Yes. Right now, part of the life science, it's a discussion with the Dalai Lama, Western psychologist and philosopher. And he talked about a similar subject that we're talking about today, about how to deal with a negative emotion. He was recommending, Dalai Lama was recommending three different ways, and he was talking about them as levels of skill permits to work with. It's kind of a low beginners way, all the way up to the expert. And it seemed like the expert's way was to really welcome it in to the house. So I was wondering if you could touch on that, if there was anything. He's saying it's a dangerous situation to welcome it in, but you also welcome it. You mean, in the beginner's way, he wasn't recommending welcoming? He was recommending welcoming. Pardon? He was recommending an antidote. So you're saying in the case of hatred, he would suggest maybe an antidote at the beginning level.

[01:17]

However, that antidote, you called it love, right? So I said love too. But, so the beginning part of love for bodhisattva is, this is a beginning level for someone who needs to learn to live for the welfare of others. The beginning level of love is to, I think you said... Anyway, to give loving kindness, but to make it a gift. And also, to... So, yeah, just give loving kindness towards anger. And... And, yeah, so that, to me, that broadens out into welcoming it, saying thank you for it, thank you friend, thank you anger.

[02:19]

So, I could analyze giving into stages. that can be analyzed into beginning, middle and advanced stage of giving. But it sounds like he started with giving too, in this case of anger, to practice giving first. The advanced stage of giving is perfect wisdom, where you understand that The giver, the gift, and the gift have no independent existence of each other. That's the advanced level of giving. And the same with the other aspects of compassion. They warm us up for wisdom, and then when they're joined with wisdom, in a sense, they're more advanced. Please come up.

[03:27]

His name is Sean. Hi Sean. What's your name? I'm Jason. Jason. One of the things I heard you say today tilt this like this for you like this Yeah, one of the things that I heard you talking about in compassion today. This is what I heard you say I don't know if that's what you said but there I think three parts to compassion you added patience at the end, but you also said kind and careful ethics Could you expound a little bit more on the careful well for example I might, you might ask me, and I might feel like, okay, I'll give it to you. And as I start, like the top of this cup, you might say, can I have the top of that?

[04:34]

Would you pass me the top of the cup? And I might feel like, sure. Or you might even say, would you give me that cup? The top. Now, this cup doesn't really belong to me, but I might still say, sure. I'm happy to give it to you. At that moment, I might not think, well, this actually doesn't belong to me. Who does this belong to? I don't even know. But who does this belong to? Maybe it belongs to the temple. Maybe it is mine. I didn't know. But you asked for it, and I felt like, hey, Jason, And as I'm giving it to you, I realize, well, wait a minute, maybe I should find out whose this is. My first impulse of compassion is to be generous to you. My second is, maybe... And also, as I give it to you, I don't just toss it at you. Like I might say, yeah, and toss you this and hit you in the face with it. So it's more compassionate in the sense to say, yes, I'd like to give this to you, and then be careful about how I pass it to you so that it doesn't get broken.

[05:38]

You don't get hurt. And you feel that I'm not only generous with you, but I'm careful with you. Now, some people also meet someone and they say, oh, and they feel, I'd like to give you, no, I'd like to give you something, like I'd like to give you a kiss. But they don't check with the person whether the person would like it. So then, you know, really disrespected because you didn't say, you know, I have this impulse, you know, even to tell someone I feel like I'd like to give you a kiss might be considered, you know, harassment. But you actually might feel a generous thought of, you know, I've got this beautiful kisser here and I'd like to offer it to the... And that's kind of a warm thing. But then I should be careful, like... maybe he wouldn't like that. So maybe I won't mention it to him that I'll have this kiss to give him because it might not be helpful. And in some cases, you might ask for this lid and I might feel like I'm happy to give it to you and I might check and find out

[06:49]

that it doesn't belong to me, and I maybe have to go ask who it does belong to and say, could I give this to Jason? And they might say yes, and I bring it to you. Because the cup, the lid's... But I should make sure. There's a... For bodhisattvas, sometimes they get asked to make very big donations. And sometimes they feel like they'd like to do it. Like maybe their house... But it says, it's fine. You should check with your family before you give their house away. And so some people also get asked to make donations and they just feel like, yes. But then you should be careful and say, now if I actually give that, will there be any giver's regret? Think about it. Okay, so you're careful and then you go ahead and give it. Other cases you say, you know, I think I might regret it. Maybe I should give half as much or something like that. I think that, yeah, that would be a more appropriate amount.

[07:51]

So first step is giving. Second step is ethics, where you're really careful about the way you give or what you do. You make sure about, you check the relationship around it. So giving could actually turn into cause of resentment. Yes. If not careful. It could cause resentment in the one who gives. Yeah. Which is no good. Like somebody asks you for something and you give it before they give it. And then you give it and you resent. You feel like they forced you. And I have an example of that, you know, I often tell is that one time somebody gave, I saw somebody and he had this beautiful new automatic pencil and he gave it to somebody as a gift and I saw them and I said, that is a beautiful pencil and he had another one and he gave it to me. So then I went home and I came in the house and I put, I had the pencil in my hand and my wife said, can I have that? And in my heart I felt like, no. And I felt a little bad about it, but actually there was a no here rather than a yes.

[08:59]

And I didn't give it because I didn't really want to. But then the next day, I did want to, and I gave it to her, and there was no resentment. Then it was fine. But when she first asked, there was a no. So I don't give to make people think I'm generous. I don't want to give so that people think I'm generous. I want to give because I want to give. And if I don't feel generous, I want to be honest and say, hey, I'm stingy today. I'm sorry I'm stingy, but that's what I am, Mr. Stingy. But tomorrow I might be Mr. Generous, so hang in here with me. Good, thank you. Was there another? Yes, please. Margaret.

[10:02]

I was wondering if you could speak to self-hatred and self-love first. Speak to self-hatred first or self-love first? Both. Speak of both first? Maybe self-love can speak out. Why can't I speak of self-hate? You can talk about that. Well, if I... Well, like, again, like yesterday I was saying, sometimes I do things and a thought, a voice comes up in my mind That was stupid. And even sometimes my hand comes up and goes like... Not to be mean, but like, how could you do such a stupid thing? I sometimes think that. You might say, well, that doesn't qualify as self-hate, but that's the best I can do sometimes. And then when I do that, I usually snap out of it and say, don't be so mean to him, but be nice to this stupid guy. I mean, you know, you know, stupid little Rebbe, I love you.

