Compassion is a Conversation

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A conversation is what we are doing together. Buddhas are sitting upright and still, in the midst of everything, having a conversation with silence. The story of his Nanchuan and his sickle. Meeting the person and the moment in conversation.

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one could say we're going to have a dharma talk

during these one day settings we we say we have dharma talks
and they often occur around this time

i do have some difficulties
in this life
and yet
when i come to know about i feel pretty comfortable
giving dharma talks
i have confidence
the diamond talk is just
whatever i'm gonna do is gonna be the dharma talk
necessarily have any idea what the diamond talks gonna be
have you guys you don't necessarily have any idea either right
some of you may be do but anyway for the or maybe have some wishes that it will be a good one
but ah
i kind of wish that too but anyway
i i i feel comfortable not knowing what it will be

and yet sometimes i thought does occur about what it might be and
i was talking to somebody the other day
and he told me he was kind of concerned about whether he was gonna get enough love
here is concerning that he would where there's going gonna get to love he felt he needed
and i think he might have asked me what is love
and some my that and i said
i could have said i didn't say but i quit said i don't know
but i didn't say that
i taught i responded as though i didn't know what it was
and i don't want him to answer this question but i managed to rescue what do you think i said
what thank you thank you have that's good
thank you thank you
that was love jester to see it
when i said to him was it's a conversation or it's conversation
that's what love is
and when i take conversation i mean like
just conversation
it's it is conversation is not what i'm doing it's not what you're doing it's what we're doing together
and then i thought well maybe i'll name is that i'll bring that up at no bowed and i thought what kind of in a way
i said but but but but but but if you trade to conversation is that a conversation and i would say well as an artifact yes for me just say to you that love is a conversation as i say it it's a conversation
the love that's going on right now is the conversation has going on right now

i said this before and may i say it again even though you don't know what it is
i am a conversation
you are a conversation
we are a conversation high and we you are we
i'm not something by myself i am a conversation with hall bags that's what i am

the way i really am
of course is the way i really am in the way i really am is that i am a conversation
i'm nothing
in another myself
i am everything in conversation
as me and you are everything in conversation as you that's the way we really are
of course the way we really are is the buddha dharma the blood diamond is the way we really are
and nowhere really are is that we are a conversation between
are among our self and others

as i often mentioned
the you could say zen practice or you can say the practice of the buddha way is sometimes characterized as
whole hearted sitting
in stillness and silence
this latin beautiful pictures of
then students zen practitioners sitting upright and it looks like they're sitting still there's in particular when they're still photographs of them they look like they're sitting still
but they also sometimes to motion pictures of them and even in the motion picture they look like they're sitting still

and then we have statues of buddha is sitting and they look like they're sitting still and we have scriptures which tell us borders are settings upright and still in the center of all beings
that sound familiar to you buddhas are sitting upright
unmoving and silent are are
what we call shockey a moonie we call him the money which means the silent one
our great ancestor is com
the silent one of the shakya clan he is silent he's still she sits upright in the middle of all beings that's part of the practice of the buddha dharma that kind of whole
being upright
okay familiar no problems
and then the other part of the buddha way is
going to meet the teacher
and listening to the dharma
and asking about the dharma

that's the other part
of the boat away
wholeheartedly sitting in the middle of all beings and also going to meet the teacher and having a conversation about what about the dharma which of course is a conversation having a conversation about the conversation
those two together
those two together
they go together

he really don't have one without the other
and so that's why wasn't so and so i say that when the buddha's sitting there
upright and stillness and silence that burrus sitting there is a conversation
that buddhist sitting there is an convert is a conversation the buddha is in conversation with all beings sitting there
and then
of course when we're in conversation
what it's really a conversation
you're sitting there in stillness
it requires sitting still to have the conversation

and in reality
we are each of us is sitting still and silent
and we are in a conversation and we are the conversation
most of the stories of zen are about conversations
there's a few stories about like one of the stories of zyklon in in the buddha dharma is buddhist are sitting still
and silent that's one story and that story has been said over and over but basically it's of one story
there's all these varieties of the sitting in the form of conversations many many conversations
many examples of going to meet the teacher and talking about the dharma

and in a way in those conversations we are testing to see if the people in the conversation are sitting upright and still in the conversation

and we have lots of stories of people who are wholeheartedly sitting
in the middle of a conversation

in about a month from now i'm i'm going to maybe go to santa barbara and there's gonna be a weekend retreat and the topic of the retreat is
sitting in stillness
and social action
some matter
sitting and stillness we talked about
social action we talked about social action i'm suggesting is a conversation
or is conversation
then his social action it is going and having conversations about the dharma
together with
sitting upright and stillness
and silence having a conversation together with silence

the other night one of art
sanga members tracy apple who you some of you know she comes to know abode but she's not here today for some reason she gave a presentation about
the possibility of reversing global warming
many scientists have got together and they they actually think it is to it is possible to reverse it
and i will say to reverse it
by going to the teacher and asking about the dharma
it's possible to reverse it by having conversations

