In a way, maybe this koan is a good koan to start the class and maybe a good koan for new people, too, because the punchline of this koan is, the mala kirti was silent. So we have these stories in this book. This book has 100 Zen stories, 100 main Zen stories, a few hundred sub-stories, but this one is called Vimalakirti's non-duality, but it could also be called Vimalakirti's silence. So Koan's study has something to do with silence and something to do with words. It's about I guess, how words and silence, what words and silence have to do with each other, and what words and silence have to do with misery, and what words and silence have to do with happiness and freedom.

[01:21]

And this particular case, of course, has these, you know, transmillennial superheroes of spiritual life. Vimalakirti, the most famous and most renowned lay Buddhist in history of Buddhism, Vimalakirti probably, a highly evolved and enlightened being, supposedly. And, or anyway, he's representing highly evolved spiritual being in the form of a lay person. So there too might be nice to start with this story for some of you because many of you are lay people. And this is about a lay person who He's a teacher of many, many great monks.

[02:45]

And his partner in this story is the, in a sense, trans-personal, trans-historical prince of Dharma, Manjushri Bodhisattva. So these two very important figures who are talking about speech and demonstrating silence And so we're kind of like peeping in on this story about this very high-level interchange. Many of the Zen stories are about, you know, they're like, they're public examples of enlightenment or enlightenment being enacted or enlightenment being perhaps newly and more deeply realized. So in a number of stories, the monk in the story comes forward to meet the teacher, and he has, or she has, some level of enlightenment, and the teacher interacts with the student in such a way that the student goes deeper, sometimes much deeper in their understanding.

[04:09]

So in the process of studying the material, the question is, in one sense, are we just eavesdropping on great historical events of enlightenment, which are kind of exciting to hear about and wonder about and be mystified by or even imagine some understanding of? Or is it possible even to, in addition to doing that, to somehow open up to the realm which is being pointed to or represented or expressed in the story? And When I think about what the stories are about in this way, then I remember that we need to, each of us, not exactly be active in this class.

[05:24]

You don't have to be active. But, in fact, as far as I know, Each of you is active right now. I mean, it isn't necessarily that I would attribute to you the delusion that you're active or inactive, but I feel that a function is being expressed through all of us, a great function is being expressed through our lives right now. I mean, life is coursing through us, you know, all of us, right now. That doesn't mean we necessarily need to think that we are doing something in this living. You don't have to think of it that way. you can just be present and experience that life is functioning through us and through whatever individuality there is in the room.

[06:36]

If there is any individuality around here, if there is any identity around here, the life is coming through the individual too. The individual doesn't stop the life. And some of you may also be thinking in terms of action. Some of you may feel like you are acting. If you speak or move, you may feel that you're acting. And again, it's not that I'm asking you to speak or move or think, but I think it is part of this class, part of what makes this class useful to all of us, is that if anybody does do anything in this class, that they be responsible and aware of whatever they're doing. So again, I'm not asking you to be active, I'm just saying, if you do think you're active in any way, if you do think you do anything during this hour and a half, then I think

[07:48]

that the class will have meaning for you if you notice that you think you're doing something. So in that sense, you're being responsible, if not active. And if you're being active, then you're active and responsible for your actions. So I need, in order for me not to be, I don't know what, excuse the expression, codependent, in order for me not to be promoting illness, I now ask you to be responsible for any karma that you perpetrate in this class. In that sense, if you do that, if you take that kind of responsibility, then you're taking responsibility for your worldly life.

[09:02]

Your worldly life as an actor, as a creature who thinks she does action. That is a worldly understanding of our life, that we may think that we can do something. That's a worldly view. All right? You can talk to me about that if you want to, but before you do, I'd like to say that being responsible for your worldly activity, to admit it to yourself and even to me and others here, that is not worldly activity. Thinking that you can do something is karma, is the definition of karma. And then seeing yourself act from that understanding is karma.

[10:05]

But taking responsibility for that and observing that, that's not karma, unless you say you're doing that, observing. But just the awareness that you're operating in this worldly, deluded way, that's not karma, that's spiritual life, that's honesty, That's maturity. That's whatever you want to call it. That's practice. That's taking good care of yourself because you're admitting what you're up to. So that's kind of like if we're doing that, if I'm doing that and you're doing that right now, then this class starts to come down to the ground, beyond the ground, And then we can talk even about these amazingly unusual and marvelous stories without sort of like flying around the room in the process.

[11:13]

Okay? Herb? Yeah, I think you answered my question. My question had to do with taking responsibility for my actions didn't that feed into the intention of doing it? You answered it. What's the answer? The answer is if I observe it and take responsibility for thinking that I'm acting, that's not karma. Okay, I agree. Unless you think you're doing. Yeah, if you think I'm doing the taking responsibility, then you can convert that into karma too. I did that. I took responsibility. But just sort of to notice, oh, there I am running around thinking I'm doing stuff. And now I'm doing that too. And that's karma also. Okay? And case 21 of this book is called Yun Yan Sweeps the Ground.

[12:15]

Case 21. Story number 21. So he's sweeping the ground, right? The Zen master is sweeping the ground, and his brother, Zen master, comes up to him and says, you're too busy. And he said, you should know there's one who's not busy. So, you know, he could have been meditating, his brother could have come up to him and whispered in his ear, too busy. Could have done it then, too. Or he could be sitting quietly in the koan class, and someone would come up to him and say, too busy. Too busy breathing, too busy digesting dinner, too busy thinking about whatever you're thinking about. Your mind's too busy, Henry. But then Henry can say, you should know there's one who's not busy.