[11:09]

So when I do, when I think, kind of like, when I think I'm really like, how about something more serious, you know, like if I'm cruel to someone, I still want to be kind to myself and say, well, I was really unkind and I'm really sorry that I was unkind. And practicing confession about my unkindness is an act of compassion, love. And feeling sorrow when I don't do things that I would like to do, and I do things that I don't want to do, that sorrow is also an act of love. It's called repentance. So the correct type of confession and repentance are towards myself who is unskillful sometimes. Now I'm not so much, I'm not into, I don't confess other people's unskillfulness, but if I see them being unskillful, I would give them, then the way of compassion isn't for me to confess their shortcomings, but maybe receive their confession

[12:29]

And when they confess their shortcomings, to see that they're practicing compassion when they do that. It isn't just that they're telling me something, that they did something bad, and I agree with them. They're telling me something bad, and I agree with them, maybe, that it was bad, and I think, great, you're practicing compassion. And I might say that to them. What you did was not good, but the fact that you're confessing it, a Buddha would do the same. Well, maybe I shouldn't say a Buddha wouldn't make that mistake, but a great bodhisattva might make that mistake. And everybody makes mistakes, but bodhisattvas confess their mistakes. And their confession of their mistakes is compassion. And they feel sorry, and that sorrow is compassion. So confession and repentance for shortcomings are And one shortcoming is to hate ourselves when we make mistakes. So the one mistake is to make some kind of mistake. The second mistake is to hate ourselves. So then we can confess the first mistake and confess the second mistake.

[13:32]

And those both are acts of compassion to a mistake maker. Does that transmute negative karma? Does that transmute negative karma? Yes, it does. But it not only transmutes negative karma, it melts away the root of negative karma. Margaret. Yes. Welcome. Hi, David. Hi, David. You know, David, I just... Ken Kesey on the internet, and he looks a little like you. Although, is he still alive? No, yeah, anyway. That's the way he might be. You might be Ken, no, you're too old.

[14:35]

So I've been hearing a lot about how Buddhism is about the real world. It's not something abstract, not something about some No, it's about both. It's about an abstract world, and it's about, and you said the real world, and it's about the world of birth. So that's where my question comes in, and sometimes I get stuck on language. I hope it's not just a technical question, but you spoke of the world... where there is no birth or death, the larger world. But again, I say it's not exactly larger. It's a world that's beyond measurement. It's not larger or smaller. It's the world of the true nature of the world of appearance. So we chat here almost every morning.

[15:39]

We talk about the heart of perfect wisdom scripture. And it talks about the way things are, the ultimate nature of the way things are, is that they're insubstantial. That they're empty of any substantial independent existence. And in that insubstantiality, there's death. There's life, but it's a life that isn't a life of birth and death. It's a life of freedom from birth and death. But in our experience of that freedom of birth and death, we're experiencing it after we're born and before we die. When we experience freedom from birth and death, we experience it in life, and the life that experiences it is not a life that's born or dies. So there's two kinds of life in Buddhism. One is called samsara, which means going around death.

[16:41]

The other is nirvana, and nirvana is called the birthless and the deathless. So freedom is one way of life, and cyclic existence is another way of life. Bondage to birth and death is one kind of life. It's a life that goes life, death, life, death. It's a kind of living, and it's painful. There's another kind of life which is not born and doesn't die, and it's not eternal either. It's impermanent, but it doesn't arise and cease. So in the Heart Sutra it says, there's no increase, no birth, no death, no purity, no defilement. In the world of insubstantiality, which is ultimate truth of things, in the insubstantiality of me, in the insubstantiality of you, in the interdependence of me, in the interdependency of you, in that realm we have a life. It's a life of birth and death. It's a life of peace.

[17:43]

But it's a life. It's an infinite life. It's a beginningless and endless life. And that nirvana, that state of nirvana, would seem to be something that one would not be able to realize. Well, there's two kinds of nirvana. No, you don't experience it when you're in delusion. In delusion, you don't experience it. But when you understand delusion, you realize it. Again, nirvana is not an experience. It's a kind of life. If you want to make life into experiences, put it into something. Experiences arise and cease. Nirvana is not exactly experience. It's peace with experience. So when you're having experiences and you're really at peace with it, that's nirvana. So nirvana, you can walk around and have experiences, but when you understand their selflessness and their interdependence and their selflessness, when you understand that, when you enter into the creative process of birth and death, you realize what we call nirvana or peace.

[18:50]

Peace with birth and death. and peace with birth and death, that kind of life lives together with the life of birth and death. It just... the one's an illusory process and the other is the ultimate true process. But they're both life. Birth and death is life. It's a kind of life. Death is a kind of life. And so we... and most of us... as life and death, and that's a painful way to see it. It's a difficult way to see it. There's beauty there, and as you see the beauty of it, you start to realize peace right in the middle of the birth and death, and Nirvana's right there. You're welcome. Is your name David? Is your name David? My name is David, yes. Still? Still David, yes. Anything else today?

[19:57]

My name is Zoe. Zoe. Here's a microphone for you. Hold it up like this. I'm wondering how people in the helping professions can manage not feeling so responsible for the suffering that they encounter on a daily basis. And when you combine that with world news... Can you stop there? Sure. You're in the helping profession. So bodhisattvas are in the helping profession. Okay? But they're artistic helpers. They want to enter into the creativity of it. So they have... a very big responsibility for the welfare of beings. And they're really committed to live for that purpose. And I could say, because of that, they need to not take this wonderful, immense responsibility too seriously.

[21:15]

Because if you take it too seriously, you get what's called exhaustion or early retirement. You know? or hating the people you're trying to help because you think they're killing you. But they're not killing you. It's just that if you don't relax and play and create, the way of relating to them kills you. Because that way of relating to them is, you know, kind of like resentment. So like actually some psychotherapists maybe and some doctors and some people, other nurses that are helping people, they give themselves and then they... So that resentment then turns into a big obstacle. That's why I say, okay, first of all, really commit to the care and welfare of your friends, of your clients, of your patients. And then relax.

[22:17]

Relax. They're coming to learn that from you. They're not relaxed with their suffering. they're generally taking their suffering seriously enough that they're, well, that most are coming voluntarily to get help. Some people are being forced. They take, but also they take their distrust of the caregiver seriously too. So, you know, they're just taking things seriously and they're suffering. They need somebody to teach them how to relax with what they're taking seriously. But isn't that we diminish the importance of this suffering? we really care for it and liberate beings from it. Diminishing it is fine, but the bodhisattva wants to actually liberate beings from it. Eventually completely cure them of all suffering and distress. In order to do that, the bodhisattva needs to learn how to do it and relax and play and create with these people.

