As usual, I'm struck by hearing the recitation of these verses, or arousing the bodhisattva vow. And I remember that I've learned from the teachings that bodhisattvas progress along the path of the Buddha way by means of great vows. They carry out great vows, they make great vows, and they are carried by great vows. So bodhisattvas have a wide range of activities like we do, all of us. And when our activity is carried on by means of these great vows, this means we're on the bodhisattva path.

[01:10]

And again I struck by what it says, when you hear the wondrous dharma, you will renounce worldly affairs. My mind harked back to the first talk on Friday night about, you know, imperious, imperial, commanding power. That's worldly affairs. That's a worldly way to be, to try to command and coerce beings into doing the right thing. Nice that we want people to do the right thing, And we want animals and the earth to do the right thing. That seems OK. We want that. But to be imperious about it and try to control them into it is a worldly affair. To renounce that and maintain the Buddha way, which is the way of cooperative power, the power of us working together

[02:24]

I see before me some words which say, the original vow of all the Buddhas. In the Lotus Sutra, Chapter 2, it says, the original vow of all Buddhas. Buddhas have vows? Yes. And one expression of the Buddha's original vow is, by the path that I now walk, I desire universally to cause all creatures to enter the same way and walk together with me. So this is their vow, and these Buddhas all together are just living in the middle of this wondrous dharma and transmitting and realizing unsurpassed, complete, perfect enlightenment.

[04:02]

And I think I read in what we recited Yeah. So they're practicing in the midst of this one-width dharma, and they're transmitting this one-width dharma together with all the other Buddhas, and they're realizing enlightenment. And they're also, at the end of the verse of chapter 16, it says, they're also always thinking. Buddhas are thinking all the time. What are they thinking? How can I cause beings to enter the unsurpassed way and to quickly perfect the body of the Buddha? They think that all the time. Some people might think that Buddhists don't think.

[05:11]

But this says Buddhists are always thinking. They're always thinking about all beings, and how they can help me. It reminds me of Suzuki Roshi. Yeah. What Okasana was saying back in... Mm-hmm. Human beings like us can think, right? Matter of fact, we have easy time thinking. So how about making our thinking just be like Buddha's thinking? Just always think. Think what? How can I help all living beings enter the unsurpassed way and quickly perfect the boundless Buddha?

[06:12]

How can I always think of that? And always thinking, how can I think that? But helping people is more than just thinking of helping people. Helping people is also sitting upright in the midst of this wondrous dharma, and receiving it and transmitting, receiving it and transmitting. It's being transmitted to you, the Buddhas are sending it to you, you can receive it, and when you receive it, when it comes to you, then it resonates back from you to the Buddhas and to all other beings. And it comes from all beings, including Buddhas, and then it goes back to them. That's not thinking. That's not thinking. That's realization.

[07:20]

That's the actual state of the trigana. However, you still can be sitting and thinking while you're receiving the trigana and sending it back. You still could be a human being who's thinking. And what might you be thinking while you're receiving the Dharma and sending it back? You might be thinking, how can I help all beings enter the unsurpassed way? You might be thinking that. Or you could be thinking, how can I receive this Dharma and give it back? You could be thinking that. Or you could be thinking something else, as you know. But you could learn to always think there's Maybe you could learn to always think, how can I contribute, help all beings enter the unsurpassed way.

[08:22]

Now just now I said that, and in order to say that I had to think it. Somehow I was able to think that and say that. And my body kind of joined in on it too. So this is actually what many bodhisattvas are saying to us, that what you're thinking, what you're speaking, and what you're posturing, to be lining up with that vow to help all beings enter the world. To join in the process of the Buddhas receiving and transmitting the wondrous truths, the wondrous, subtle truth. And I also want to mention the proposal to you that the Buddhas live, are dwelling in this truth, this wondrous time, and that's where they live.

[09:31]

this fierce, wonderful, mutual, persistent state. And this dharma, this situation in which we're helping each other, That mutual assistant is radiant. It's bright, it's a bright light. Working together in this way is radiant. So the Buddhas are living in this radiant truth. And they are illuminated in this illumination, and there's no trace of consciousness in their illumination. There's no sense of awareness of it. There's total immersion. Now, they have consciousness, and their consciousness is illuminated by the sun, but their consciousness, there's no trace of the consciousness in the illumination.

[10:46]

Sentient beings Also, there's no trace of sentient beings' consciousness in the illumination either. But sentient beings also live in the same place. They live in this world of wondrous dharma. However, their consciousness is not illuminated by the light of this truth. But it sounds like the radiant and the unconsciousness are separate things. No, they're not separate. I think so, but I don't understand it. You can have something right next to something that there's no separation between them, but the light doesn't illuminate the dark without them being separated. And consciousness is what would say that they were separate. When the consciousness is illuminated, the consciousness doesn't believe in separation anymore.

[11:52]

So an unilluminated consciousness would think that some things were separate. But still, in the non-separation, there's no trace of the consciousness in the non-separation. And that non-separation is illuminating, can illuminate consciousnesses. So the non-separation illuminates Buddha's consciousness, but Buddha's consciousness doesn't. There's no trace of consciousness in the illumination. So words don't reach the illumination, but the illumination can reach the words. Consciousness doesn't reach the illumination, but the illumination can reach consciousness. And the illuminated consciousness can speak of the illumination, which it doesn't reach.

[12:55]

So this is a little bit of a warm-up. Now we can read a little bit more about this. So if you open your sutra books, There's a I think it's called. What's it called? Yeah. Yeah. So maybe we could recite this text at this point. Are there any extra copies? So you're going to have to share. Oh, no. What was it? Are you ready? Huh?