for example having conversations about
educating girls
one of the main things that has the potential to reverse global warming is too
be silent and still and have conversations about educating girls

and having conversations about family planning

the type of social action
which has the potential
a reversing global warming
involves having conversations
or ah
could involve and kind of needs to involve having conversations about educating girls and when it girls are educated than their can be calmer than that facilitate conversations about family planning

that makes sense to you
the make sense that when girls are educated
that's a good thing that the thing that promotes ah
a way of life that might reduce the population of the planet of human beings
and also when girls are educated and boys are educated other things are also possible but
the some places in the world where they do not they're not letting girls get educated weak kneed there's an opportunity of a conversation about this and the conversation will be a real conversation if we are upright
in the middle of that conversation
also another thing that would be conducive to reversing global warming is for example
being vegan
eating more plant based food that is conducive to reversing global warming but an order for that to happen i should say and that happen he will be a conversation
someone just recently wrote a letter to bring out see
telling us
about how we should be vegan
that's a conversation piece
you can't just go tell going out to be vegan
but you can talk to green gulch about being vegan
being vegan is an opportunity for the idea of being vegan the idea of more plant-based food
those ideas are our conversation pieces and if we engage with all those conversation pieces and many many more conversation pieces

we will realize the buddha dharma and there will be peace
in this world
and freedom from
but without conversation we will be trapped in or by everything
without the fully matured conversation everything will trap us
we thought that conversation we won't be able to be ourself
and be free of ourself

fortunately we are already
all of us are already a conversation it's a matter of exercising it are practicing at were already the way we are but we have to practice it in order to realize it
and it's a lot of work
to have conversation
and were built for the way we are is where we are built to be what we are and we are a conversation and we and part of the conversation is that the way we are is we have some resistance to
be what we are part of the mix of human situation is that part of it doesn't want to do the work of realizing what we are
and that part is calling for the conversation and that part is calling to be listened to i don't want to do instrument work to have a conversation okay i wouldn't listen to the conversation listens to that

and another point that was raised in that presentation about global warming
a i don't know exact i don't know what store you want to tell about grow a global warming but one story is that some scientists have informed us that is going on
now people ordinary people like us might have noticed that thing it seems to be warmer lately that the winters don't seem to be as cold as they were before which is kind of like in some places okay fine
and then we're hearing about
glaciers on mountains melting
and we're hearing about
i'm we're hearing about the ice cap and antartica melting
and work and we're hearing the scientists are telling us it's warming up
and they're also telling us that this warming up is related to our action that human activities have are having a consequence of global warming they're telling us about that have you heard about it

maybe some drug addicts in urban areas of the world have have thinking all those global warming but
we're hearing it from in a fairly sober
scientists who are telling us
this is a big change that's happening here
and we're listening to it right and now i have a chance to have a conversation with the scientists and with each other about this topic and one of the comments that i thought was really good was that global warming could
be seen as something that's happening to us
or can be seen as something that's happening for us
the consequences of my actions are not exactly happening to me
they're they're happening for me they're showing me about my actions
without consequences it's hard for me to learn much about my actions but the way the universe is set up is is very nice it's like it here to teach me so these things that really happening to me they're happening for me this global warming thing is happening for us it's
been back to us about her conversation is saying maybe we need to work a little bit more in conversation not maybe we need to tell other people what to do like you people should teach your girl's friend you should send your girls to school that could be a conversation
in peace but if it's a conversation piece is not me telling them what to do it's the beginning of a relationship
it's the beginning of a conversation and if it's a beginning aviation start by giving an orders maybe i should say could i talk to you can we have a conversation about what
what do you want what about what and then
and then talk to that
recently a green gulch i saw these kids walking around and there are three of them and
one i knew and the other two i hadn't met before and i looked at them and i saw that they look like the one i knew
i said are you guys cousins may say yeah
and i looked at the the to i had met before and they look just like
their dad who i knew as it is dave your dad they said yeah said wow it's amazing the three faces look so similar and i said crisis and into i sell to the three of 'em but the oldest of the three said i said can i say somebody doing she said what

i could have said could i have a conversation with you
and she might have said what
and i said well i'm i'm have a request for you want to hear what is it well if you're going to be carrying machetes everybody know a machete is if you're going to be carrying machetes around would you please point the tip down towards the earth because when you have him
pointing up in the air you might put out your cousins eyes so please don't walk around with a machete is pointing up i didn't the hand over your machetes
who was shooting might not have been that good for me to say i said would you please point them down so you don't hurt each other
that they considered it and i think i'm i'm not sure exactly i'm not sure if like they started to point them down
but i think maybe they did they gotta keep their machetes and they started to turn them the tips down to the earth which i thought you thank you thank you for pointing them in down towards the earth