[23:24]

And so all caregivers that learn this will be able to liberate, will be able to do this, and then they can teach their partner, the patient, they can teach the patient how to enter the process. So one of my favorite stories about this is a story about a kind of mystical psychoanalyst. They call him, I think they call him the Prophet of Plymouth, or maybe I made that name up for him. The Prophet of Plymouth. Because he lived in Plymouth, England. His name was Donald Winnicott. How many people know that name? So he was this wonderful, compassionate being. He was a medical doctor, I think, and a psychoanalyst.

[24:28]

So one story is this mother brought her daughter, quite young, to see him. And this little girl had really bad...had really strong seizures, very painful seizures. And she was like, you know, she was crying all day long practically. So the mother came with this little girl. And eventually the little girl came over to Winnicott and climbed up on his lap. and started to play with his tie, pull on his tie and throw his tie around. Somehow she, in other words, she relaxed enough to come over to him and he was relaxed enough, she dared to come over to him and she was relaxed enough to start playing with his tie. And he supported, he was part of that play, he supported her to play.

[25:33]

This is a really suffering creature who was drawn to this relaxed in this being who was really open to play with her because he knew that this girl needed to learn how to play. Children who know how to play are doing what they're supposed to be doing. Children who don't know how need somebody to teach them. And the age of childhood really end. We all need to learn to play You've got to relax in order to play. So she started to play with him. Then she started to pull the tongue depressors out of his breast pocket and throw them around the room. And he let her. And then on another occasion she Oh, yeah. On another occasion, somehow, I don't know if she was using his gloves, but she put some gloves on.

[26:42]

You know, that's a playful act. And then she pulled the gloves off as a playful act. And then she was going to pull her fingers off as a playful act, and they didn't come off. But she was in the realm of creativity. So when she, in that realm of relaxation and playfulness and creativity, when the fingers didn't come off, she was totally surprised. And when we're in this space with ourselves and others where we're being relaxed and playful and creative, sometimes a surprise will happen. And when that surprise happens, a great transformation occurs. The surprise is, you know, something unexpected. What would that be? What would that be? Well, I call it creation. Or a work of art suddenly emerges from the space.

[27:44]

And I think like the next day, her seizures stopped. And in a few days after that, the rashes went away. And after not too long, she came back to visit And she was like just a happy, healthy little girl, you know, with still not completely enlightened, but at least she was in the ballpark now. Now she could play, you know, now she could relax and play. And what, I don't think Winnicott said this, maybe he did, but I think, you know, this mother, who of course loved this little girl, probably couldn't relax with her. And once you don't relax with a child and they pick that up from you, they start to get sick. And when they start to get sick, then it's even harder to get sicker because you're showing them more tension and no playfulness. And children need somebody to teach them how to relax with suffering.

[28:50]

They do suffer. Somebody needs to teach them how to relax. And adults who are suffering need to learn how to relax with it, but also honor the suffering, be kind to it, and then relax with it, and then play with it. But it's hard to play with somebody when they're in a lot of pain unless you're relaxed, and it's hard to relax unless you know, I'm here for you, man. You know, I'm really here for you. And part of being here for you is I'm going to relax with you. I'm not going to tense up around your suffering. I'm going to relax with it because you need to relax with it. And I even need to relax with my idea that you need to relax. You don't want to get on a relaxation high horse here. Oh, Gamowin, you want me to tense up?

[29:53]

I'll tense up. Fine. Welcome. Was there another man back there who wanted to come up? Yes. Would you ring that bell, please? The big one, please. Thank you. What's your name? My name is Stephen. Stephen. Yes. So my younger brother recently... to take up practice. And so I'm excited about that possibility of his heart really opening. But also I kind of realize that he's maybe getting himself into a lot of trouble that he's not expecting.

[30:57]

Yeah. And so I'm wondering about how I can encourage him in his practice and speak up and say something, but without confusing my joys and practice for his joys and my troubles for his troubles and let him have his own experience of. Well, I don't know if this is right, but the first thing I think of is this guy who calls me granddaddy. In a sense, he's like your brother. He's feeling his way into practice, but not so literally. Like when he comes here, by practice, right? He knows it's here. Why don't you talk about the awesome radiance of the knife? So he knows about practice. He knows about, you know, Buddhas and stuff like that. I don't have to tell him anything. So just kind of don't talk about it.

[32:02]

If he wants to talk about it, that's fine. But kind of just be quiet about it and just be relaxed with him. And I would kind of say don't bring it up. But if he brings it up, try to get him to turn it back to him. How do you feel about that? How do you see that? So you don't teach him to like start looking to you for what practice is about. Accept that he is looking at you and he's seeing what practice is about. And what does it look like? It looks like somebody who is happy. Me to be happy. He wants me to be happy, but he's not trying to get me to be happy. He's accepting me at my present level. He wants my heart to open. I know that. I can see that's what he's working on. He thinks that's cool. But he's not trying to get me to open my heart. He accepts my heart as it is. And he's not telling me that I should be more open. And I think maybe you didn't tell him to do that, and that's why he's starting to practice.

[33:08]

You didn't force him to start to practice so he could. Right? And if you... So that's why we've got to like... How can you like this so much and you're not proselytizing? This must really be good. So just be quiet with him and be a resource. But don't do too much. Except in your heart you wish the very best for him. And give him the very best, which is just be with him and don't do anything. And if you ask for something, then again, if you want the lid of a cup, you say, well, I'm happy to... Am I happy to give it? Look at yourself. It might be very helpful for him if he asks you for a cup lid, that you might say, I'm feeling selfish right now. Say, oh, he's aware he's selfish. Sometimes when people are doing, sometimes people ask me, you know, I love to be in a sangha where people are practicing, but then I go to work and people are really selfish.

[34:16]

What should I do? And I say, well, if people are being really selfish, you might say that you're feeling really selfish. But honestly check out, you know, the thing in yourself and tell them. that you find the thing in yourself which you have a problem with them having. And actually, they probably would agree with you. Are you following this? Rude, and then you look at yourself and you say, you know, I'm kind of rude too. And then you tell the person, you know, I'm feeling really rude. That was really rude of me. And the person says, I wonder why he said that. Who was that masked man? So, you know, do the practice on yourself in his presence. Don't try to get him to do it. And tell him your problems with practice, if you have them, and you think it would be appropriate to share it. But don't try to get him to practice. I think that he'll find his true way rather than getting...