[14:11]

All right. Now, all ancestors, and all . This is . It was done so that we could not see dirt and the sidewalks. Personally, I invented this excellent method of enthusiasm for the teaching. Maybe I'll have a great tradition of our teaching. It is said that you should write with Chinese names straight forward, but I am not. It's the youngest of us all. I'm the ninth of us all. From the first time we did the master, we doubted he had any sense of greed. I thought we'd change the word as needed, but we had no sense of greed in terms of truth. You should just follow what you see, and never struggle with it by doing it alone. A human growing moment you can express through this video in 3D actions by accessing an archive in Samadhi.

[15:20]

The model of the non-physical world begins through this video, and in a hyper-sign it turns into a binder. You can have it as a sample, but it won't allow you to access it if the original source can produce this kind of evidence, and you need to be aware that this is the beginning of the way. Through the draw of all beings in the ten directions and six realms, including the three lower realms that once sustained pure body and mind, we will have sustained great emancipation in our intestinal ways. And if some of you follow the email address that I put away to you, you will get a lot of tips for taking out the bullet of lottery and receiving a lot of money from the WP3. You'll give me the indication that I can really help with anything. I just wanted to tell you that I am so happy to see you today. I hope you get a lot of luck this time. I hope you get a lot of luck this time. I hope you get a lot of luck this time.

[16:22]

If you have subscribed to the region, it relates in any fashion to you, and helps you in conceiving a vision. You think of everything like a seven-hour station, where you drop away and die to get money. But if you're one of the greatest, the private parts, and the apps, make you think about your system, and you don't really care about it. Some events we will create to help with that activity, as many of you are well-practiced, like since I was with them in the time of their destruction, there were comments that they were going to have the opportunity to see that on and on they would have heard, and many figures say that would have been on and on they would have heard. In a desperate race to meet his wild side, his powers are all engaging with the activity. Those who proceed are determined and willing, and one at a time, as they are now, will be conceivably outplayed with their seconds. Later on, they will grow, and they will get into the habit of their circles. They will choose to shoot you before you can touch them, and they will spray you with their scabies, and then suddenly shall be eaten.

[17:28]

Because it makes all those who make me dear and sweet with you, well, they can't mess with that virtue. And while I grow widely excited, I start to think my enemy persists. He must have been made to be one of the evil-minded people who put on the armor. All of this, having heard his unappealing perception, he comes to his own distortedness and stillness. He gives me a new realization. It attracted a sense of realization that what you see in the action has been a pure, certain order of negative purchasing. Each difficulty I recognized separately, although one of the things I had in mind was that it should not be the imagination itself. It was the realization that it is not the reason why I had to believe it in my mind. You need to self-discipline and you're not going to be able to continue your education and you're not going to be able to do anything. Nevertheless, as long as you're not manipulating yourself or manipulating somebody, you're not going to be able to do anything.

[18:31]

Thank you. in the American streets as well. Perhaps the amount of stuff we're making here may get even higher as people enter the streets as much, but we have a station, which without being lacking, would be the station itself most anonymously and without a CC from one way. This indeed is something that is outstanding and even one person can rely on one thing, and that is the fact of the importance of the all-day existence of the United States for all of our time. That student asked you to impress him by telling him his humorous desire to marry one of the good at teaching and the silly.

[19:39]

He hung on them as if they had been equal in all sense of practice, equal in all sense of realization. They sizzled by moonshine and swastika. They had divided the universe by many activities. They could both wear a hat with their heads to the center of the earth, or be in the center of the earth. However, they could only do this one. After that, they took the game, followed it, and read some traditional practice from the original writers. They used their socks to close the nature. Now that we've made it to New York, we'll notice that that inversion has noticed me when all this has happened to me and how it is. If you're so good at explaining it that you agree with it so that you can finally make sure that no one requires a person's licensing, then you have no idea of the quality of our agenda. I just want to point out that the place where it says, because earth, grass, trees, walls, tiles, and pebbles all engage in good activity, it actually says in the text, because all things in the universe, including earth, grass, trees, walls, tiles, and pebbles, all, in other words, we really do mean all things.

[21:11]

And here's some examples that you might not be able to apply. all beings in the universe are engaged in Buddha activity, it's proclaimed here. And they work together in a great light, and it returns to you, and then you send it back to them. And this is kind of like This is the standard that would hold up to the true Dharma. So if somebody has a truth, we say, does that truth include all beings involved in working that truth? That's the standard we'd hold up in the tradition of the Buddhas and ancestors. And also, Again, Myrna Lloyd says that each moment of satsang is equally wholeness of practice, equally wholeness of realization.

[22:17]

Another translation is each moment of satsang is equally the same practice and the same enlightenment as you and all beings. Every moment you're sitting The actual zazen of the Buddhas is equally the same practice as all beings can use. That's the Buddha's practice at that moment. And then again, I point out that each of us does our own little karmic act of body, speech, and mind each moment of sitting. You're thinking about your body and other people's body. Other people are thinking their body and your body. Or some people only think of their own body. People are thinking different things while they're sitting. And some people are thinking this sitting is a

[23:21]

This sitting, which I'm thinking and I'm posturing and I'm being quiet about, this sitting is my offering to the Buddha, to the zazen of the Buddha. My sitting, which I'm thinking about, is a ritual offering to the sitting of all beings. Now, my sitting, by itself, I may not feel like it, you know, it's like the hand was taking the emptiness. I may or may not feel like my sitting is like that. In other words, I may not feel like my sitting is the thing that I'm always tending towards in the past. I've always been tending to this sitting. And my sitting always sends in the future. But the actual zazen is the thing that

[24:24]

Even when we're not sitting, we're heading towards it all the time. It's our future, and it's our past. We always come from that, and we'll go to that. So even if we don't feel like we're sitting, we remember that we came from this sitting, which is the same practice and the same . And always thinking of this practice of sitting this way, together with all beings, is the same as always thinking of how you can help all beings that take the Buddha away. It's another way of talking about it. It's a kind of way that focuses on your body, how your body can be a ritual focal point for your vow, for your thought.