we had a conversation it went pretty well i thought
can i talk to you about something what
can i talk to your budget guns
can i talk to you about what you're eating can i talk to about your daughter
why could i do you could we talk what for
well i just i just i would like to you know i respect you and you and your family anna and so on
this is going the we have to be so we have to remember that we're sitting upright and stillness when we have our conversations
and be there for what
what's it to you
that might be a response we get we ask for a conversation
and this conversation is really important so it's good that we are able to like be there for it and ask for it in a respectful way without looking down on children who have weapons in their hands
and a buddha sees all these people with weapons in their hands as children but the buddha doesn't look down on the children
the buddha looks at a children with
with love
with conversation
and the children eventually feel the respect and as they feel the respect they think the person who respects them is pretty good very smart and maybe they'll have a conversation with them but the media lotta help before we can have a conversation and the conversation is dealing with how much
much work it is the conversation is up for a lot of work
the conversation requires patience and enthusiasm for the aspiration to have a conversation which is reality and which saves the world

which liberates beings in in the middle of the world
conversation is not trying to get rid of things it's trying to converse with them is trying to live with them

one more
no teaching about this
which are given before but some of you have not heard it is that there's four basic types of conversations
one type of conversation
is going on all the time
it's the dharma conversation that nonstop
but this conversation which doesn't start or stop which is always going on
which is the way we really are this conversation is imperceptible
in this conversation
i am asking i am calling in this conversation i am calling to all of you
to converse with me
and all of you are responding to my call
i'm calling to you
to engage with me to realize peace and freedom in this world i'm doing that the way i am is the way i am is he said this this building is calling to you and you are responding to me but i
i can see i can't perceive the way i'm calling to you non-stop
and i can't perceive how you're responding to me nonstop
and also i can perceive the way you're not always calling to me i can't perceive it and i can perceive how i'm on always calling to you
but that's the imperceptible
conversation that's going on all the time in
upright sitting in silence and stillness
the cut the kind of
conversation which i can perceive is a kind of conversation which gets interrupted which is only part-time
so the other three types are
that i can perceive that i'm calling to you for a conversation i can perceive it and in order to perceive it i have to i see the beginning of my call an end of
hello it just started
gary have a conversation period it ended i can perceive that kind of hall the kind of arises and ceases that's the kind of things you can perceive it can perceive things that are rise and cease like could we meet some time in peace and harmony period and
end of call and i am and i'm i i can proceed that and there is that kind
of call
and i'm calling to you but i don't perceive that your responded like i called you and i asked if he wanted to talk but i i don't see that your responded you do
but i couldn't perceive it i couldn't see the beginning and the end of your response to my call so that one type you call perceptibly your responded to
patrick imperceptibly
like i asked for i
i asked her the dharma
but you didn't give it to me
i perceived that a hazard but i couldn't perceive that you gave it to me that's one type
and as wonderful as and there's wonderful zen stories about that type
on here when
as a lot of them
here's one that was if there was a zen monk named japan named nine xuan
and i almost a jar joy
georgia was nonchalant student or not going to talk about georgia right now okay we're going talk about who
yeah which means sought south spring that's the name of his
that's where he hung out yeah notice sell spring so since he hung out there they called him mr south spring
knowledge one
so a monk came to non xuan which means it came to the the place
and and he just happened to run into the person antoine of all people can you imagine you go to meet the person at the place and you meet the person and the place
he wanted to have a meeting he wanted to have a conversation with who
how he meets non to on
but it doesn't perceive and antoine
so he served a non-jew on i'm looking for launch one
he's made in nineteen but he doesn't perceive and antoine
but it is many nonchalant and nine right and he wanted to meet not drawn and non-fans is kinda like here i am for you man i'm here for you dude
the guy says the nonchalant
who was outside in the fields cutting grass with a safe
or a sickle
it's a sight of big one
hmm and sickle-cell and one ah so i think he was he was clearing grass with the monks out in the field using a sickle
if for not hello i'm looking for nonchalant i want to meet and antoine
a non-jew on says
this sickle is sharp
he what he asked to meet in anjouan and not xuan responded by meeting him and saying this sick is sharp
he perceived that he was asking but he didn't perceive that he was responded that he got what he's asking for
so he says the non-jew on
i'm not asking about your sickle i'm here to meet and antoine
he asked again and nine tries is it costs thirty bucks
so he at he he called he was responded to he hurt himself call but he couldn't see that he got to he got to nice meetings from the great teacher he missed it even though we can say it happened right
the other this the next type is
you're walking along singing your song and you don't think you're asking for anybody to come and have a conversation with you and somebody walks up to you and says hello can we have a conversation
you're walking along asked me for a conversation not being aware that you're asking for a conversation
you're requesting the world to talk to you intimately
but you don't perceive it
it's a nonstop
infinite request
you don't perceive it and then somebody does somebody conduct uses brackets well you want our conversation here i am hello
and then maybe sick person says the person is responding to you but you didn't think you asked for it you can perceive that they're responding to you but you think person to think that they're actually like
i don't know what uninvited guest uninvited interlocutor uninvited conversation partner i don't want i didn't ask to talk to you what are you hello
could have a conversation with you i didn't ask for a conversation