[13:16]

In other words, now, there may be also someone here who's not busy, who's just observing this busy guy. And that could be, that one who's not busy doesn't belong to me or to Henry. And then the first brother who was sweeping said, I don't know, the second brother, after the first, the second brother, the first brother says, you should know there's one who's not busy, and then the second brother, the one who, the accuser says, well, then are there two moons, or two truths? Is there one truth that, you know, you're busy, another truth, I'm just, I'm not doing anything. I mean, there's, it's not that I'm not doing anything, there's one who's doing something, there's one who's busy, but there's also one who's not busy, who just... lets things be the way they are and just admits it. Who just allows it.

[14:18]

Who's aware and just allows it. Are those two different moons, two different truths? Well, yes, they are, actually. There's two truths. One truth is we're busy, deluded beings. Another truth is there's a life of not being busy. There's a life of not being involved in delusion. Is that two moons? Yes. And then the one sweeping raises his broom and says, which moon is this? Is this the busy one or the unbusy one? Which one is this? So if you're busy in this class, then also it would be good if somebody's not busy to have that one too. Now, this not being busy one is what we call, you know, sitting upright or being upright.

[15:26]

So wherever you are, you know, For Linda Cutts to be, you know, sort of like over around Liz someplace, that would be kind of like Linda would be not really being upright there, you know, because Linda's sitting over there, that's where she's supposed to sit when she's sitting there, right? So for her to be over on Linda Gordolution, that would also be kind of like not really doing her job. But for her just to be there, that's being upright. That's her thing. Whatever she's into, she does that. And for each of you to take responsibility and be at your place. And when you move, to take responsibility for that movement. That's your uprightness. And not to be ahead of yourself or behind yourself. That's your uprightness. And you're there to witness whatever is unfolding as your life. okay so on

[16:39]

Does that make sense to the newcomers and old-timers? Is that what I said? Does that make sense to you? I'm still working through it. Can you ask a question? No, not yet. I will when I'm clear about it. Thank you. And I also invite you, if you feel that you're... If you'd like to...

[17:57]

If you'd like to, like, stop the class anytime, you can stop the class. Just raise your hand. You know, you can say stop. You have to stop the class, which means just stop and then try to come back and, you know, feel what's happening to you. Come back and be where you are. If things get going too If these get so active with you that you can't stay with what's happening to you, then you can stop the class and come back to yourself. And of course everybody else probably would do the same at that time. Most people will. So it's okay. You stop the class. You don't have to stop the class, though you can, but you don't have to stop the class. And I recommend you don't stop the class just because you're having an intense experience. But if you're having intense experience and you feel like you're getting left behind, your experience is getting ahead of you, and you can't catch up with yourself, then stop the class and catch up with yourself.

[19:18]

So I don't want anybody to get left behind themselves. Also, if you're getting ahead of yourself, you want to stop the class and come back to yourself, that's also okay. Does that make sense? Sometimes if one person feels it, ten people feel it. What would it mean? I'm not in trouble understanding what it would mean, say, for Linda to be over where Liz is. For Linda to feel like she's over where Liz is. I don't understand how that would happen, how that could happen. Right now, and you're not understanding what's happening, do you feel like this lack of understanding of what I'm talking about is right there where you are?

[20:40]

I'm not sure where it is. That's what it's like for Linda to be over where Liz is. If you're sitting there and feeling completely present with not understanding what I'm talking about, then you're not doing what I'm talking about. But if you feel like your understanding is a little dislocated from you, and your lack of understanding is not totally intimate with you, then that's what I mean by Linda not being in her seat and being over where Liz is. That's what I meant by that. So, some people may feel like, oh, I understand, but they may not be totally intimate with that feeling like, I'm sitting right here and my understanding is right here with me. Other people may feel, I don't understand, but I'm completely present with that lack of understanding. I'm completely, like, abreast of the times of not understanding. Whatever you call it, anyway, the point is, I want you to be abreast of yourself. It's from that position that this discussion of these cases can have some impact at your self.

[21:52]

And where your self then can come forward and interact with the... The story can touch you and you can touch the story, but if you're not sitting at your seat having exactly your level of understanding, then the story could just promote your lack of presence the way you are. So I need you to be working with what's happening with you. So somebody else may not have had a problem with what I said about Linda being over by this. They need to be with that. You need to be with this. Does that make more sense? About what I'm questioning of you? I think so. Yeah. How can you be with anything but your level of understanding? Level? Well, you're just saying you want Matt to be with his understanding of what was going on with him as if there was a way that he could be somewhere else except totally with his self and his understanding at any one moment.

[23:08]

I mean, I guess I'm asking somewhat the same question that Matt asked, but... How can Linda be anywhere but exactly where she is? Well, for starters, I wouldn't be asking you to do anything that wasn't the way you already are. In my right mind, I'm never going to ask anybody to be any place other than where they are. But there's something in what you said that intimated to me that Linda could be getting over releases a little bit, or lindical reduction, in other words. Uh-huh. Right. You mean, from what I said, you thought I was saying that that was possible? You don't, of course, think that. I don't understand what you meant by that. What I mean by that is I ask you all to be present with yourself.