[35:19]

You should be doing what you want him to do. Because you do want him to practice. But that shouldn't be the reason he starts. But you could be a reason why he thinks it seems to be really good for him. And it might be good for me, so I'm going to try it. And then he might have questions about how to practice. And you can say, well, I found this is helpful, and I found that's helpful, rather than, brother, you should do this, and brother, you should do that, because that would be good for you. You're welcome. Yes? Thank you. You're welcome. And... Thanks for making muffins. Oh, you're welcome. Was the guy who was teaching you how to make muffins this morning, is his name Cliff? Cliff. What's the guy who was making muffins this morning?

[36:22]

Huh? Cliff? Might be Cliff. Who else could be doing it? Nobody else? Did you find out who was teaching the... Shogchi, did you find out who was the head of the crew this morning? I wanted to talk to him about something. And she was working on his crew today, making the muffins. And I tasted one and they were really good. Yes? Interesting, as you were speaking about some of the techniques as far as what the person, you know, to do or not to do, in his, the way you were answering his question, and in the past, I have been exposed or encounter with other beings who do that, which literally turned me off because I felt they were just acting and it was not genuine.

[37:35]

So to answer, go back to the feeling of what was happening is, for example, there were many times that when I was encountering with my children, they would listen very genuinely, and I would just say it one time or two times, and that was it. And then my ex-husband was told how to say things in a certain way or do things in a certain way, and he always was wondering how come I say it, it works, and he says it, it doesn't work. So I'm just kind of questioning about the genuinity like when you mentioned, I'm sorry, this is taking me so long. I'm just trying to figure out what's the realness of when you said to, whether when we're saying something to somebody because we've done it or I come from that place, it depends if we're

[38:39]

from our heart versus to criticizing or to let the person know as in a way of, I don't know, there's this ungenuinity to me in that direction or teaching. Strictly speaking, whenever we offer something to someone, and we think we're doing it, and they're separate from us, we're not really genuine. Unless we offering is to say, you know, I'm not really genuine. Because genuinely, we're not somebody separate from the person we're trying to help. So when a parent is teaching a child and the parent thinks they're separate from the child, or when the parents think they're separate from their spouse and they're speaking from that place, they're not yet completely genuine.

[39:46]

We have to enter into the creative relationship with, for example, the child and speak from there in order to really be genuine. So true genuineness to really be at the creative center of the interaction. And then it's not, I'm genuine, or you're genuine, it's that we have entered the place where we're genuine. And speaking from there is true genuineness. To the extent we're off-center, we're not there yet, then our offerings still can be compassion, it's just that the compassion is not authentic, it's not most vital because we're off-center from this creative process. We're holding a position of like, for example, I'm your mother, you're my child. Now, it doesn't have to be extremely tense there, but if you're a little bit tense and you're a little bit not playful and you're a little bit off-center from the creative process and you're a little bit inauthentic.

[40:54]

On the other hand, if you're just doing, you know, if you're completely wholeheartedly involved in doing the thing which you'd like your child to learn, and you don't think, oh, my child's over there separate from me, we're just doing this together, like, for example, at childbirth. We are kind of enlightened at childbirth. because they don't think, oh, good, there's me and the baby. I mean, they might think that, but mostly they're just into this, you know, they're actually, it's so intense that they're actually relaxed sometimes. They actually relax because they realize to be tense. And they're actually playful. And they're actually in the middle of creation at that moment. And the child is getting, has a good teacher at that time. And the child says, okay, I'll go through this. This is really stressful. God, what a pressured situation.

[41:58]

Oh, yeah, okay. But because mother's there, they're willing to give it. They're coming. They're going to do it. They're willing to live. So in that situation, the mother's being a really good teacher sometimes. She's really showing what love is. He's not holding to the position of mother at that moment. And that's maybe one of the greatest moments of all time, aside from, you know, spiritual enlightenment in some other way. So men don't have that opportunity, but we can approach it with practice. And we can be authentic, and mothers can be authentic in childbirth, and mothers can be authentic other times too, but it requires that mother gives up, mother relaxes with being a mother. And father is playful with being a father.

[43:01]

And father is playful with being a father. And grandfather is playful with being grandfather. And grandmother is playful with being grandmother. And then grandmother and grandfather and mother and father and children can all play together. And then we can create together. And then we're authentic. Walk from that place. That's really genuine. And that might say exactly the same teaching. Clean your room. Or not so much clean your room. I want you to clean your room. Here we are in the middle of creation. And guess what? I want you to clean your room. And guess what? I want you to brush your teeth. Isn't that amazing? At the center of the universe, I want you to brush your teeth. I do. I'm amazed. I never thought I would. I thought when I got there, I'd say, whatever, man. But no. Here I am at the fulcrum of all creative activity, and I want you to brush your teeth. However, matter of fact, I think I'll brush mine.

[44:05]

And the play goes on. And then we're really authentic. But if we're off-center a little or a lot, what do you call it? We've alienated ourselves from the creative process of the universe. And we feel more or less it's a tragedy. Because we have this potential. Because we're there already. That's the story about, you know, where's Nanchuan? Where's the Zen master? Want some other Zen Master? Yeah, I want a real Zen Master. You do? When you're at the center of the universe, you're not bargaining anymore. You're free. You understand. You're authentic. But you can lose it. Playfulness is fragile. You can relax and be playful and then lose it.

[45:08]

Then you have to relax with, I lost, I was playful, I lost it. And then relax with losing it. And then you can find it again, but not necessarily on schedule that you'd like it to come up. You have to play with resentment, you have to play with pain, and you have to play with losing play. And in order to do that playfulness we have to relax with resentment, pain, fear, greed, fluid anger, anxiety, joy, playfulness, enlightenment. We have to relax with enlightenment, too, and play with enlightenment. and let go of enlightenment. So me and the guy that

[46:27]

that calls me granddaddy are going to go to a place where there's a water slide and I'm going to carefully throw myself down the water slide. Probably I will. He probably will ask me to. Come on, granddaddy, let's go on the water slide. Yes. Welcome, Barbara. So nice to see you, Tenjin Rishi. Nice to see you. Welcome to Green Driving Temple. It's great to be here. You used to live here, didn't you?