[25:28]

I'm always thinking of how I can help all beings, all creatures, all beings, not just humans and animals, but everything in the universe, enter the Buddha way. I'm always thinking of that. And I've used my body, this is the way I use my body sometimes, set it up right, as a place and a time, opportunity for this kind of thinking. Do I have to come up here? I'm so close already. Isn't it too soon?

[26:31]

Never mind. That was pretty good. Talked about revealing yourself, huh? I was just wondering, and I may have dreamed this, but it seems like I heard you say that all beings, is it Shujo, is that the part that's all beings? Shujo. Shujo. Yeah. That it could be all beings. Without the S. And that's how somehow I've fallen into thinking that way, which seems somehow more inclusive to me, less particulate and more inclusive.

[27:37]

Is that an error? Are you a particulate? Yes. I want to include you by supporting you to think that way. But if you came up to me and said, I think that I heard it was being, but I'd like to say beings, I would support that. Sometimes we talk about two different sides of the process. One is like everybody's the same, you know. That's like wisdom, everything's the same. But compassion's like everything's different. All the little different things. the healthy ones and the sick ones, of course they're all one truth. How they're supporting each other is the wonder star, is Buddha. So if you want to emphasize how they're all one great wonderful dharma, that's like one being, one Buddha reality.

[28:45]

But that doesn't need to be said. These are the particulars, I mean, they say, because some of the particulars feel separate from only the other particulars. So it's the particulars, these particulars will suddenly seem to think they're separate. So the Buddhas are those who realize that we're not separate, and sentient beings are ones who don't realize we're not separate. They're the ones who are trying to save. We're not trying to save the ones who know that this is one wondrous, everything is one wondrous truth. So maybe it's better to say beings, because they're numberless, right? They're not one, or two, or three, or four. You know, we can't number them. But I support you to say being. And you can be, you know, the one to say being, and everybody else to say beings, and you're welcome.

[29:50]

All reconsidered. All reconsidered. Thank you. Could I ask you a question? Yes. What did you think you showed a little while earlier? What did you think you showed us? My uncertainty about being myself. Anything else? Nothing comes to mind. Thank you. Everybody else at the board's rather able to not come up. A teacher, a theater teacher. taught me about particular and being in beings.

[31:05]

Could you hear her? Could you hear her? Say the beginning again. A theater roshi taught me about the beings being. Her teaching was that it is only in absolute attention to the particulars. that you can possibly see the whole. And I find that works when I remember it. Mm-hmm. Anne. Anne? OK. Thank you for being here. Every time, you say it in some way that supports what I can come to understand more and more. I haven't been up here to say that yet. Thank you for inviting me. And thank you for being such a wonderful, nurturing mother to us, and cooking us fully.

[32:14]

You're welcome. You're such a small staff. That way more of them could be in here. I do know there should be 19 people in there with you. We have to. We have to. That's the advantage of putting the teacher in his anteroids. The teacher wants to push the brain to the center. He's so close. It turns out once they're in the kitchen, it's pretty bad. So this morning I asked you a question about stories. For myself, stories have often seemed more real than what is around because of the meaning that's part of those stories. And I'm not sure I fully... You say stories seem to be what's around?

[33:20]

Well, the reality, the meaning of stories can actually... This is what, for myself, imbues the way I go through my life, because this is my engagement. But also, stories seem to be what's around. Sure. And what's around, what seems to be around, is story. Yes. Both ways. And that's our karma. And that's our enclosure. That's the story we have, is a little enclosure in which we lit up inside a big wonderous diamond, which is gently knocking on the door of the story. But you should be nice to the story, which is between you and the truth. If you're nice to the story, the story will say, hey, you want to see something, Moons? and let you jump in and let it jump into you.

[34:26]

So, and to follow that with an additional part of my question then, you provided some clarity which I maybe, you were gracious, but I did not fully receive regarding my statement that It's after we leave Sashin and your insights have been penetrating and very precise. And so as I leave Sashin and I am thinking and making my story, the language I used this morning, the language I'm using now is as though I am going to create, but I don't create. That was your point to me. I just wondered if you could... To clarify that point again, I am not necessarily creating a story, I'm engaging. How should I practice that point? In this context that we're sitting up right now, it's the context of you receive a story and you can give that story away.

[35:36]

Now you're receiving a story and you can give that story away. You can also receive the story and hold on to it and lose track that it was a gift. And if you don't give it away, you can lose track that it could be a gift. But we're going to receive stories every moment and we're going to give them away. So that's one way to meditate, is just to meditate on how to receive the story. And you have a responsibility to receive it You can receive it, and you do. But you can also miss it to receive it. Whether you miss it or not, you're still responsible. But you can receive it, and then now you have the ability to respond by giving it away. When you give it away, you have a chance now to receive another one and give it away.

[36:41]

If you don't give it away, you don't notice that you're receiving another one. You think you're holding, you think you're getting it, you think you're making it. But actually, we all support you, the whole universe supports you to be a being who's now receiving a story. And we also support you to give it away, and you do give it away. And we're also now telling you to notice that. But not notice it directly, because you actually have a story of noticing it, but you have to be aware of the teaching And that will open to you the actuality of this radiant relationship that we have of receiving stories, for example, the story of the self, and giving away the story of the self. Receiving the story of the self and giving away the story of the self. Self-receiving and self-giving awareness. So every time you have a self, which is fairly frequent, give it away.

[37:51]

Make it a gift. And you have a thinking self, so make the thinking self a gift, plus make the thinking a gift. And then even think of giving and make the thinking of giving a gift. But even if you're not thinking of giving, make it a gift. Whatever you're thinking, like, that's a good person, make that a gift. Because it is. And the way it's a gift is inconceivable. But you can make your story about it, line up with it. You can align yourself, yeah, and open to that actuality of this process by thinking about it. I'm enjoying it. And simply, like I said before, realize that everything that you see is a gift to you. And everything you are is a gift to you. And everything is trying to teach you, trying to teach us a wondrous dharma.