[24:11]

Now you can say to me, is it possible, are you suggesting by asking that that people cannot be present with themselves? I'm asking you to be the way you really are, namely to be present with yourself. You always are. Does that mean that I'm suggesting that you aren't? No. Does it mean I'm suggesting that when I ask people if they're present they usually don't say yes? Yes. Very few people, when I ask them if they're present, say yes. Very few people have confidence that they're present. Very few. Most people, even if they had some sense of, oh, well, I'm probably present, if you ask them, they lose their confidence. Most people. Like, I don't know what percentage. I only talk to Zen students about this. Usually I don't walk down the street and ask just anybody. Maybe most of the people who aren't Zen students would say, yes, no problem. And they wouldn't be like, you know, unnerved by a bald guy asking that question, you know, downtown San Francisco.

[25:16]

They'd just say, you know, weirdo, of course I'm present. But in San Francisco, actually, they probably would know that I was a Zen monk. And they probably would get befuddled and say, geez, I don't know. You know? Probably they would. Just like Zen students. Because most people in San Francisco, even if they're not Zen students, they think they should be. You know? Or they're in rebellion saying, no, I'm not a Zen student. I'm a Tibetan Buddhist. Leave me alone. But, of course, Tibetan Buddhists are all supposed to be present, right? So, you know... They still might say, actually, if you ask them, are you present? Are you sitting in your seat? A lot of people would say, well, gee, I don't know. Of course. I'm not saying they aren't. I'm just saying most people are not working at that. They say, well, do you have to work at it? Well, no, you don't have to work at it. But then how come if I ask people, they can't say yes? It's because people don't usually have confidence that they're present unless they

[26:19]

are actually saying, I'm here. Most people don't. Have you ever asked anybody that question? As a teacher in a classroom. Who's present? You know, and some kids say, some kids say yes, and some kids say, well, here. That's it. I think if I was really present, I wouldn't be able to speak. You think so? Yeah. Well, I have news for you. What? When you're present, okay, being present is not something you do. It isn't something you do. It is actually the way we are. I'm, again, asking you to be the way you are.

[27:22]

I'm asking you to be the way you are. I'm asking you to do the work of being the way you are. So if you're into karma, I'm asking you to be into karma. And to notice that and take credit for that. That's all I'm asking. Alright? So, when I ask you to be present with your karma, I'm not asking you to do anything. I'm just saying, if you are doing something, just Be responsible for it. You're not doing something in addition to it. If you add anything onto your being present, then that's another action. Okay? So that presence is pure and unfabricated. It isn't doing anything. It's actually being still and upright in whatever you're doing. All right? That's what I'm asking you to do. You say, is it possible to be any other way? Of course not. Does almost anyone answer, yes, I am present and upright and take responsibility? Almost no one will say yes. And if they say yes, and I say, really? Then usually they say, well, I don't know.

[28:24]

That's what's called the unfabricated state of being. Unfabricated, unmade, pure presence. That's what you've already got. I'm asking you, please, be the way you are. Although it's not made, it's not without speech. It can talk. You can talk from that place. You can also be quiet from that place. You can have nothing to say. You can be silent for a million years from that place. And you can speak from that place. And also, when you're quiet from that place, it can send chills through masses of people when you're quiet from that place. It can make people break into tears of joy when you don't say anything. That's what this guy did. He was present. He didn't say anything. And we're still talking about it. And if you ask me, Malik, if he was present, he doesn't necessarily say yes. but he doesn't get distracted and confused about what he is. He just does what's appropriate for the interaction.

[29:33]

He's totally confident in his presence. You can't move him from his place, ever. You can't move Manjushri either. These people are simply present. These people are doing... They're doing... They are practicing the practice that I'm asking you to practice. I'm asking you to do the practice that they're doing. If you do the practice they're doing, then if we talk about the story, you'll be doing what they're doing, and it'll work for you. If you're not doing what they're doing, then it's kind of like, well, I don't know what it is. I don't feel good about it, though. So you understand the Alenia? You can talk from that place. We don't know if you will or not. We'll see. Yes? The other example that you raised was getting ahead of yourself or getting behind yourself. And that reminds me of that. Which you can't do. People feel like they can do it. You can't do that. But people feel that way. What is that? I mean, that same phenomenon came up in a... It's like you're sitting there, right?

[30:39]

And you're feeling, I don't know what, you're feeling like, you know, and you just somehow, you just, like, you're leaning forward, you're ahead of yourself, and you're kind of like, you can't stay with that energy. I mean, you feel like you can't stay with the energy. Or something's happening, and you kind of like, you physically may, you may literally go like this. You may curl up. Now, of course you can curl up, and be totally expressive in curling up. You can be completely present in the drama of curling up. Okay? But a lot of people, when they curl up, that means that they're saying, I'm not here. Pretend like I'm not here. Don't ask me a question. Of course they're there, and they're showing their body saying, don't ask me a question, leave me alone. They're totally present, saying, leave me alone. But they feel like they're not there. And if you say you're present, they say, it didn't work. Still ask me a question.