[47:30]

I did. Over 10 years ago. I mean, from 2000 to 2008. Okay. So, I felt a little troubled when you were just talking about being authentic. Yeah? It felt like I kind of... Were you authentically troubled? Yes. Good. So all of a sudden, it felt like there was this judgment dichotomy. And somehow it didn't seem to be in accord with what I've been hearing about the teachings. Because even, you know, being this being who Makes a separation between oneself and the other, which seems to be what we always tend to do. That's being authentic. I'm authentically creating this separation.

[48:36]

And I'm authentically being who is doing this. So I'm genuinely deluded. So... So I felt tense. And you were genuinely tense? I was genuinely tense. Good. And were you relaxed with being tense? I was, and, you know, the teaching you brought today about... or expressing oneself, I really felt like I needed to express my tension around this question so I wouldn't have it be a hindrance. Were you playful with the tension and the resentment?

[49:39]

Or are you playful with the tension and resentment? It seems like there's a connection between coming forward and acting on this feeling and entering into... Somehow there's some connection with the play. Mm-hmm. Right. That coming forward could be a playful coming forward. It was a... It was a dream? Yes. A dream come true? Yes, it was a dream come true. All right. And was it a true come dream? It was a true coming... I don't know. Where are you?

[50:46]

I was... just feeling happy and another dream coming true of relaxing with you. Congratulations. Thank you. Thank you. You're welcome. Now it's lunchtime. Thank you very much. up in the valley, and a young man came into the room where I was and went to a drawer in a cabinet in the room where there's lots of knives stored.

[51:47]

He took out one of them. He was playing with it. This is one where this boy calls me granddaddy. And this knife is a very sharp knife, one in the drawer. And he said, what are you doing? I said, I'm thinking about talk I'm going to give today in the meditation hall. He said, what are you going to talk about? I said... We're going to talk about the great vehicle. You say, what's the great vehicle? Is that like a car? Well, it's a way of practice that supports all living beings to peace and ease and enlightenment. And he said, you should talk about this knife and its awesome radiance.

[52:54]

One of the members of this community gave me this knife. So I did come to talk to you about the great vehicle. the path of universal freedom for all living beings. It's the path which the bodhisattvas walk. It's the path of moving forward to realize perfect enlightenment for the welfare of all living beings. And the last few talks I've been giving here on Sundays and also other places around the state, I've been talking about a text, an ancient text called, in Sanskrit, it's called Mahayana Samgraha.

[54:18]

Mahayana means the great vehicle, and Samgraha can be translated as summary, which sounds kind of cold. The Chinese translation of this text, they use a character together with the characters for the great vehicle, and the character they use is a character that I find more engaging. It can mean summary, but it also means to embrace and sustain. or to be embraced and sustained. It means to nurture and be nurtured. It's a great way of realizing enlightenment for the welfare of all beings. So there's the practice of embracing the great vehicle and there's a text which teaches a way to embrace So this text is in my heart and mind as I speak to you and it will be coming out in various ways as I speak to you.

[55:36]

This text is written by a sattva named Asanga who lived in India in the third and fourth century of the common era. When I say embracing and sustaining the great vehicle, you could also say embracing all living beings. Embracing and nurturing and developing all beings. This is the end of this talk. we will recite four vows of the bodhisattvas, the enlightening beings who walk the great vehicle. We do that at the end of lots of our Dharma events. They're called the four universal vows for bodhisattvas.

[56:47]

The first one, the way we'll chant it is, sentient beings are numberless. I vow to save them. Delusions are inexhaustible. I vow to end them. Dharma gates are boundless. I vow to enter them. The Buddha way is unsurpassable. I vow to become it. Now I would like to discuss in relationship to embracing the great vehicle. So the first one says that living beings, sentient beings are numberless, I vow to save them. And a lot of people when they hear that they think, how could I save all living beings? How could I even save them? Well, the way you save all sentient beings is

[57:52]

by embracing and sustaining all living beings. Some might say, well, how could I embrace and sustain all beings? Well, just every person you meet, treat them with great compassion. And some might say, well, how can I do that? How can I do that? How can I meet each person with great compassion? That's what my talk's about today. So the Bodhisattva's vow to save all beings, but that entails embracing every being. The Bodhisattva's vow to learn to embrace every living being. For example, embrace and sustain every human being. Every dog, every spider, every cockroach, every rat. Bodhisattva's vow to learn how to embrace all beings.

[58:58]

The next vow is delusions, and the word delusion is a translation of a Sanskrit term originally, which means delusion, but it also means affliction. It also means defilement. It means the way is such that we feel pain and distress. It's the way our mind is ignorant about things, and that's an affliction. And that's the defilement of our life. Our mind arises in such a way that it defiles our life. It constricts it. It stresses it. And these delusions are inexhaustible. And it says, I vow to end them. But again, The way to end them is to understand them.

[60:01]

If you understand them, in a sense they'll be ended because understanding is the medicine for delusion. Delusion is not understanding correctly. Delusion is mistake. Because we mistake what's going on in our life, if we understand the mistake, we're free of the mistake. So another way to say, That second vow is delusions and afflictions. Afflictive delusions are inexhaustible. I vow to understand them. And by understanding them, end them. But again, how do you understand them? By embracing them. Embracing the great vehicle means embracing all living beings and it means embracing all delusions. that's a pretty big deal embracing all delusions and embracing all beings so a little bit of comic relief before we get into this work horribly wonderful work I mean terribly great work as you know you may have noticed if the average age in this room was like 20 years lower you would all be very familiar with Red Bull

[61:39]

How many people do not know about Red Bull? Raise your hands. Red Bull is an energy drink. I don't know what it's got in it, but it's very expensive. And if you drink it, you will not be tired for a little while. If you're tired and you drink this, your inexhaustible tiredness will come to an end. So anyway, it's a very intense drink that young people drink when they want to study all night and so on. Other things. And it comes in various sized bottles. I've seen it, and I notice that they're quite expensive. And I must admit, I had one one time. And I felt very young after I drank it. And there's other energy drinks, another energy drink, Red Bull, right?

[62:47]

Bull. Bull. Red Bull. You know what bulls do when they say red, right? Anyway, it's called Red Bull. And there's other energy drinks, another one's called Red Bull. So these drinks are available. People are drinking them. And... And then after they drink them, they're quite energetic, but then eventually they would like to rest and calm down from the effects of these drinks. So without, you know, a doctor to get sedatives, they now have drinks available right next to the energy drinks for calming down. And someone just showed me one of the latest drinks is called Zazen. sitting meditation. It's called the Zazen sleep formula.