you can perceive that the person's offering you a conversation but you didn't ask for it you don't think you did but you don't you don't understand that they came and offered to you because you asked for it he asked for you ask for compassion
when hear a story about that
simon greenberg and i'm talking to this young man and i'm saying i feel your i'm listening to you your i feel you're calling for compassion he says no i'm not
and then he asked me another question and i answer it and i said you know and you asked me to ads and he said no i didn't
and he has kept asking the question and progression but he couldn't see that he was actually asking me to answer
that he was begging me to keep talking to him
which i was happy to do
when he wouldn't accept responsibility there was asking me to do this for he was asking me to listen to him and to respond to him he just couldn't see it
and he was exercising really nicely
so then in the fourth kind to we have it will request and don't realize it
and we get a response we can't understand why we're getting their response

we request and don't get a response and we don't see we can't we can't say the return the third kind of as we request we want a response and we saved we would perceive myself asking and we perceive ourselves
receiving the response we're asking for a gift and we sit would and we can perceive ourselves asking and we can perceive that the gift is come into us
that's kind of the easy guide
we don't realize that our actions were a form of asking for global warming
to give us feedback on what on our life
we don't say that but we do see that we're getting this response to or more we see this thing coming to us but we don't realize it's here to help us realize
our work have taken care of the world
global warming is coming and saying
take better care of this world this is for you to learn how to take care of the world better this is here for you to accept your responsibility for this planet and all the people and with animals and plants that live here
everything has come comes his feedback on our practice
but it's hard to understand it so that's why we need to have a conversation
should i become vegan
she shows and center become vegan showed the planet become vegan
let's have a conversation
so zen center already were were you know i'd personally totally up for educating girls zen centres up for it what about
the school system or the airport may be so what about the government whole government what about the government what about all the other communities around the world how can we start the conversation
and if people can have this conversation without silence and stillness well i think they seem to think they can but i usually see that it doesn't go very well if they don't remember being here and taking care of themselves
but adept take care of themselves and then they're ready for the conversation this is a this is
zen sitting and stillness and then social action being brought together
we need the stillness for the social action to be
a real liberating conversation apart or to realize the reality of a conversation and we need the conversation as feedback on our setting they worked together
and so i all these and stories about the conversations and then we are many and ceremonies which literally an act that like people come in the ceremony be acting before the ceremony they go to the the the for
example before the ceremony they go to the ceremony they go to the master of ceremony or the mistress of ceremonies they can i be in the ceremony
and then they have a conversation
in the ceremony or we give the bodhisattva precepts
the one who wants to receive the precepts goes to the one who gives the precepts and it says may i have would you please give me the precepts and the person responds and sometimes they say asked me again and then sometimes they say asked me again in sometimes they say yes i will give you the precepts
and then they had the ceremony and the ceremony the person comes as has a conversation the preceptor comes and has a conversation the preceptors come to listen to the request and respond
the one whoever wishes to receive the precepts goes to the ceremony to ask in the ceremony now for the precepts
and the preceptor ass if they're asking them and they say yes and the precepts percent you want to receive these now and they say yes i do okay i'm in a given to you and after given to them he said you want to continue to practices yes i do they go they do had this conversation
about the bodhisattva precepts it'll in a is an enactment of a conversation which almost everybody can see as a conversation
and if they would say now we receive these precepts
and they say no then we we have an unusual conversation so you are you don't want to see the wolf who knows maybe we should try this another day yeah maybe so let's do it another day okay let's go let's collar off i changed my mind let's do it and so on
you know and admit that lit the literal meeting with the teacher and private interview eat some of you ask to meet and then you i will i meet you
as some people say i don't want to meet with you and i meet you
send to you and i respond by saying okay let's not meet even though we are right now
let's do the story of or not meeting
less an act that kind of meeting that's one of the most important meetings like nonchalant and that monk them i want to meet nonchalant he did and he said but i'm i'm i'm not meeting nonchalant and nonsense johnson it costs thirty bucks
the conversation is reality
we have to exercise it to realize it so shall we

so that's what came out of the month
in response to your request for a conversation for
a meeting for realizing who you are realizing who you are
and me realizing who i am yes charlie
he said it sometimes ways
would you just a second place
did you say something about did you use the adjective good
huh did you say what makes a meeting a good meeting
the whole universe makes it a good meeting
it are already already all meetings are good meetings
the question
yeah the way that reality makes it good good is the reality of the meeting including you tell me you don't want to meet
reality makes that a beautiful conversation piece when you say i don't want to meet
you about you not exercising it
missing the opportunity to practice the meeting
rather than understanding this meeting is for me you think the meetings happening to me
i think in a good meeting
in a good conversation you're free of knowing whether it's good or bad
when you're not yet into a full realization of the conversation you can get caught up
by you know whether it's good or not so our our huge situation is we are mind is
if something were caught up in our mind of is a of a my where there's good and bad appearing and which is and is this that mind and consciousness
people are usually i'd caught up in it they don't see the conversation there
and in a good conversation we we realized freedom from do not the concern for good and bad for yeah we realized freedom from it without getting rid of good and bad
because good and better actually in conversation all day long
recently that shares the same know your him with the word free

yes hi
meanwhile our conversation
but model a cup
i know what would be

it's not my heart attack
i don't know how conversation
anyway else
that doesn't seem right