[31:41]

Curl up more, maybe you won't ask a second time. Curl up more, maybe you won't ask a third time. People do that. They're totally present, and they're curled up, withdrawn state. They're exactly there, but the message is, I don't think I'm here, and I hope nobody finds out. And I hope nobody pries me open and gets it out of me, because if they do, they might find out something about me which they won't like. If they find out about me, what'll they do? Will they lock me up? Will they take my money away? Will they scratch my car? What'll they do to me? Many people are afraid what will happen to them if people find out what's in their heart. And so they shrink back from themselves. I understand the shrinking back. That's a very familiar thing. The lurching forward is harder for me. Let's say you're thinking about what you're going to do tomorrow.

[32:44]

But you're not present and saying, okay, now I'm here thinking about doing tomorrow. It's like you feel like you're not... It's like this kid I know. I know this kid, a sweet, amazing girl, a girl, very high energy, very smart, two really smart parents. But her parents got divorced. And she said, she said to her mom, I think, I think she said to her mom, she said, mom, So her parents live, her mother, her parents live, her father lives in Oakland now and her mother lives in Cambridge, Massachusetts. So she flies back and forth in the country between her parents, right? So she says to her mom, when I'm with you, you know, and we go to the airport, you know, to go back home, when I go to the airport to go to visit dad, I'm not with you. I'm thinking about dad. I'm so excited to see dad. I'm not with you. And when I go visit Dad, when I get there, I'm not with Dad because I'm thinking about coming back to you.

[33:50]

And when I come back with you, I'm not with you because I'm thinking about going with Dad. Of course she's with her mother. She's with her mother and she's with her father. But she feels like she's with the other one when she's with the one. She's never with either one of them. She feels that. That's the way the kid can feel. And she said, it's like this. And she told me this, I heard this story when the Cabbage Patch dolls were very popular. Remember those Cabbage Patch dolls? Do you know about Cabbage Patch dolls? What's your name? Suzanne, do you know about Cabbage Patch dolls? You do? Okay, so they were very popular dolls. This little girl knew about them too. So she said it's like you have a cabbage patch doll and you finally get one for Christmas, right? They're not easy to get. You had to wait in line to get those things, right? So finally you get one for Christmas, okay? And you unwrap it. And then by mistake, in a pile of wrapping papers and stuff, somebody takes your cabbage patch doll and puts it in the garbage.

[34:55]

And then it goes up to the garbage. And it turns out that in Boston, when the garbage people find, you know, really nice stuff, like really nice teddy bears and stuff in the garbage, they put them on top of their garbage truck as they drive away. So it's like you get a Cabbage Patch doll, and you lose it in the wrapping paper, and then it goes out to the garbage, and you find out, and you run out to the garbage truck, just as it's coming to get your stuff, and you see it driving away with your doll up on the roof. She says, that's what it's like when I'm with you and Dad. Okay? Now, I'm not saying everybody's that way, but she was aware that that's what it was like. It was like she was constantly losing her life because, you know, she was looking forward to being with Dad when she was with Mom, and she was looking forward to being with Mom when she was with Dad. When we're in the middle of certain ecstatic moments, certain people, none of you maybe, but certain people, when they're in the middle of certain ecstatic moments, you know what they do? They think, geez, how long is this going to last?

[35:59]

Let's do this again. They're right there and having this wonderful experience, but they're not because they're thinking, geez, I'd like to do this two or three more times. And they go, oh darn, I missed it. Now I have to do it another time. Next time maybe I'll catch it. But as soon as it really happens, do you know what I mean? That's called being ahead of yourself. And some people walk around leaning forward. They're actually leaning forward. And if you have x-ray vision, you can look in their head and see that they think they're actually a few inches ahead of themselves. They're not like back, poomp, on their feet. I'm here. They're kind of like, I'm over there. They're not. They're just leaning that way, thinking about that place and not thinking about these feet here. People can do that.

[37:01]

Of course they're sitting here, thinking of being over there, but, you know, then they lean into it and everything, it's almost like they're over there. It's almost like Linda's thinking of Liz, it's almost like she's over on Liz's seat, almost, maybe. People can do that. Did you know that? Did you know it was a good? No, I've had the experience of not feeling like I'm right here. Yeah, that's what I'm talking about. Some people specialize in getting ahead. People have these tendencies. And some people specialize in being present and thinking that's where they are. That's also the problem. Being present is actually to be present with whatever you think. You can think like this or like this. You can also be present no matter where you are. You actually never aren't present. I'm asking you to be unmoving,

[38:02]

wherever you are, in the midst of whatever you're thinking. It's always the case. Okay? But it's difficult to have 100% confidence, and confidence is very closely related to faith. You can't be really confident unless you really think that's the most important thing to do. Because if you don't think it's that important, then you know part of you actually thinks it's not that important. So part of you thinks, well, I'm not there. So the fact that you think that that's good is the same as your confidence that actually you've realized that state. And again, that's not doing anything. That's just faith or confidence in your presence. And if you don't practice that, then studying koans will be somewhat artificial.

[39:03]

You'll be growing this wonderful lotus in mid-air rather than in the mud of doing this kind of work with your individual sitting place. Everybody's got that place and time. So everybody's got to work with that. And to just be present with that isn't doing anything at all, even though you're doing something. And then the story comes from that place and goes back to that place. So if I am leaning forward and I recognize that I'm leaning forward, I'm really upright? Yes. Recognize and feel, experience what it's like to lean forward. When you fully express yourself as leaning forward, you're upright. Yes, in that case.