[63:52]

Calm your mind and sleep. So this is a non-prescription sleep medicine called Zazen. Now, of course, when we practice Zen meditation, we're actually trying to be awake. So this is a corruption of the teaching. But what do we do with this corruption? We embrace and sustain it. We love it. We don't like it, we love it. And by loving it, we will liberate beings from this corruption. So we're going to now talk about embracing all living beings and also embracing delusion. But it isn't just embracing delusion, although it includes embracing delusion.

[65:00]

If you've got a delusion, embrace it. Be compassionate towards delusions when you meet them in yourself and when you see others demonstrating delusion. When you have affliction in yourself or see others who are afflicted, be compassionate to that affliction. That's the beginning. Then we want to actually embrace the Dharma, the truth of the affliction. And in order to embrace the truth of the affliction, which would bring from the affliction, we embrace the dependent core rising of the affliction, the dependent core rising of the living being. We enter into the process. We become

[66:04]

compassion artists, we become wisdom artists. We enter into the creative process of living beings and the creative process of their delusions. And we enter the process by which our past action, our past karma becomes the future in the present. We look at the present in the creative process. In the present becomes the future. By which past karma becomes future karma. And by understanding this process we can act in the present with the most beneficial and vital and liberating way of acting. So again I'm I'm warming up to discuss how to enter the creative process of embracing and sustaining and understanding and liberating.

[67:12]

The bodhisattva is a welfare worker. The bodhisattva is a worker, a happiness worker, a liberation worker. The bodhisattva is an artist, is a scientist. The science of liberation, the art of liberation, the science of peace, the art of peace. The creative field of a bodhisattva The creative field of a bodhisattva, what do you think it is? Hmm? What's the creative field of an enlightening being? Don't be shy. I mean, be shy, but then tell me. What? The universe, yeah. Delusion. The universe, the deluded universe.

[68:30]

Bodhisattvas don't work in Truthville. They don't work in the true universe. There is a true universe, and they know how to go there. But they give up the true universe and come into the delusion universe. They're not doing caregiving in some place where they're not needed. They don't go to reality and say, okay, what can I do here? people are constricted and suffering. The artistic field of the bodhisattva is delusion, is affliction, is living beings. Unenlightened living beings is the field of the bodhisattva's artistic work. They work with the delusions and afflictions and suffering beings. They work with them. And that's their field of creativity. There's a sutra called the Vimalakirti Sutra, which is about a great layman who was and part of the sutra, part of the scripture is talking about cultivating or purifying Buddha lands or Buddha fields.

[69:52]

To make a long story short, part of that discussion is Someone asked, well, what is the bodhisattva's Buddha land? What is the Buddha land of a bodhisattva? And the Buddha land of bodhisattvas is living beings. That's where bodhisattvas do their work, living beings. Their art is to work with each living being. and that means outwardly and inwardly, to work with all their own inner livingness, all their inner delusions, and work with all other suffering beings. This is their Buddha field, this is their field of art. So I want to talk about now how to enter this field, how to enter this field And the first step, I have a seven step program for doing this. Well, actually, not a seven step program for entering, a seven step program for entering, exercising, and then bringing the fruits of this artistic project into the world.

[71:08]

So the entering process, the whole process of entering and liberating is Number one, commit. I'm going to do this just short for memorization. Committing. Relaxing. Playing. Creating. Understanding. Or realizing. Transforming. Or liberating and transforming. The first part is the entering part. The entering part is commit, relax. That's how to enter creating. Commit to what? Commit to art.

[72:11]

Commit to the art of embracing and sustaining and understanding and liberating all living beings. That art. In other words, commit to love. Commit to compassion. That's the first step. Commit to being generous. Commit to learn to be generous and commit to be generous. commit to being ethical and patient with all beings, commit to be energetic and enthusiastic about this commitment, and commit to being deeply calm and alert with all beings. And now you're ready to relax. After making this Commitment to compassion for all beings.

[73:14]

It isn't that you're saying, okay, I have achieved this. I vow to learn this. I vow to learn this path. The next step is relax. I'm committed to meet each being with great compassion. And then when I meet a being with great compassion, I want to relax with them. Not push them away, not hold on to them. And if I feel like I want to push them away, not push away that feeling of wanting to push away. If I feel like I want them to stay, be kind to the feeling I want them to stay. You can stay and you can go. Those impulses, those are my delusions. It's really a delusion to want someone to stay or want someone to go. It's a delusion that constricts the relationship, that distracts us from the creative process we're in with this person.

[74:22]

If you're in a creative process with somebody, you don't want them to go away and you don't want them to stay. There's no coming or going in the middle of this process. If that impulse arises, that's a delusion to be, to practice compassion towards. And if you're with that commitment, when this feeling arises, you relax with these delusions. You relax with the delusion of trying to get rid of delusion. Relax with the delusion of trying to prove that some illusions are true. That activity will continue to go on for some time, But we can immediately start being kind to it. And if we start being kind to it, we can relax with it. And if we relax with it, we can play with it. We can be playful with it.

[75:30]

And if we can be playful with it, we can enter into the creative process by which this affliction arises. We can enter into process by which this living being arises with this living being. And now we are in the place from which wisdom arises. Wisdom arises, the Buddha's wisdom arises from the center of creation. The Buddha is not outside creation. The Buddha is not outside creation running it. The Buddha is in the middle of it, totally part of it and bodhisattvas are trying to also be there and join that process because from that place it's helpful because we are in accord with the reality with the truth of the way things are happening and once again once we're in this place we understand and once we understand then there is transformation and liberation

[76:38]

Going back now again to the entry process. And as an example today, I would like to use a very important delusion, an important affliction. In English it's called resentment. Resentment. Resentment isn't just anger. It's kind of an anger you carry around with you. It's kind of clogged. It's a kind of congealed anger. So anger is a delusion. And anger is an affliction. I'd like to say a few words about anger, about resentment now. Resentment has been as particularly within the Alcoholics Anonymous tradition, resentment has been proposed as the number one obstacle to the path of sobriety and the path of happiness.