you mentioned several things one was one thing i heard was i don't know how to have a conversation
you could have stopped there but i think he's it may be added something after i don't know how to have come a conversation that you simply we have to that which was what
oh so there's some particular topic and you don't know how to a conversation with it about it
that's a generally speaking a good attitude
i would like to talk to you about what we're eating or what i'm eating i'd like to talk to you by what i'm eating and i would like to talk to you about where you're eating
but i don't know how to had that conversation because do you wanna go someplace and just standing up
do i dance
a hooker
do you want to continue all right
so if i if i want to have a conversation with you about some topic
it's good if i don't know how to have it because how can i know how to have a conversation with you without knowing whether you wanna have a conversation
now if i ask you if i tell you i'd like to have a conversation would you like to have a conversation and you say and so i i myself i feel like
i'd like to have a conversation with kim
about something
but i don't know how to have conversation with camp so i think maybe i'll start by telling him that i want to have one and seeing if she's up for it because in order to discover the path of conversation
in order to discover the path of buddha dharma
i can't do it by myself
i can't be i can't discover by myself without including other people so i start by saying
noticing i want to have a conversation in order to realize peace and freedom i do
and i want to have a conversation with you and i start by saying i would like to have a conversation with you would you like to have a conversation with me and if you say no i i've just been successful
i have had a conversation i told you about myself you listen to me
it's already this conversation
then you said to me know and i listened to you this is like a to face conversation already we have two steps
and then she says no and i say
please give and you say no i'd say pretty please
and you say no okay my granddaughter does that can i do this nine upvotes pretty blue please pretty no arguing that a conversation and then we go on from there that we actually were up for it
but first of all we have to gun like that's a big part of it and that's a big part of what
autism were becoming aware of so much abuse or somebody to ask you for a conversation and the other person says no and they don't listen to it
they're not listening
don't say what would it mean no i mean no i may get away walk
hey they're not listening they're not conversing they're stating permitted not even nurseries this stating what they want they're just going and taking it
without even asking of thing if they could not to mention could i ask you a question
may i have that may i be with you may i talk with you
we aren't asking the earth may i may i farm you we aren't asking the animals may i eat you we're not we're not having conversations
or some of us are which is great
and there but up but nobody's but some people are not and the people are having conversations
probably some of them want to talk to the people aren't having conversations some of that people are asking the animals beforehand and finding out that don't want it
wanna talk to the people who are not asking
so not knowing how to have conversation is a real
what's a god it say
it's a it's it helps us approached the conversation compassionately it helps us be upright and when your upright you're not leaning into knowing or not knowing
this is cool
upright how wonderful and i want to have a conversation there's this wishing me
to save the world here poo poo where'd that come from well it came from my conversation
you're sitting upright and then there's a world and the world tries to you you say i want to help you boil the world cries uses i want to have a conversation is a while i want to have a conversation tube and i'm not lean but i i'm not leaning into i know how i know how to afrikaners a you are going to and i'm not leaning into i don't know how i don't know how
and i do know how and not meaning in either direction
so i can although i i might think i know how would i mean is here's one way we could try it like i could ask you i don't know how and here's one way we can try it this i ask you so being upright and still as very good because our mind is an to
turmoil around us providing all these different ways to have conversations and if we lean is hard for us to find the appropriate response
tugs at work
he's a start you know and did we ever conversation
yeah we exercise did just know and everybody else was part of and to where
and another thing they weren't that the people who are presenting them
the basically i would say their present they're presenting i've i feel like the people who are poor thing here is ways of a
reversing global warming i feel like the way i sought is that here's conversation pieces
here's things to converse with people about to reverse global warming and one of them says if you're talking to a school board about maybe putting solar panels on their roof or changing the children's diet
even if they don't put solar panels on and even if they don't change the children's diet
the conversation has already happening and the conversation is really where it's at
what makes solar panels appear on roofs of schoolhouses
how that works i don't know
it might involve me saying bringing up the topic who knows but the conversation if the if the panels go on the roof without conversation we're not doing our job
but it's it's a conversation and then they gone the conversations the main point the conversation fines the true dharma
what it means that touch me touch me yes son
as part of waking up the dreamer
metaphor and and it was like there was a dream using congress is a dream of waiting sorry were dreaming that there's nothing we can do in an idea of action could change the dream and then i practice talk about awakening like what what is our dream
highly interactive have a conversation happening we changed the dream
or well with the dream
that idea of somebody grabbed something up who
make changed african him dance with that yeah so now you're bringing that up and i have a response
because you brought up ivory response for this idea of changing the dream and my responses that i think that the idea of changing the dream isn't some isn't so much in accord with conversation
but here's a dream and we want to change it
conversation is here's a dream and i want to have a conversation
now the curb the dream might change in the conversation but i'm not having a in to really have a conversation have to be open to the driven out changing
and if we do have a conversation even a half hearted what not to mention a full scale dharma realizing conversation the dream will change but not because we tried to change it but because we tried to practice with it
we tried to have a conversation with it and it will change
because even if it's exactly the same now as it seemed to be a moment before