[40:15]

Right. Right. One of the great people in our tradition, you know, Buddha's cousin, you know, Shakyamuni Buddha's cousin, who was also his attendant for a long time, Ananda, who was the one who could remember everything Buddha said. He had a photographic memory, isn't it? He was very valuable to the whole Buddhist Sangha because he remembered everything Buddha said and he also remembered everything he heard that Buddha said when he wasn't around. So he remembered everything he directly heard and everything he indirectly heard. So he was like the storehouse for all the verbiage that Buddha produced that he could hear about. So they can have a big convention after Buddha died and they want him to come because they wanted to have him tell them everything Buddha said so they could all start remembering what Buddha said so they could orally remember the Buddha's teaching. However, the convention, the entrance to the convention was you had to be enlightened.

[41:18]

All the enlightened disciples of Buddha were going to get together And it turns out Buddha had lots of enlightened disciples. He was such a great teacher. Except the one with the most important people was Ananda, and he wasn't enlightened. So he couldn't come, but he needed him to come. So all the enlightened masters got together and did this super intense crash course to get him to wake up before the convention so he could attend. And so he had this really intense training period, and he worked really hard, and it was the night before the thing, and he hadn't yet awoken, and he was kind of depressed, and everybody was kind of depressed, because they wanted him to come, you know, and they needed him. I mean, he was working hard, you know, he was a hardworking guy, but he just somehow couldn't quite get... And the right groove there, you know, with being who he was, because he was such a guy.

[42:24]

It was hard being an uncle. So then, you know, the night before the meeting, he sort of like, just kind of like this, in kind of desperation, kind of freaked out. And instead of like getting into his bed mindfully like he usually did, he sort of like jumped into his bed, like flew through the air onto his bed. And as he was flying through the air, he woke up. And midair, flying to his bed, he woke up. And then when he hit the bed... Where did you hear that story? I don't know. [...] Did I tell him? Well, if I made it up, then I'm proud of myself. You know, I don't have that good imagination, Mark. That's your gift for not believing me.

[43:41]

Anyway, I heard that story. Now, here's the part that I did make up, though. I haven't told you that part yet. And that is, when he hit the bed, he understood what it meant to hit a bed. So, okay? That's what I need you to do to make this class not some kind of waste of your time. By waste of time, I mean waste of time plus also, like, cause trouble. Waste of time, you know, like, I can get in big trouble if you people don't do this, you know? The Buddhist police are going to send me to hell if you don't do this work. You understand that part? Do you understand what I mean? If I promote you, you don't understand what I mean? If I promote you reading these stories, these wonderful stories, without doing your homework, I'm distracting you from your homework.

[44:50]

Do you understand now? Getting it? If I let you come to this class and play with these Zen toys without doing your homework, then I'm I'm like supporting. You're in the koan class, and you get to come to the koan class, but you don't have to do your homework, so then I'm sort of like going along with that, right? Well, I don't want to go along with that. That's why I ask you to do this. If you don't do this, then I say, well, you're kind of letting me down, you're getting me in trouble, because I'm convening the class, right? So I'm responsible if you don't do your homework. I'm responsible for it. I get in trouble for it, okay? Okay? Do you understand? I'm not kidding. You don't understand? You don't? I'm not responsible for you not doing your homework. I'm not responsible for you not doing your homework. I'm not responsible for you doing your homework. But for you to come and teach this class under the pretense that you're studying Zen and you don't do your homework, then I'm colluding with you not doing your homework.

[45:57]

And I'm responsible for that. That's what I'm responsible for. And I don't want to do that. So that's why I need you to be present in this class and also before and after the class. Am I responsible for you colluding with me? No. No. You're responsible for colluding with me colluding with you. That's your responsibility. Does that make sense? You're responsible for what you do, I'm responsible for what I do, but if what I'm doing is basically supporting you and kind of like saying, well, you know, I come here and that sort of gives you some credibility in not doing your homework, then I don't want to do that. Right? That's why I'm begging you to do your homework. And homework is to be home all the time, especially right now. Okay? That's what this story is about. Then you can understand it. So, shall we read it?

[46:57]

These are words, come to the words. And what do the words say? By golly. Even if one's subtle function is universal, there's a place where one can't even begin to act. This is what I'm talking about, do you understand? Do you understand? This is what I'm talking about. I'm asking you to take responsibility for your function, even if it's universal or partial. You take responsibility for it, and then you enter the place where you can't even begin to act. That's the place of the one who's not busy.

[48:06]

Even if one's eloquence is unhindered, there's a time when one can't open one's mouth. Even if you're opening or shutting your mouth, okay? If you're present with that, that's not opening or shutting. You can't open your mouth when you're present with your activity. Do you understand? Does that make sense? That's what I'm talking about. There's somebody who can't open her mouth. That's the one who's totally present with the opening and shutting of the mouth. Long jia. Long jia. was like a handless man boxing. Jyāshan made a tongueless man able to speak. Who is it who can extricate oneself midway? Here's the case. And the background of this is Vimalakirti was sick.