[77:59]

Maybe I got it wrong. It's the number one obstacle to the practice or the number one factor that makes Alcoholics go back to drinking. When you feel resentment, you're like suffocating yourself. Or I should say, you're suffocating yourself. The resentment is suffocating you. You're not only angry, but it's stuck. It's like epoxy anger. So what do we do with resentment in this path? We love it. A person came to see me who he was an old friend of mine or anyway an old companion and he came to tell me one time

[79:14]

He came more than once, but I remember particularly the second time he came, AA. The first time when he told me that he had resentment towards me, he didn't tell me he was in AA. As a matter of fact, he might not have been in AA yet. He might have been drinking. And he told me about his great resentment towards me. The second time he came, he came and said, because as long as I'm angry at you, I'm at risk. to start drinking again. So I have to tell you I'm angry. And he told me about how angry he was and what he was angry about. And he'd been holding it for decades. But he had to do that. That's part of his bringing this resentment out. I didn't feel like it was hitting me with the resentment or being mean to me. I felt like he was including me in his process of trying to embrace and love

[80:16]

I didn't see him yet quite being able to relax with it. But maybe after he talked to me, he could start to relax with it. So, if there's resentment... I'm suggesting that we be compassionate towards it. That we say thank you to it. That we honor guests. A difficult guest, a dangerous guest. a dangerous, a very dangerous, perhaps one of the most dangerous guests that we could let into our life. But anyway, when it comes, it's here. And if you push away, that's a big mistake.

[81:23]

Any delusion you push away gets stronger. Any delusion you hold on to gets stronger. So when resentment comes, I'm not saying hold on to it, I'm saying embrace it without holding on to it. Dance with it without holding on to it. Say thank you for coming and challenging the great vehicle. Because the great vehicle is here for the big delusions and the little delusions and the medium-sized delusions. We can just look for a second and see if there's any delusion in our heart. I should say, any resentment in our heart. Is there anybody we have or anything we have resentment for? And along with that, do we know anybody that we love whose resentment?

[82:41]

And can we be compassionate to this resentment? Can we be gracious with it? Can we welcome it? in being compassionate towards it, is to be generous towards it. Not be generous towards it, then I would try to be generous towards my inability to be generous. Now, some people can't do certain acts of compassion, but they sometimes can be kind to themselves with the ability to do that type of compassion. And if you can be kind to yourself in your inability to be kind to resentment, that's a warm-up to being kind to resentment.

[83:51]

Or if you can't be kind to resentment, you can also, you might be able to say, well, I can't be kind to resentment But I want to learn to be kind to resentment. That's a warm-up to being kind to resentment. To be generous towards it. That's the first step. Next step is practice ethics with resentment. In other words, you've let the resentment into the home. Big guess now. Resentment's in the house, in your heart. In your mind, you got it. You've let it in. You're being kind to it. Now be careful of it. Part of compassion is to be careful, to be vigilant. Don't take it too lightly and don't take it too heavily. Taking it too lightly or too heavily is an ethical flaw. Learn to take it respectfully, carefully, gently, as calmly as possible.

[84:59]

Don't be nasty towards resentment. Don't slander it. Don't think you're better than it. If you see it in yourself or others, like, I'm good and I've got bad resentment. Or, I'm good and you've got bad resentment. You've got a bad case of resentment, but I don't. No, that's not being careful with resentment. Even some big resentment to somebody, be open to the fact that you're on a par with them. Open to that. That's part of being careful. And then be patient with it. The third step is be patient with the pain of resentment and the power, the destructive power of resentment because resentment really kills creativity. Even though it's a creativity killer, we love the creation killer. We love it.

[86:01]

But if you do again, we know what to do with that. You understand? If you don't like the creation killer, be kind to your not liking the creation killer. Be compassionate to your dislike. Killer of creation. Be compassionate to your dislike of destructive power. I'm not telling you you should like it. I'm just saying you should be compassionate to your dislike if you've got any. But also you shouldn't, if you like destructive power, you should be compassionate to your liking destructive power. Like some people go to the movies and they see certain people have power to destroy and they like that they do. I'm not saying you shouldn't like it when people think they are the sword of God. I'm not saying you shouldn't like that. I'm just saying if you do like it, question it to yourself why you like that.

[87:05]

Like my grandson likes this knife. I don't hate him for liking this knife. I just try to caution him to be careful with it. It's very sharp. I don't want him to hurt himself or anybody else. I love him who loves this tool of destruction, this potential tool of destruction. I love him and I love the knife. I don't... I really don't... Well, actually, I do kind of like the knife. It's really kind of a beautiful knife. I can show it to you later if you'd like it. But it's a dangerous knife. So part of my compassion to this knife and compassion to myself is I don't hate myself for liking the knife. I don't hate myself for liking the art of making this knife. I'm compassionate to myself that I happen to like it. And if I didn't like it, I vow to be compassionate to myself for not liking knives.

[88:08]

Some people here may not like knives, some people may like knives, some people may not like or dislike. All these situations should be loved. If we wish now to start playing with this, playing with resentment, kind of an unusual idea, right? Play with the killer of creation, of creativity. If you start playing with what destroys creativity, you're moving towards realization. If you try to get rid of the obstacles, if you're disrespectful to what's obstructing creativity, that just makes more obstruction. What opens the door to creativity is to relax with the obstruction. Relax with writer's block. Again, before you relax with writer's block, love writer's block. Love it.

[89:10]

Thank you, writer's block. You're giving me a chance to commit to love you. I truly love you. I don't like you. I love you. And now I'm ready to relax with you. Now I'm ready to play with you. I'm ready to relax with this powerful thing called resentment. To relax with it. I'm relaxing with it. Now I'm ready to play with it. Now I'm ready to plunge into the creative process of resentment. And when I enter the creative process of resentment, resentment is not blocking creativity. Once I had a secret love that lived inside the heart of me.

[90:22]

All too soon that secret love called to me to set it free. We really love resentment. Obstruction to creativity. But it's a secret love. And we have to work to get to the place where we love it. And the place we love it is in the creation of it. Creation is where we love. Love is creation, is creativity, is art. now i shouted from the highest hill even tell the golden daffodils my secret loves no secret anymore

[92:08]

I wouldn't necessarily suggest go look for resentment or go look for self-righteousness or go look for other afflictions. I wouldn't suggest go look for some sentient being. I would actually recommend that you be still and notice the one that's right in front of you right now. Notice the delusion that's right here, the people that are right here. Don't skip over what's available right now. We right now are each other's field of creative work right now. This is our field. This is plenty. And what's our experience right now is plenty.

[93:37]

Let's work with this and this and this and then we will discover our secret love. And then we'll be able to, when it's appropriate, shout it from the highest hill. And when it's not appropriate, Our past action has all had consequence. And the results of our past action are supporting our present experience. And the way we work with our present experience transforms our past.