in a way everything's changed because now it's not just a dream it's a dream in a conversation so exactly totally totally different the now that before there was a dream and no conversations so we were trapped in the dream now we have the same dream with a conversation and were free of it we don't to go
get rid of it it just were not enslaved by it anymore
so changing the dream is a little bit like changing your consciousness rather than having a conversation and becoming free of consciousness
he said that much help center much better
we can talk about that too
and when them when they say i heard them say changed the dream and you know i didn't have a big reaction to that like oh that's really sick
at anti buddhist i just listened to it and i thought okay and i thought and i thought oh and then and then this is a statement coming from some indigenous people of but that's their practices to change their dream
and then they wanted and and then they wanted the non-indigenous people who are working with them so okay you helped us change our dream thank you very much for the airplanes and stuff like that so and you know contacts so he can change we can keep our dream in a healthy form now you go do
the same thing with the rest of the world please
that's you can find and the conversation
when they leave and and the how can they bring this inspiring work to the to them in out of the so-called non-indigenous people are the people who are indigenous to the urban world
that's not find me but every get into the conversation i don't want people to be stuck in changing dreams and i also don't want to prohibit the language changes the dream i want to converse with changed the dream without knowing how to have a conversation about changed the dream and i'm now
not primarily interested in changing the dream are keeping a dream the same like the buddhist dream i don't want this or they change it even not will it is changing and ah yeah i want to converse with the buddhist dreams
and one of the buddhist dreams is that liberation of beings comes through conversation
comes through going to meet the teacher
which is everything and asking about it and talking to it
and by the way in order for this conversation to be successful we need to be
here upright not leading into success in this conversation will we want the conversation to be successful we want the conversation to bring peace to all beings yeah we do but we don't lean into that or upright with them and also we don't want this conversation
to imprison people and hurt people right
we don't want you know and we do want to get our way and have things go the way we think but that's not something to lean into that's something to be kind to
where you want things to go your way ah okay i hear you can we talk about that know
just doing the way i say
i'm here list i didn't you say do it the way i say it's what you said yes i did swear okay can we go over that again
swimming i want to just clarify what you're asking now
and so on
and then sometimes in the process of clarify this they will i didn't really mean do it the way i say what i meant was please listen to me with love and respect please talk to me about this i don't really want to
you know
do you wanna be loved you want love do you want to get have your way
watch i prefer love having my way as good but
i'd rather actually i have this conversation
which means i still want i still have a way that i'd like things to be but i give up having things be the way i liked them to be for the sake
the conversation which realize his peace
yes you should about educating their girls yeah
the girls why not why isn't that education for all well because i think that's code for there's a lot of countries right now where the a pipe where the over got the to reproduction rate is that would he took on the fertility rate
is very high and not associate that happens in the countries where the girls are not allowed to get an education
so in those countries where girls are for prohibited from going to school
the birth rates very high because people make people come to them and say
i want to reproduce with you you know and they don't say i'd like to have a conversation with you about it they say you know let's have sex and the girls are not educated
about how to talk to the person about that about how to explain to them that they're that they're the on that they understand that actually it's against the law for them to be doing this with you and you know this is not appropriate for me at thirteen years old to be a mother and they they've they've they have they've been taught waves
of talking about that and they've been taught about their rights and they've been taught to taught about
and on various things and they become lawyers and they know how to talk to people who are intruding upon their space without you know being respectful and so on but without education they just you know they don't know how to deal with this very powerful request didn't know how to hear the request
let's have sex in a way that you know is compassionate and helps the person who understand that it's not appropriate that you don't want it and it would be good for them to respect you know i need i i respect you and i need you to respect me and listened to me they need to be taught how to talk
like that they need to be educated
in order to maintain
a wholesome practice with other people
without education most people do not know how to do that a lotta men don't wanna do that either but they also in education but they're allowed to have education in those countries men are allowed to get education
now and if women were allowed if the girls were allowed to have an education
that would be another educational process for the men their education would improve if the girls' education was allowed
you know
a big part of educating girls is to educate men
who can bring anything in a crash into who can't learn certain things without educated females around them educated females are really a great thing in the world at educated men are to we need both
but there's very few countries where the i know of where men were the males are prohibited from going to school and quite a few or the females are prohibited
and then of course reproductive rights go with being educated about how to get support for your rights
and also education promotes people establishing and clarifying the rights
that mixes it makes sense but i still
i'm always wondering are like brings down whole the education or an idiot he does not come somehow for me ah
doesn't come from the awaken if the he is not been awakened to the consequences on the action this psycho kids
that's right and that education education involves waking up
so we have this teaching which you've heard before here quite a few times the buddhist sees that everybody possesses the wisdom of the buddha's but because of misconceptions and attachments they don't realize it so they need edges for the burden is to educate them about their misconceptions and one misconception that we sometimes have
is this person isn't worthy of conversation with me
and if this person's asking me to let go of my attachment to my views i don't want to talk to them under such a person needs education