[49:13]

The Buddha sent he asked his great disciples to go visit Vimalakirti. Buddha was giving a talk, right? And his main lay student was not present. He said, where is Vimalakirti? People said, he's sick. He said, would somebody go see how he's doing? So he asked his big, super famous, powerful disciples to go visit him. He asked one. He said, well, I'd like to visit him, but, you know... Then he told a story where Vimalakirti kind of like gave him a real intense teaching. And so he didn't feel qualified to go visit Vimalakirti. And he went down the list of all his great disciples, and none of them felt qualified to go inquire as to Vimalakirti's health. So finally, he asked Manjushri. Manjushri felt, okay, I can go. Manjushri's big time head of the Bodhisattvas, right? So he goes, but he brings 32,000 Bodhisattvas with him. Vimalakirti lives in a room.

[50:19]

He's actually very wealthy, but his own bedroom is 10 feet square. So Manjushri arrives with 32,000 bodhisattvas with him, and each bodhisattva, they come with these little portable lecture platforms. They don't just sit on the ground or stand on the ground. They stand on these thrones, these thrones that are brought. Each bodhisattva has lots of attendants who carry their thrones for them. And these thrones are, like, much bigger than the world. Huge, you know. Galactic-sized thrones that these bodhisattvas sit on. Each one's got that kind of throne. So they're having a little trouble, like, how to get all these bodhisattvas with their thrones into the room, right? So the Malakirti makes the room bigger. And all get in, put their thrones in there. And then they have a little chat. Vimalakirti with 32,000 bodhisattvas, and they all express their understanding about non-duality, right?

[51:21]

And then after they all give their talk, then Manjushri gives his. And Vimalakirti asks Manjushri, what is the bodhisattva's method of entering non-duality? And Manjushri said, according to mine, my view, In all things, no speech, no explanation, no direction, no representation. Leaving behind all question and answers, this is the method for entering non-duality. Okay? Does that sound familiar to anything you've heard recently? Hmm? Does it? Lena? Um... Yes. What does it sound familiar to? With. Forward and backward, not being present.

[52:26]

Yeah, right. It sounds familiar. I didn't realize that I was asking you, I didn't, I really, it can be hard to believe this, but I forgot this case when I was talking to you. But now I feel like he's, that his method was what I just asked you to do. Right? Right. The way of entering is... You don't do anything to enter into non-duality, in other words. All right? That's his way of entering. Do you follow this? You see? No questions, no answers, no directions, no representations. Well, it seems like 32,000 Bodhisattvas are doing exactly what the Sannyasins don't do. What do they do? They showed up to ask the question. Well, no, they just showed up and then Vimalakirti asked them what their method for entering non-duality was, right?

[53:30]

So then they gave... they talked about what their method of entering was. So now Manjushri is saying his method is, the way of entering non-duality is by, there's no directions about how to do it, there's no representations about how to do it, there's no questions or answers about how to do it. In other words, there's no way to enter non-duality. Including, like, not a way is also not the way. Okay? Just be there. Just be there. There's nothing you can... Then you can't do that. That's what he said. He's giving an explanation. He's giving an explanation himself, though, isn't he? That's what I meant. It's like all these people are doing... Well, at least he is. At least he is giving an explanation about the fact that he doesn't give explanations, that he doesn't give directions. That's what he's saying, right? But he's saying what it isn't, isn't he? He's saying what it isn't. He's saying what what isn't. being there. It's no direction, it's no representation.

[54:31]

Being there is not any of those things. Being there is no direction, it's no representation. But he is saying that, though. He's saying that partly because all the other Bodhisattvas said what it was. He's also saying it in response to Vimalakirti's question. But still, he didn't have to say that, but he did. He didn't have to talk, but he did. He's also setting up Vimalakirti very kindly. So then he turns and he asks Vimalakirti, well, how about you? We've spoken, now you should say, good man, what the Bodhisattva's method of entering into the non-duality is. And Vimalakirti, according to what it says in the piece of paper here, it says, he was silent. Okay? That's the story. We've each spoken, coming from... Is he saying that we've each found words, we've each asked a question and had an explanation, like found, expressed ourself in that moment, and then Vimalakirti is just being that moment.

[55:53]

There's nothing more to say. Well, you can say that. But you could also say that Vimalakirti asked those bodhisattvas, what is the bodhisattva's method for entering into non-duality? And each one of them answered him. He spoke, he talked, he asked them the question. Then each one of them responded verbally to his question. Okay? Each one expressing themselves in that moment, how they enter their... Yes. And very beautifully, each one of them very beautifully expressed how they did that, how they do that. And then they turned it back on him, who'd been asking all the questions, and they asked him, and he didn't say anything, supposedly. Does the, we have each spoken, does that refer to the 32,000?

[56:53]

Yes. Right. In the sutra, actually, the 32,000 is represented by 32. There's actually 32 things in the sutra, but there's 32, actually 32,000 bodhisattvas came, but the only 32 of them actually get in the book. It's 31 plus Manjushri. So Manjushri says, we all said, you asked us, we asked you, we told you, now how about you? And then this thing says he was silent. That's what it says in the sutra. However, in the Blue Cliff Record, the story is in the Blue Cliff Record, too. Now there's another call-in collection. This is case 48 in this book, and the Blue Cliff Record is case 84. So at the point where Manjushri asked Vimalakirti, how about you? Then the person who made the collection of koans and writes the poems and commenting koans, he then wrote, what did Vimalakirti say?

