are we all in this section now? Did everybody find it? Page 103. Maybe you can have 103 and 26 available. Okay, so it says, on 103 it says skandhas are four, and I asked what are the four skandhas, and Blanche said, Everything but form. Okay. And the spheres are two, and what are those? What are the spheres? What? Okay, look back to page 27, 26.

[37:51]

What are the spheres? Ayatnas. Okay. And so here, the Ayatnas on page 103, the Ayatnas are two. On page 26, the Ayatnas are two. What are the two? Manindri Ayatna. Manindri Ayatna. And Dharma Ayatna. Did you get that? What's Manandriyatna? What is that? Manandriyatna? What's Endriyatna? So what is it? Manandriyatna. Manandriyatna. And then what's the other one? Dharmayatna?

[38:52]

You said? What's that? You just said it. No. So I just said it a little bit before that. Mind object. Right, mind object or non-sensuous object. Okay. Is that clear? And then elements are two. And what are the elements? Okay, which ones are they? Which are the two? Mm-hmm. And Dharma Doctor. But does that make sense, that there would be two? Manavajna Doctor and Dharma Doctor? Does that make sense? Wouldn't there be one more? It says there's only two, but isn't that wrong?

[39:54]

It's right also, but isn't it wrong? Wouldn't there be another one? Don't dattu always come in threes? Right. But they repeat these things. So, what would the third dattu be? So you'd have mind organ, manodhatu, mind consciousness element, manodhjnanadhatu, and the object, dharmadhatu. Okay, then the nutriments are three, both in this state and in the first state. What are the nutriments?

[40:59]

on page 103? What are the nutrients? And what do those mean? This book. The Paul Addiction I have. The definition for mental impression is a condition for the three times of feeling. A condition for the three times of feeling. Agreeable, disagreeable. Indifferent. And mental bullishness, carnal. which means it feeds reader, and then consciousness feeds mind, at the moment of conception, feeds mind form.

[42:16]

So what are these? What are these nutrients? Did you see? Where'd they come from? Huh? Is that the elements? Why are they grouped like this? What's the advantage of grouping them like this? What are they trying to show? Did you find it? Okay. Faculties are five. Where are the faculties? Faith?

[43:45]

What? They're five. In 103, what are the five faculties? So on page 27, what are they? There's eight on the first page and five on the... There's eight in the wholesome and five in the unwholesome. The kid in the jhana is five. What are the jhana? What?

[44:49]

Yeah, not someone else. That's pretty good. Okay, then the path are four. The powers are four. And the causes are two. And back in the first one it says the causes are three. What are the causes there? All the causes. Right. And so you see they use the word hetu here for cause. Usually we say root. But anyway, she said cause. Root's a little bit better.

[45:51]

The root in this, the use of root here is better, but you just use hetu and then you know which it means in one case and which it means in the other. Okay, and the rest are pretty similar, aren't they? Okay. Okay, now I'd like you to, for next time, I'd like to start studying I don't know if you have some idea. I'd like to go and start studying the process of perception. And to study the process of perception, you have, as I mentioned a number of times, and as you rub by rub, Buddhists choose the paradigm of perception

[47:01]

as the way to teach the Dharma. There are various other mental functions, but the paradigm of perception is the one they use the most. The dhatus and ayatmas are built on the model of perception, object, organ and consciousness.

[47:17]

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