[39:00]

You see somebody you like, you see somebody you don't like, everything is trying to teach you the dharma. See somebody you like and you say, ah, trying to teach me the Dharma. Fine. Great. Now let's look over here. You think maybe that's not teaching you the Dharma? Yeah, I don't think it's teaching you the Dharma. That's how it's teaching you the Dharma. It's teaching you to open up the Dharma. It's not your idea of Dharma. The Dharma is not necessarily pleasant. It's not necessarily the face of a frame. It's trying to teach you that the Dharma's coming through everything. When you see that, then you'll see that everyone, when you see that everything's teaching you the Dharma, then you'll see everyone as your close friend. Buddha sees everyone as your close friend because she sees everyone as giving her the greatest gift possible, the truth of cooperative life, of living together.

[40:09]

to make everyone love everyone, even people who are sent in the hatred. What are you going to give him? Anyone? I'll try to pass it off. Yay. I have two basic experiences of reality. One is completely in accord with your teaching. The other is of an Albert Canoe Camus called the benign indifference of the universe. Benign indifference. Yes, right. And the awareness that a comet could hit the Earth and multiple species, including us, could be destroyed.

[41:18]

And awareness that the lion is the prey for the, the gazelle is the prey for the lion. And just aware of how Life does feed on life. And the gazelle is not, I don't think, necessarily voluntarily giving itself to the lung. But again, that's my... It's the, I guess, the central question for me ever since I had a strong sense of the... the Dharma as you described it, which was seven years ago, is kind of reconciling that somehow with this sort of sense of the benign indifference of the universe. And I wonder if, I wonder how you deal with that, how the Buddha would deal with it.

[42:19]

I see what one is benign indifference, And then you also apply the vanine indifference to an example. And the example you applied it to was, one of the examples was a gazelle being eaten by a lion. Right. And the comet getting wrecked. Look into the gazelle one, OK, for a second. OK. You've got a gazelle and a lion interacting. And so now, but then you said something which I didn't see a benign difference I created a jugna for. Your jugna was, I don't think the gazelle necessarily gave itself to the lion. So now we're looking at, not just the gazelle and the lion together, we're having a view that the gazelle is not giving itself to the lion. Now we're back at this place of, I don't think this is giving and receiving here. I think this is a coercive power.

[43:23]

I think this is the lion being the king of the jungle, not the lion in intimate relationship with the gazelle. So we often see that, I think. We can all see coercive power, and there's plenty of that. Now we're trying to see just what cooperative power. We're trying to see how the gazelle and the lineman are actually cooperating. So before I get into benign indifference, I'm talking about an actual interest, a desire, that's in the universe. There's a desire in the universe. There is a desire in the universe, I feel, to help the lion and the gazelle understand cooperative power. I want them to understand that, because then they can enter the Buddha way. So that is in the universe.

[44:24]

Now, I just want to make that point. Now, is there some denying difference towards them, too? I think maybe the mountains are benignly indifferent to the unenlightened gazelle and lion, or to the unenlightened person watching. The mountains make it indifferent, but indifferent but not Not when they're actually this aligning of supporting the human who looks at the gazelles and the lion and doesn't see any cooperation, and the mountain is supportive of the gazelle and the lion, not understanding yet. And the mountains are in relationship. But in a sense, they're indifferent. But in another sense, they're supportive. So it's a supportive indifferent, I would say.

[45:25]

The universe is supporting. And you could say in a different way. But another way I would say it's not any different because it is definitely supportive. It's not non-supportive. It's on the support side. So I guess I don't see the universe as any different. I see the universe as supportive of beings who do not yet understand that they're supporting each other. So I see the universe as helping and nurturing ignorant people Ignored animals and plants and humans. I see that. So that's supportive, not indifferent. I just want to share also a related story that I heard. Werner Herzog, the filmmaker, he made a movie not too long ago called Grizzly Man. about this man who had a close relationship with Grizzlies, but didn't know how to set boundaries properly and was eaten by Grizzlies.

[46:28]

And Herzog said, and it was kind of a documentary, he said that he sees the universe and the world as chaos and violence. That's what he saw at that time. But then he made another movie recently called I think it's A State Gone, A Rescue Gone, called Rescue Gone. And in that movie, he didn't say it wasn't a documentary, but in that movie, in the kind of documentary of how he made the film, I think he came to see that the universe also has a desire to cooperate, that what he found with the people he was working with, The way he felt supported by them, the way C.D. was supporting them, the way he gave himself to the film project and to the people in his crew, I think he kind of woke up and saw, yes, there is chaos, there is disorder, and there is violence, but there is also cooperative power. And he seemed like... he had a great breakthrough and a great happiness to discover this cooperative power in his most recent Buddha effort.

[47:36]

So I wouldn't say the universe... I would say the universe is not indifferent. I would say that the universe is actively nurturing of you and me. Now, it's not doing so with any preference. because it supports us in our ignorance and it supports us in the evolution towards awakening. It's just as supportive of us to be ignorant as to be enlightened at the time that the human's in enlightenment. When we're ignorant, it completely supports our ignorance. When we're enlightened, it completely supports our enlightenment. But they will not be in the situation which is the desire for us to wake up. That's in the situation too. There may also be a desire for people to become deluded. I don't know if anybody really wants people to become less or more deluded. I don't know. Maybe somebody does. But what I'm emphasizing right there is a strong pull for us to understand this dharma.