[58:14]

Okay? So in this other story, the way to tell the story is they tell the story this way, and they say, Manjushri asked Vimalakirti, and then this Zen monk says, instead of saying Vimalakirti was silent, he says, what did Vimalakirti say? And then he says, seen through. Do you follow that? So it's the same story, but instead of This priest writes the story down, and then he says, then he writes, what did Vimalakirti say? And then he writes, seen through. In other words, I see through Vimalakirti. in the blue cliff record the blue cliff record is 100 stories the person who collected the 100 stories his name is suedu zen master suedu okay he collected the stories and then after each story he wrote a verse all right

[59:36]

But in this story, he wrote the story down, but instead of writing the last line as in the sutra, Vimalakirti was silent, he didn't write that. He stopped the story before that. And he wrote himself, what did Vimalakirti say? Question mark. And then he wrote, seen through. That's the way he told the story. The person who collected these stories, his name is Tiantong Hongzhiu. He collected the hundred stories. He wrote the story differently. Instead of writing the way Suedu wrote it, he told the way it is in the sutra. Okay? Told it differently. Quoted it exactly from the sutra. But he had read the way Suedu did before. He didn't copy Suedu's method. He did differently. And then he wrote a poem, which we will read. So again, he said, the Zen teacher who told this story in the booklet record said, seen through.

[60:54]

So what does seen through mean? It means he said seen through. It means he wrote that. That's what it means, first of all, right? He wrote that. He wrote seen through. What's this seen through about? Hmm? Does it mean this person who wrote that understands? It means this person who wrote it understands. It means I see through. I see through. Manjushri, I see through the Malakirti. Before I tell you what the Malakirti... The Malakirti doesn't... We don't have to say he didn't say anything. We say, what did he say? What did he say? I see through. I see this. I see what he said. So is this an enlightenment story for him? Is that what you're saying? Well, you could say it's an enlightenment story for him, or you could say that's not... Is it a story?

[62:02]

I guess it's a story. It's a story as, I just wrote this story, I just wrote this calling out, I'm stopping one line short, and I'm writing, what did he say? And I'm saying, I'm telling you, I see through this story. In 100 cases, he didn't write that very often. But this one he did. He's saying, I see through this story. I see through this silence. I see what they're doing here. Kind of bragging. What's his point of saying that? It meant he understood. It meant he understood what he did when he was silent. It means he's saying that he understood what Vimalakirti and Manjushri were up to. It means any way he said that.

[63:03]

We don't know if he really meant it, but any way he did say it. But it does raise the question, very kindly in a way. You asked what's the point of bringing this up? Yeah, what's the point of him bringing it up? I would guess, I have a guess, but maybe some of you have a guess too. What would be the point of bringing this up, of mentioning that you saw through it and then writing it in a book? Yes? The thing that comes to my mind is that he's saying that the silence wasn't really silent. Yes. That the silence itself was a form of speaking. Yes. And that because with the setup, it wasn't truly what it is, so you don't have to be enlightened to see through it. Right. That would be accounted for by, what did he say? Wouldn't it? Mm-hmm. When you say, what did the molecule just say, that would speak to what you said pretty well, I think, for me.

[64:07]

Is that enough for you? What's the point of saying, I see through it, or seen through? What's the point of that? If I'm working on this case, and I'm memorizing what's here, and I'm putting it in my heart, and I'm saying that, somehow that's important. I don't know why. Mm-hmm. Well, that's another mode. Yes? Who was that? Marianne? He actually saw through the kolamati, just to understand. And it wasn't only him understanding it, but he was understanding it through the kolamati. That's a lovely way to say it. That's kind of the Scottish kind of... Yeah, definitely.

[65:09]

Yes? Given the answer to the question, how could he be anything but silent? Given... Given the answer to his question, how could he be anything but silent if he got the question? Given... If he got the answer to the question. When Vimalakirti asked the question, when he's given the answer, how could he not be anything but silent if he understood the answer? You mean, if he understood what Manjushri said, how could he be anything but silent? Yes. Yeah, right. That would make sense, wouldn't it? To follow the great Bodhisattva's instruction and be silent. Yeah. So why is this such a big deal? Does it say it's a big deal somewhere? It seems like this conversation is so involved with us, something that's really simple. Yeah, that's right. You can have an involved conversation.

[66:12]

So maybe I'm trying to make this complicated when actually I'm thinking this is really simple, but it sounds like it's a really complicated thing here. Not necessarily. It doesn't say here that it's complicated, does it? No. No, it doesn't say that any place so far. But you were thinking maybe it is, right? Because why would they... Well, I'm thinking that maybe I'm not getting it right, because I'm thinking this is incredibly simple, but this seems like an amazing conversation about something that's very simple. But if it's simple, why mention it? Yes, Michael. Okay. All right. Okay. Why, then? Why what? Why mention it? You're the one who brought it up. I didn't say it was simple. We didn't, so far I didn't hear anybody say that this was complicated, and maybe you guessed that it was because we're here and having this class about this, and everybody's talking about it for a thousand years.

[67:13]

We don't necessarily do that because it's complicated, that's not necessarily so. There are complicated things, I suppose, but this isn't very complicated, right? It doesn't seem very complicated to you, does it? Well, it did at first until I sort of looked at the question. I thought, well, how could he just be silent? So first you thought it was complicated and now you think it's simple. Right. Right. But it's simpler not to even think that it's simple. Simple. I mean, wouldn't that be simpler? I guess it'd be simpler not to think anything. Yeah, but it's hard not to think anything and read this. So after you read it, that's about it. That would be quite simple. Okay. Without even saying it was simple. But it's okay to say that it's simple, really. Whatever you do here is fine. You can say it's simple, complicated, fine. That's just you... I'm just inquiring.