[94:47]

which then supports new and transformed present experience. And now just a word about this the understanding that arises from entering into the creative process of delusion, the creative process out of which delusion arises, that understanding then makes it possible, or it is the basis for our mind of delusion to be transformed into a liberating and liberated mind. But this teaching of the great vehicle, of embracing the great vehicle, also teaches that the mind, the mind which supports our present consciousness, is transformed by the practice that mind is actually not just my mind and your mind.

[96:08]

That mind is, it is my mind, And my mind is not your mind and your mind is not my mind. It is the mind that supports my mind and the mind that supports your mind. And the mind which is your mind and not my mind is also the mind which is the world. It's both this mind which supports the mind which is the result of all of our past actions. The whole world, it is the world. And transforming mine means transforming my mind and your mind, and it also means transforming the whole world. The whole world, by when I say whole world, I mean the whole world of beings. It's not the whole universe. The universe isn't just the world of living beings. There's a...

[97:10]

another world which is beyond larger and smaller. It's not really a larger world. It's not really a smaller world. It's not a... It's just the way the world is when delusion is no longer believed. It's the same world. But it isn't just that this practice transforms my consciousness and your consciousness. The world which confines us, it transforms the substantial world, the world which appears to be substantial, it transforms that world into an insubstantial world of great compassion. And the insubstantial world of great compassion coexists with the substantial world that is the opportunity for great compassion.

[98:18]

The falsely appearing substantial world, the world as it appears falsely as substantial, that world is not separate from the world of wisdom and compassion. It is the object of wisdom and compassion. the world which will be transformed and will open to wisdom and compassion. That's why this is called the great vehicle. Because it's not just about how you get transformed, how your mind gets transformed. If you... compassion... And if you enter into the creative process of your delusions, it's how entering that process transforms the entire enclosing world of all beings and realizes wisdom and compassion in the world of all beings. So it's not just the vehicle of each person, it's the vehicle of all persons.

[99:37]

Because we're all creating this world, we're all creating this confining world together. And the unconfined world is arising with the confining world. world arises not just from the confining world, but from compassion and wisdom. So the unlimited world of compassion and wisdom arises from compassion and wisdom and is totally inseparable from the confining world, which arises from delusion. They're inseparable. There would be no compassion without the confining world of delusion. There would be no point in compassion. There would be nobody to be compassionate towards. In the confining world, there's compassion for it.

[100:45]

And the beings who are living within the confines. The confining world is a world where there's birth and death. and all kinds of affliction and world where there's no birth and no death. There's just love and understanding. And they're inseparable. So if we wish to realize that inseparability and exercise it, we need to accept the wisdom and compassion Starting with the compassion, we need to accept the compassion and wisdom and apply it in the confined world where we live together. And great enlightening beings willingly enter the confined world in order to show other living beings in the confined world how to play and create. There are artists

[101:47]

The bodhisattvas are artists, but they're not artists who are doing the art for themselves. They're doing the art to teach others how to do it. The whole point of their art is to help other people be artists. The whole point of their play and creativity is to teach others how to be playful and creative. They could check out into the realm of unobstructed freedom. And the reason why they could check out into it is because they care for all beings. And when you care for all beings, you're out of the confined world. Or I should say, you're not out of it, you're free of it. But because they care for all beings, they don't hang out there. They come right back. But they want to be here.

[102:48]

They come here on purpose. They want to live in the confined world of affliction and delusion for the welfare of all beings. Playground. That's their love ground. Do you wish to commit? to their practice and enter the process of reality. These great beings support us to make this commitment. They have made it. They live by it. They live by these vows. The vow of embracing and liberating and saving all beings. They live by the vow to love all beings and save all beings.

[103:52]

They live by the vow to love delusion and liberate delusion. They live by the vow to find everything as a door to truth. They live by the vow to realize the Buddha way. They have committed to this process and they're in the middle of it and they're inviting us to join them. and we can think they're patient with us if we're not ready to commit to enter they say I love you anyway like the person who told me to talk about the knife he's not sure he wants to enter this way I love him he knows he doesn't have to enter for me to love him One of the great things about Green Gulch is that there's... He's 11, and one of the great things about Green Gulch is that there's some young men here in their 20s and 30s that he loves.

[105:07]

And because they are contemplating entering this path, because they're contemplating committing to the path of compassion for all beings, he cares about it, and he's kind of thinking about, well, maybe I will too. Not because I'm pressuring him. And if you think about this and you think, well, I think I would like to commit, well, I think that's great. Even if you don't know if you want to or not, I think that's great. Even if you don't think, even if you don't care about what I think is great, I think that's great. But I do ask us to consider, do we wish to commit to this great vehicle? Do we wish to join the great vehicle? Do we wish to join the bodhisattvas in the great work? And then, do we wish to commit to it?

[106:12]

And if the answer is yes, that's that. And then ask it again, every day, every hour. Do you wish to commit again to the great vehicle? Remembering that that's what we're doing is part of it. Sometimes we think about it, we want to do it, we commit to it, and then we forget because of our past karma. ...action of thinking about something other than the welfare of all beings. We have quite a few moments in the past, perhaps you can remember them, when you were thinking about something other the welfare of all beings can you remember some time when you were thinking about something other so because of those past thoughts of well i'd like to help some people but not all people because of thoughts like that we sometimes forget once we remember once we remember that we really do love all beings we sometimes forget because we've forgotten so many times in the past

[107:19]

reservoir of past forgetfulness is supporting our present mind so if you ever do think that you'd like to live for the world for all beings that's a really great moment Once there was a great Zen teacher. His name was . He was out in the fields around the monastery where he was teaching.

[108:28]

He was cutting grass with a knife. A wandering monk came up to him and said, I'm looking for Master Nanchuan. Do you know where he is? And Nanchuan said, this knife costs $30. The monk said, I didn't ask you about how much the knife cost. I asked you, where is Nanchuan? And Nanchuan said, it's really sharp. One of the things I liked about Zen was that it looked like it wasn't a proselytizing school.

[109:42]

That appearance of not proselytizing really attracted me. Do you know what proselytizing means? It means like trying to get people to join. Zen was a school of spiritual meditation that didn't look like it was trying to get people to join. And that made me join. So I really don't want to get you to join. Another characteristic of Zen, which I think is called apophatic. It has a characteristic of being apophatic and ironic. Zen says, I didn't come here to get you to join the Bodhisattva great vehicle. I did not. May our intention equally extend to every being and place.

[110:49]

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