[48:40]

And this dharma is reaching out to us, offering itself to us, through the way we're actually in relationship. The way we're actually in relationship is the Dharma being demonstrated to us. And it seems to be pressuring us to wake up to it because it doesn't let us happily not receive this. If we reject it, if we resist it, which it supports us to do, it gives us some pain. It makes us feel uncomfortable. It says, we support you, but, you know, we also want you to wake up and we're pressuring you to wake up as a gift. That's kind of how I feel about that. How about the, again, Those are almost two different things when you talk. I use two different examples. One, the comet hitting the earth and destroying species. And one where there's a direct interaction between sentient beings, you know, where there's the predator and the prey. So I'm kind of interested in how you would relate to the, again, the comet hitting the Earth and destroying species, including our own.

[49:50]

I guess I would go along with the story we read in Sutra. People see the world coming to an end. They see the world bursting into flames, and they think everything is destroyed and burned up. But my good land is safe and serene, safe and secure. So the way that the cat helmet and the earth collide and do their thing together is exactly the way life is created and the way life changes. It's the same process. It's the same Dharma. I have one final question. Before you give your final question, I want to say that if we realize this Dharma now, that realization will not be destroyed by us dying. That's a great comment and a final question. Everything that you say makes sense and is consistent, and everything you say are things that I fought to reconcile what I've experienced as this kind of conflict between these two versions of reality.

[51:02]

Something I'm not totally convinced of, and my question is, Are you really totally convinced when you're saying that yourself, or are you representing the Dharma in the most compelling way, personally? Do you experience doubts sometimes? I'm totally convinced when I say it. When you say it? I'm totally convinced. But my karma winds up with it. Okay. And maybe you don't want to share this, but it's not just when you say it, as a good Zen teacher. But in the dark hours in the morning, do you feel it then, too? Is that a fair question? I don't know. It's a fair question. In the dark hours in the morning, I will... It depends. If it's dark hours in the morning, and I'm in a zen door, I might be saying it. I do get up in the dark when people want to talk. If I was in the dark in the morning or the night... You're not being so naturalized watching.

[52:05]

I'm not being a Zen master? And nobody's watching, you know. Nobody's watching. Well, you know. What I'm getting at is that a lot of people are walking. You get the point. I did the point, but I'm also telling you. I understand. So in the dark of the night, when I think of what I just said, Because I think of what I said before I said it. When I think that, but don't say it, at the time I think it, I'm totally convinced, in the dark, that the Buddhas are with me. When I think that the Buddhas are with me, I'm totally convinced. But if I think something else, I'm not totally convinced, because my karma is not lined up with it. I'm not putting the teaching into action, and the fundamental action is what I think. So when my thinking is not that the Buddhas are with me and not that you're my close friend, then I'm not convinced at that moment.

[53:07]

But when I actually think that you're a close friend of mine, at that moment I am convinced. And when I think you're not a close friend of mine, at that moment I'm not convinced that you are a close friend of mine. Now, when I think you're not a close friend of mine, I go, oh, that's not good for you. When I think you're not a close friend of mine, I'm not convinced of that. But when I think you are closer than your mind, I am convinced, because I feel like I'm ready to die. My life is worth lives. I'm convinced, in other words, that that's the best way to think. To think in a way that lines up with the conjecture, I'm convinced is the best way to think. Now, when I don't think that way, you could say, well, actually, you weren't really convinced, because if you were really convinced, you wouldn't have thought, you wouldn't have changed. But I would say, well, at the moment I thought that I was convinced, but the power of my past karma knocked me off when I convinced my conviction into doubt, and then I wasn't really sure to go in with my close friend. But I didn't really believe that then. But I really do believe that you're my close friend when I think that.

[54:12]

And when I don't think that, then I'm not so convinced. Then I flip back, and then I'm convinced again. And when I say so. And one more thing I just wanted to say is that when I don't think so, then I sometimes get even more convinced. Because when I don't think so, then I notice other people think so. Like someone told me recently that sometimes at work he loses his temper. He works in a place where people know he's a Zen priest, a Zen nun. And if he's behaving himself, they act like naughty boys. They say how stupid it is to be kind and how stupid it is to speak gently and stuff like that, how stupid it is to try to be patient. So when he's patient and kind, they feed him and make fun of him.

[55:14]

But if he's impatient and unkind, they say, Zen monk, she didn't do that. Sometimes it helps to live. Because then it helps other people join. And then we realize, oh my God, even when I am slipping, everybody comes in and helps me. Stay on the path. Everybody really wants me to be on the path. That's what I think sometimes. And I think that I'm totally convinced. And when I don't think that, I'm not totally convinced. But then I usually go bad and then come back, you know, to total conviction. Does that make sense? It does. Thank you. And I believe you're a good friend. You're convinced right now? Yes. Just a little bit? If you need to. If you just want to take a point, it's phenomenal. Can I come up here? Couldn't it be any laziness in his not coming here?

[56:21]

I don't know. Well, I didn't feel like it was a new question, but... But you didn't want him to come up here? You didn't really want him to come up here? I wanted Glenn to stay there while you continued to answer his question. Can you get him to come back? I just wanted you to talk more about the desire, the... You were talking about the desire of the universe to... Well, you said two things. You said that the universe desires us to reach realization or to see the truth of the Dharma, but then it also fully supports us in our ignorance and fully supports us in our... when we're not, I guess, in our realization. So how is the desire, how is that to be understood? Is it simply the... It's the vow of the Buddha. That's the vow of the Buddha. There is in this world, this universe, a vow, a desire, and that is the vow of the Buddha that lives in this world.

[57:24]

Is it a vow of all... It's the vow of all Buddhas. And we, sentient beings, have some relationship with that because it's directed towards us. Sometimes when it's directed towards us and it's appeared to us, we're sometimes deeply, deeply moved by it and we kind of want to join it. Is the vow different from the actual truth itself? No. That is the truth in the form of a desire. I guess I'm having trouble, I feel like I'm anthropomorphizing this desire into some universe looking at me and wanting to I can see that the truth itself, in us living out in ignorance, like you were saying, it can cause pain. Continuing to live in delusion can continue to cause pain until you maybe start to see that it would, you know, the truth.