[68:14]

This is an inquiry for me, so I'm wondering about this. I'm really wondering. And what came for me from this is, why are this so simple? And then the question came out was, so why is there so much conversation about this? Well, if it weren't complicated, if we just sort of said, put complicated aside, right? And then you thought for a second there it was simple. Okay, just put simple aside now. Just leave the stories there by itself, okay? It's not even simple. Then one might say, what is people talking about a story that's not complicated or simple? What would be the reason for talking about this story then? You might ask that question. I already have in my mind, yeah. So that leads me to think that this person before me is thinking that if something's not complicated or simple, why would you discuss it?

[69:20]

It doesn't necessarily follow you think that, but it sounded like that. Mm-hmm, yeah. Is that how you feel? I'm not sure right now. But it sounded like that was maybe, like, if it's complicated, let's talk about it, but if it's simple, why would we? Yes, yes, I was in that mindset. The reason for talking about this story is not because it's complicated and not because it's simple. Do you know why we're talking about this story? No. It's actually, in a way, I'm going to tell you a story about that, that's actually kind of a simple story. Do you want to hear it? Yes. It's because before we studied this story, we studied the story before it. And we decided about five years ago to go through this book, one after another. So after 47, we studied 48. Because we're studying this book. That's why we're studying this story today.

[70:25]

Not because it's complicated, not because it's simple, not because someone else could say, well, isn't part of the reason why you're studying this story that it's this fantastic story, and every time he even thinks about the number 48, he gets goosebumps all over? Is that why you're studying this story? It has something to do with it, it's true. That I chose this book because this book really inspires me, you know. But still, I did not choose this book because the stories are complicated or simple. I chose these stories because they make me happy and they encourage me and I love them. And the Dharma comes popping out of them and jumps in my heart and runs around in circles and makes me want to live longer with other people and share my joy at reading these stories. Not because they're complicated or simple. Although, sometimes they look complicated and sometimes they look simple. Sometimes they look impossible. Sometimes they look incredibly easy and I don't want to study, I want to skip to the next one because it's so simple and boring.

[71:29]

But we don't do that. We don't skip. We read the boring ones, too. We read the ones I don't like. And I tell people the ones I think are boring and they get really upset with me and say, no, no, it's really interesting. And we get into that. I didn't associate simplicity with boredom. No, I didn't say you did. But I'm just saying, I sometimes... read some of these things and I really don't want to study them I want to skip to the next one because the next one is really interesting I sometimes feel like that just for a second occasionally and I mention it and then a lot of other people don't feel that way they think this particular story that I'm bored with is totally fascinating and important so they encourage me not to skip because I actually promise not to skip I used to study this book and skip around and do the interesting ones but then like I said about five years ago I said let's just go straight through and not skip any and go all the way to the end, no matter what. I made that vow. And several other people did too, although they're not here tonight.

[72:37]

I think your reasons for reading this story are lovely. Thank you. And it really is, you know, I welcome any opinions about these stories. I sincerely welcome, I joyfully welcome you to think that they're simple, complicated, stupid, meaningless, inspiring, you know, earth-shaking, enlightening, deluding, any of that stuff. I welcome you to express yourself, to say that, especially say the stuff that, you know, you think is not permitted. Especially come forward with that stuff. You're welcome. Yes? Yes? It seems to me powerful in this story is the question, and it's a little bit like her question. Once you ask that question, you're into this kind of answer. It's like the question leads to the answer, which is all part of the same thing, which is not being present. An answer is not being present?

[73:39]

The question starts the answer. So people come up with a method for how to understand non-duality. The question starts the answer. It's almost nine o'clock and you've just brought up something there. But I will remember that you said that. And you'll pay for that. Please come back. You heard her, she said the question starts, the answer starts in the question. She said it, didn't you? Okay, so thank you for saying that and we will discuss that in detail some other time. This perspective that the question starts in the answer. And that that's a problem in a certain way. But now it's time to kind of, like, close down the shop for the night.

[74:41]

And if you want to, you can start studying Case 49. I thought I have copies of Case 49 up here. If you want to start studying Case 49, you can come up, take one, and start reading it. I thought tonight we would get through Case 48, but I don't think we did. Really. No. We didn't. See, I've lost control of things. So I think we'll study case 48 at least one more week, but you can start studying case 49 if you want to. But I just personally feel like one of the things I get from the statement, seen through, one of the things I get is, do I see through? Do I see through? So I'm wondering about that, I see through. You can wonder about that, too, if you want to. Yes, Linda?

[75:42]

This translation that Arlene has says, completely exposed, rather than seen through, which... Completely exposed. Or completely exposed. Completely exposed. So I wonder about that. Is there complete exposure here of manjushri, of vimalakirti, of nonduality? Has nonduality been completely exposed here? I think we've undressed it a little bit. It's literature. So that's kind of like, you'd wonder about that. The nice thing about non-duality is it's not stuck in this class, so it'll be swooping in and out of your life all week, as usual. So have fun.

[76:40]

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