they need to be educated in you should we need you to talk to these people who disagree with you and who want you to not be attached to your views we need you to realize that's a good thing girls need to learn that and boys need to learn that and so it is education for all so the boys have education let's give the girls
education and if anybody in between let's give them education to let's give everybody education and were recognizing i did a lot of girls who are not allowed let's do that that will be part of reversing global warming
it seems to me in this country right now we have people who are say it's an infringement of my religious liberty for new to talk about things like that
and fair play a particular
it's a infringing on your religious something for infringement on their religious freedom for me to insist on having a conversation about this well i think again insisting on a conversation sounds not very attractive
well okay yeah even how yeah yeah well okay i'm not insisting on and on conversation i'm open to not having conversation that's part of having the conversation i want would involve me being open to you not want to talk to me
insisting they have conversation generally not always generally is not respectful insisting but you can be consistent and just keep coming back again and again in respectful the a respectfully respectively i want to talk i still want talk to you i still want a job
but in a way that person every time you say to person feels a little bit more comfortable a little bit more respected he may have to respect the person so many many times before they dare to open to the conversation with you
that's hard
i think a survey another situation in which is somebody who says i don't want you to talk to somebody else about that topic because you're you're having that conversation with another person offends my religious sensibilities orders against my religious freedom yeah so that would be another opportunity the person's tell
pup that's really hard
a is sometimes it's really hard and then that brilliant hard is calling for conversation really hard is calling please listen to really hard and then you listened to really hard have a conversation with really hard
and now they have that conversation maybe so on this is like i tried to get stuck and really hard i can disrespect really hard
a really hard can be in the room and now i can talk to the person was saying to me i don't want you to talk to me about it or that person about it and you could say could i have a conversation with your about it and they might say i don't want to talk about it i just want you to know it and i want you to stop talking to them
but it bothers me when you talk to him
when i want you to shut up about this
and then i'm saying that i am a conversation with that person i'm and i i'm a conversation with the person who says i don't want to talk to you
at that moment i am a conversation with that person who says don't talk and i might say
i might have something to say about that
and then and then it i just told you to shut up
and then i might reach into my wallet and pull out some money
i'm i am i'm not i'm not i'm just kept money
and they might say what's this for
can you say can i talk
and am i say yeah and i might give some money
money talks
a and they might say thank you
here we i like you know my games are my money
say well okay what did you want up or i might give him some fruit like i went to visit somebody they invited me over to visit them
and they gave me all kinds of gifts
which i should thank you and then they told me about their religion
and i and they told me yeah little man
all these good things that their religion was doing i thought this sounds great
and then they started to talk about the evil people
and i said crash a question
and they said
yeah i said are the evil people different from me and you turns out they were
and i said well i feel uncomfortable talking about him as though they're not the evil people are not asked that were the good people in their evil i feel uncomfortable with that conversation
they told me about all the good things they want to do and then they started talking about the evil people who weren't them and i told him i was uncomfortable and they listened to me and
and i took my goodies and left
that was the conversation that day
it worked out quite nicely huh
i'm still in a loving relationship with these people one of whom is my sister she's a jehovah's witness
and we have in our relationships moving forward on the path of zen
on the path of reality which is the path of having conversations i'm in conversation with this sweet beautiful younger sister
when i'm thinking as you say that is already regularly drive past a corner where there are people protesting the existence of plant harrogate and i you know i think about stopping the car and getting out in talking to them but frankly i'm afraid is what yes so then you're not for
fear the fear the anxiety is calling for compassion and for you to bring compassion to your fear of i'm talking to them that is
reversing global warming
whenever you work on addressing and conversing compassionately with your own fear that is part of the work of global warming of reversing it
to you know drive your car because you're afraid of being late
rather than being afraid of being late and address your fear of being late and may be calm down and realize you don't have to drive your car that's part of it
but just addressing our fear of not having enough of this or that addressing our fear of not having enough protein
addressing that fear is necessary to reverse global warming
addressing the fear of talking to people who are guns plan parent planned parenthood her family planning addressing people who are against educating girls
if we're afraid of those people which is quite natural
if we address our fear we will become free of our fear is it hard to address our fear yes
yes it is and i'm i'm in conversation with our hard and and now i wanna do a hard thing which has addressed my fear from drive by and or in my case on
i'm number one time i drove by some people who are in the street near my house and there there were drunk and fighting with each other and vomiting on the street and i felt some i didn't particularly want to go and tell them to stop drinking
but i noticed that i would be afraid to actually go among them and have conversation
i'm always going to go you should stop drinking i was just thinking it would it would i felt some fear of like just stop pulling over my motor scooter and going on and hanging out with them even though they lived just write down have bought from my house they're my neighbors my drunken violent neighbor
throwing up on the street
fighting each other and i was afraid
but i dealt with my fear and dealing with my fear i thought i want to deal with my fear i want to get good again in my fear of interacting with people who are really having a hard time and so i went to the same center and i i left
and traveled thousands of miles to go to the center to learn how to deal with my fear of being with violent trunk
miserable people