[58:31]

I mean, I can see that. Is that what you're referring? I mean, is that pushing us towards that, or is it something other? Well, the desire might be that. The vow might be what, kind of like, for example, the vow in this text is saying the vow to leave the Buddhist cannot appear before people who are not ready for it. And that not appearing helps them get ready for it. So the vow can have that effect. of withholding the warmth so that the person will sense their desire for that warmth. And then when they feel, I want it, then it comes. But then they're ready for it and they accept it and they say, thank you, I've been waiting for this.

[59:34]

But if you give it to them before they're opening to it, if they push it away, it's destructive. Is it arrogant and lax? Well, if they're arrogant and lax, and then not only are they arrogant and lax, but then they push away their best friend. This is really more than just arrogant and lax. It's very harmful. So if people are arrogant and lax, and arrogant and lax, and arrogant and lax, they start to feel miserable. Right. And they start to think, well, maybe I should open up to some other possibilities here. This rut I'm in is really bad. You start to open up, and then something comes to them. But when they're arrogant and lax and not noticing the consequences of this, they think, it's fine. Right.

[60:35]

Yeah. And they don't want to hear anything from any wise Buddhas. So the Buddha actually was right there with them, loves them totally, and is right there waiting for the right moment to show up. Doesn't show up. Waiting for them to turn around or turn upside down, and then they'll do it. So the desire's there, but seeing it's not yet time for this person. The state of evolution of the universe in the form of this person, they're not ready to receive the Dharma. So the Buddha actually, who's right there with them, does not show it. Does not show themselves, actually. And then when they show themselves, then they don't show the Dharma. They help the person see it themselves. What do they do to themselves? A Buddha shows himself so that you can see the Dhamma. The Buddha doesn't tell you where it is or what it is. This is there in that initiation you open to.

[61:38]

and the want, which you're now ready for. You open to the want and then you open to the diamond. The Buddha doesn't actually tell you. That's the thing about the verse is they don't tell you what it is. It just says, this is what they give. This is what we're really trying to give people. And we have other ways to meet them, to open them to it. But it sounds like that the desire of the whole universe you're relating to your desire. It's not the desire of the whole universe. It's the universe has this desire. A part of the universe that's desiring it is called Buddha's vow. This is the thing that makes Buddhists appear, this desire. And there is a desire like this, and it's what makes Buddhists appear to people. But there's other desires, too, in the universe besides that one. But not everything in the universe. If you desire something to do harm, The whole universe supports you to do that, but the desire to harm them is not the desire to benefit them. Right.

[62:42]

And you don't feel good when you have the desire to harm them. Okay. And Buddhas are not trying to get you to have that desire. They don't want you to have that desire. But when you have the desire to hurt people, they're totally supportive of you anyway. They're with you. supporting you, loving you when you want to hurt people. Right, but then you'll be in pain over time. And you'll be in pain. And that's what the Dharma is doing for you. It's just saying, you know, It doesn't work so well for you to ignore the truth and think this is not your good friend. This is not working for you. And you say, after a while, that's right, it's not. Well, I guess I'm trying to get a hold and a desire. I mean, I think of the word as to want something. Yeah, the Buddha wants you to enter the Buddha way. but would appreciate you the way you are now. And would fully support whatever you do. Exactly. And they are doing that. But they couldn't fully support it if they wanted you to do something else. They do that.

[63:46]

That's something the gospel gets used to. Oh. And learn how to do yourself. You want to fully support someone who is a way that you do a pain about. Right. They have to learn that, too. They have to teach you that. The Buddhas or the person that I'm supporting? The Buddhas teach the person you're supporting through you. They're teaching that. That you're sick, I want you to get well, and I totally support you in your present state. I adore you the way you are, and I want you to get well. And if I don't adore you the way you are, then when you be sick the next day, and the next day, I will forsake you. because they don't adore you. Of course, you'll learn a bad example, because you don't adore yourself in sickness either. You have to learn that. And being that way, you will evolve in exactly the way everybody wants you to evolve, or the way the Buddhas do anyway. So there is this desire, this wish, the wish-desire vow.

[64:51]

The Buddhas have this kind of desire. They don't desire to get something for themselves. they've got all they need, all they want is other beings to join them in a way, and they do want that, they do vow that, they desire that. And they support the being, and they see that beings are supported by, not just by them, but they see beings are supported by the whole universe that be at the present state of evolution. And if their state of evolution is a certain state, they won't show themselves. Right. And if their state is more advanced, they show themselves. And then when they show themselves, in that presence of that leading, that person receives the dharma. Is it that not showing themselves the same as... I mean, aren't they always showing themselves? Are they going to be the same as us not seeing it? They're not... Well, they're not showing themselves. Actually, this text says that they cause us not to see them. So then, they're not only not showing themselves, they're hiding themselves when they're right next to us, the systems.

[65:56]

But how can they hide? I mean, if they are... They're Buddhas. But they're everything. They have that ability, you know. For example, Shakyamuni Buddha, you know, because I'm getting a little attractive, but one of the wonderful stories about him is that he was, you know, in his meditation camp, and there was a guy... a noted spiritual teacher in another part of India. And that teacher, this is kind of a long story, excuse me. This guy was quite, he had a large assembly of students, quite large, apparently. And he was actually quite developed, and you can tell he was developed because he was developed enough to wonder if he actually understood what he was teaching. He actually had some And I'm not so sure I really understand the Wondersharma. So he is advanced enough to be teaching a large group of people and open to them. Maybe he had something more to learn.

[66:57]

And in his wondering, a being, a divine being, appeared to him. The divine being was a divine being who had previously been a disciple of Shakyamuni Buddha and died. And that being said to him, you don't yet understand. And if you do understand, there just happens to be a Buddha on this subcontinent, and he lives in Vajagriha. No, I think he lives in Varnasa. If you go to see him, he will be able to help you. He will open you to the correct understanding. So this guy starts walking. The Buddha over in Varanasi gets flipped off that he's coming. Because, you know, along with this love for all beings, you get certain kinds of other perks. Because he knows the guy's coming. So he tells his disciple, I'm taking a little walk.

[68:02]

Goes by himself, the great Buddha, by himself. He could have brought his whole entourage of whatever number of students. They would have been happy to go with him for the walk. But he went by himself. Can you imagine? This is the Buddha he's been teaching for a while. He takes a walk by himself. No bodyguards, no attendants, no jishas or anjas. Takes this walk. And the other guy's walking. He's walking, the Buddha's walking. And the Buddha can also tell that he's going to go through Raja Griha on his way to Varanasi. So the Buddha walks to Raja Griha and arrives there about a little bit after Pukasapu deaths. And while the Buddha's walking, the Buddha hides himself. So as he's walking along the road, people don't notice that it's the Buddha. He doesn't show them that the person who loves them more than any other being is walking by. He could show them, and people would take him out of their houses if they were ready.

[69:04]

But he doesn't show them because he doesn't want anybody that is not ready to see the Buddha. So he walks by in his non-glorified state. He takes off his gun. and walks. And people don't notice that it's Shakyamuni Buddha walking across the countryside. He arrives at the town. Phukasati gets there ahead of him, and Phukasati goes to a potter and says, can I stay in your potter's shed? And the guy said, yes. Buddha goes to the same potter's shed and asks the potter, can I stay at your potter's shed? and the man sees a wandering monk and he says, okay, but there's somebody who's already staying there. So you have to ask him if it's okay. He doesn't say, well, you have to see it's the Buddha, and of course, if you saw the Buddha, you have to ask the guy to move out. Don't pay the partnership, stay in my house, I'll move out. He doesn't think it's the Buddha, but he thinks it's somebody who he feels okay about housing. But he has to ask the other guy. If the other guy says no, no place for this guy to stay, the Buddha goes in and asks the other guy,

[70:10]

And I stay here, and the guy says, kind of, you know, in a friendly way, whatever, man. Yeah, you can stay here with me. So the Buddha's staying with me. And they're sitting together. This is a glass yogi here with the World Honored One. And they're sitting there, and they sit into the night. And the Buddha's watching this guy, and the Buddhist starts thinking, this guy's a pretty good monk, pretty good meditator. And the hours go by, and the Buddha thinks, maybe he's ready to even hear some teachings. But the Buddha's actually hiding himself in the sky. This guy, coming to see the Buddha, And he meets the Buddha, and the Buddha doesn't say, he came to meet me, here I am.

[71:17]

The Buddha's not sure he's ready, so the Buddha doesn't tell him. And the Buddha could easily just go, hmm. And the guy would go, oh. But the Buddha doesn't show that in this story. This is not a Mahayana story. This is a Theravada story. early scripture, called Phuksati. And so the Buddha watches him, and the Buddha thinks, well, maybe I could start testing whether he's ready to see the Buddha, me. So he says to the guy, under whom have you gone forth on the way? Who's your teacher, in other words? And the guy said, my teacher is Shakyamuni Buddha. a Gautama Buddha. And the Buddha says, Have you ever met him? The guy says, No.

[72:20]

Honest, right? But he doesn't know that he has met him. The Buddha is causing him not to see. It's opting for not showing him who he's talking to. And the guy turns out to be honest. And the guy turns out to be somebody who wants to study with him. Now, would you like some water, please? Would you stand to go? Sure. So the Buddha says, perhaps you'd like me to share some teachings with you. And this guy, the teacher, is not, like, so arrogant. I said, I'm the teacher here. What do you think you are teaching me? Because I know it's the Buddha. But somebody can offer him some teaching. He said, OK. Then the Buddha started teaching them.

[73:23]

And he gives them a nice teaching. Actually, I told you the wrong title. Thank you so much. I told you the wrong title of this scripture. This scripture is called the Discourse on Elements. Then Buddha gives him a Discourse on Elements. Very nice teaching. A Verbal Conceptual Presentation. A Verbal Conceptual Presentation of the Dharma. He gives this guy. Most of the way through the discourse, the guy suddenly realizes who's talking to him. This guy's talking to him. And suddenly he realizes, oh, it's the Buddha talking to me. The Buddha gradually sees outright, the guy stops, the guy gets ready.

[74:28]

So the Buddha sees he's ready, and the Buddha lets him see who it is. The guy sees that it's the Buddha. And when he sees he's got the Buddha, he starts to hear the Dharma. He pointed out he was hearing the Buddha talk and giving him the very nice teaching, but he wasn't hearing the Dharma yet, because he didn't see the Buddha. When he saw the Buddha, And then when the Buddha finished, he says, My teacher has come, and I'm so sorry I didn't see you, and I treated you kind of without proper respect. But you can see him going from, and suddenly he sees who he is. So did he see who it was, or did the Buddha reveal who he was? He saw who he was, but the Buddha also let him see, because he was ready.

[75:33]

And the Buddha doesn't let some people see until they're ready. Like somebody's, I don't know, somebody's trying to learn how to lower skate. And a roller skating teacher comes by and sees the person rolling over and stuff like that. And they watch them, but they don't tell them they're a roller skating teacher. They just watch them. And they keep falling over, and pretty soon they're doing a little better, you know, or maybe not getting better. Maybe they fall over even more. And finally, maybe one story is they're, like, totally, like, lying on the floor just crying, but somebody's teaching me how to roller skate. And the roller skating teacher then said, would you like to meet him? Yeah, please. OK, give me your hand. But if one person was first trying to do it, if the roller skating teacher came over, the person went, I don't know what. I punched the roller skating teacher. It didn't take long. Again, like my grandson, try various things.