that's it we're here to learn is how to have conversations with sober people and drunk people with anti
family banning people and pro family be panic people we're here to have conversations with everybody
and in reality we already are we need an exercise in order to realize it
if we don't exercise it won't realize world peace and world health
but on a path to realizing it are lots of difficult conversations which involve fear of them are fear of what i will do to them
from of their on skillfulness and my and skillfulness dealing with that fear is essential
it's essential for reversing global warming because if people are afraid of not having their guns their cars they're uneducated daughters if they're afraid of that
we're not gonna succeed but if if somebody can start getting them to talk about it they can learn they can get over their fear
but the somebody was talking to them is to be working with their own fear
of them and also the fear that we might not be successful career that is too late
maybe it is too late but been opened to maybe it is to lead his up the path to health
that like many meals attacked me a clear now
and isn't isn't a big challenge know it's a big challenge and you want a big challenge and i mean do you want to meet this big challenge
yeah and there might be there might be that might be a new the conversation that as me wants to do this if you tell me it's hard i can't like yeah right i got it
it's hard for me too but i want so much that i want to do it even though it's hard or even if it's hard and also if it's not hard i want to do it too
if it's ever easy okay could we could we give you an easy assignment no no no i just want hard ones
and first lot of people and easy for they think it's an easy site as time might be really hard one for me i could we go to a bar and have some drinks that might be easy for them but for me that would really be hard i have to have a conversation about that could we meet maybe someplace else no he hadn't has to be
in a borrow then you know that would be a difficult conversation for me some people say let's go to burn them no problem to yeah that's the conversation
basically we go to a place where there's not alcohol and that's it that's hard for them so we have our difficulties
yeah some next month i'm thinking of participating in the election says she yeah and i'm thinking that is very high to go canada thing yeah
i think that to i kind of relate to do it too and i think i think it would be hard
hmm i think it would be hard i think putting on whining before we got kind of thing in the afternoon
i think so too and maybe continue the sitting when you go canvassing that would be great
continue to be upright and and still why you talk to people
that's a great challenge
even if the people are like others instruments stoves it's hard to sort of like
the upright and silent and still talking to others instance you don't know you're talking to an unknown person you or know what they're gonna be
how do you talked of how do you show them i have a desire
it's mostly like lead people to vote own well in from how the there are three candidates that are identified and of quizlet the the ideas to flip the house and that will have global warming maybe we could get back and we think we think it will
maybe we think it what i would say maybe i think this might promote the conversation might it might i don't know if a well but i'm just gonna try this let's try it and if we flip the house and we noticed didn't that didn't seem to work let's flip it again
let's converse with the situation and is scary to go up and knock on the door of somebody you don't know who hasn't invited you
not all the houses have a welcome sign is made a rock maps but maybe not a welcome sign please come and talk to this asked about whatever you want to talk about were here to receive all kinds of guess not all houses give that impression for here i am not not
when i want to help this world
and i want to talk to you about voting may i please and again they may say no i'm too busy going to give you some money
or can i give you some some fresh
whatever kind of fruit you want fruit
exam like organic and get go to inorganic i got i got some more pesticides you like that brought both kinds
and you know i
part of what
being upright and still and silent provides if the ability to be flexible with my own fear and with what i meet
and sometimes you go to meet someone you're afraid but your present with it and you do something really wonderful that you know in i'm in new york capable of
i just thought you're going up to the house you're ready to knock on the door and you suddenly feel like i'm gonna run away from this house
i'm like totally going to run away this is just too scary for me i'm going to runaway run down the block and he ran out blocks that was a good exercise and i can do that again after a knock
i can not they say oh hello i have their own house he later
and you come back as a no i did have the right house
and so on it's it's an ongoing process and it it's okay to run away of is too scary
and then down the block a sort of conduct okay
all right and you go back try again try again until you can really had the conversation you want to have which is the conversation you want to have a conversation you want to have is not trying to get them to do what you want them to do
it's trusting the conversation
as the thing that will bring peace to the world not getting everybody to do what you think when i first teaching teaching position and sort of was considered
a teacher the first thing i did was to try to make everybody like me because that wouldn't that be good
and which is like go to the zendo every morning said to verses as is on go to servers
the upright all day long like me and give them like that
so i switched from getting people to be like me to helping people be the way they wanted to be
they had their own way they wanted to be like themselves but better so i'm helping people be themselves that works much better
and they're not didn't want up like me they wind up like themselves which is a conversation be like me isn't a conversation
and being like maybe like me is a conversation getting you to be like me isn't really a conversation because you don't really want me to make your to be like me do you even though you you're okay with me
still want to be murray instead of ram right okay i'm now i got it
i got over making murray ramp
at first i thought them
people said we'd give you some instruction you to this business which just happens to be what i'm doing and you will find
it might be totally obvious to everybody but you when you were talking i'm reminded that he are making his office to statues and of are having a conversation is a representative of line
yeah i
we are you
all the time and sometimes we know what a certain sometimes we don't but a when we don't we still are
well that was really are now in session wasn't it
i thought we would and quite a bit earlier but we didn't did read
who's in control here
obviously not you
and obviously not made to her but this is what happened today
thank you very much for the conversation