[76:36]

Do you want me to help? No. I'll do it myself. Do you need help? No. And blop, blop, blop. Granddaddy, could you help me? So when I don't really show him the teacher, I just ask him if he wants the teacher. And he doesn't, and he doesn't, and he doesn't. So then I don't show him the teacher, because I'm not going to show him the teacher and have him reject the teacher. I'll just, you know, check in on him now and then. He's sort of a teacher, but he doesn't see it yet. If he sees the teacher and rejects it, that would be more harmful. It's harmful to reject the teacher if you have to see the teacher. It seems to do some spiritual, it's called a spiritual setback. But it's not a spiritual setback not to be ready. It's just where you're at. Right, okay. And so there's certain teachings which you don't give to people when they don't want them to get ready.

[77:37]

They're just not ready. Like you don't teach children about sex. at a certain age because they just get all weirded out and they just say, yuck, you know, and get scared and, you know, and, you know, they have to do all these years of psychotherapy and stuff. Somebody told them, brought sex upon them too early. But I mean, sometimes the universe does, I mean, because I guess you're talking about the Buddhas as making these conscious decisions to reveal or not to reveal, but it's always there, so... Well, it's there, and some people are really skillful at bringing it. Those are the Buddhas. They're really skillful at bringing it at the right time. Right. And they're busy people, you know. But still, they want to give their gifts And sometimes, like, you have to just to watch the guy. Like at the beginning of the story, he's just sitting there watching the guy meditate. That's what he felt was to be appropriate, and that seemed to work well with the guy. And then later he said, you know, like, you know, who'd you teach him? And we had this conversation, and we gave him a talk.

[78:40]

So he's giving gifts all the time, but sometimes the person doesn't know it's the Buddha giving them gifts. So there are many stories and many traditions about people coming and giving you gifts, and you receive the gifts, and then finally you find out who it is that's giving you the gift, and you go, you know, hallelujah. The universe of letting you have access to the divine reality that wants you to wake up. Divinity does not want us to be continue to be arrogant, imperious, cruel beings. That's not what the divine wants. But the divine loves us while we're being that way. And it supports us to get us ready to receive the teaching that will help us be cooperative and humble and loving and fearless and skillful and happy and happiness-spreading beings.

[79:42]

Thank you. You're welcome. That's a long question, Grant. And he wanted to outfit them over there. But he didn't get by with it, because he was ready. This morning you again mentioned twice imperious and being imperious. And the first night I mentioned that because of practice and sangha and especially the teachers, I'm learning to control a desire to outback what I... You're learning control? I'm learning to give love. I'm learning to give acceptance and love and And I'm finding that when I'm kind, I almost, when I remember to say, thank you, even if the person hasn't been able to help me, but, and they're getting, there's a turnaround.

[80:58]

They're surprised because they've been yelled at a lot in certain roles. And that's gratifying. That opens up that, yeah, this can work. So, as I said, as I go higher and higher in the hierarchy of this corporation, I'm able, even at the first, the person tells me on the top, I can't help you, to say, well, thank you for telling me that and for trying to help me. And even that person is nice. But then again, and I've been bothering each teacher here about what is justice. Because if By the time you get to the corporation level and you get the it, the imperiousness, a colonialist mentality, and it's not something. So all of these people I know want to be loved and want to be accepted. but they're dependent on this big it that won't personalize itself for you. That's their power, and that they won't personalize.

[82:00]

It's a big board of directors. It's not individuals. And these people, even if they want to leave it, are dependent on it to feed their children and their grandchildren. And so I keep coming back to how... I can identify with being the gazelle. I can identify being with the lion and see them as gifts to each other. But in taking vows, you're taking a vow to help. It's only to help an individual. How do you get by this big sense of... I mean, when I wrote to Cojean and And John, it was because Barbara wasn't here, and I'd already asked Barbara, and her answer helped. And I wrote to both of them and said, I'm not shopping for an answer, but I know you're going to be very different answers. And of course, they gave me totally different answers. But now I'm going to try to ask you, because it was the day they lasered those poor Katrina people who tried to go to City Hall and were not the gates to City Hall were locked.

[83:12]

And they were tasered because they wanted to say, don't build out our buildings. So they lost City Hall. And I cried all day, and I wrote to them and said, what is justice? And how can I find, in my practice, a way of... It's because it's not benign and different. Well, one answer, no, to give you a few, justice is appreciate. That's justice. So justice is not praising yourself at the expense of others, for example. So when you see people being cruel, justice is to not put yourself above them, to relate to them without putting yourself above them. When they're doing something you think is harmful. Justice is not to slander them when they're doing something you think is unkind. And again, I just want... But still, you have to say, express yourself and say, I think what's being done here is unkind, but to say that without any intention of putting yourself above... Above. I can get there.

[84:14]

But what happens when you don't get it? When you don't get it, you think you don't put yourself above the it. a terrible, cruel corporation, don't put yourself above it. And don't slander it. Speak of its faults without making people disrespect it, without wishing that people would disrespect it. Speak of its faults. Speak of its shortcomings. Speak of your problems with it as a way to make people be more concerned to help it become better. That's Joseph. I could give it away. I've been talking about the US government, not just individual people. I've been talking about the United States, what do you call it, a big element in the ethos of this country.

[85:20]

that there's an ethos among a lot of people that we should dominate. So it's not just one person. It's an ethos. So you have to relate to this ethos. You have to speak to this ethos. And you have to bring up another ethos and get in conversation with this ethos of imperialism. But in a just way, which is not to put our ethos above other ethos and not to be smirched or make people not respect this other ethos. And I'll just say one more thing. If we can do this, we can set up a conversation between beings and between ethos. If the other side, if the other ethos feels respected, And not demeaned. Criticized, but respected. If you really respect them and they feel it, they can take some criticism from you.

[86:26]

Because they think you're intelligent because you respect them. If you respect and love them, they might be willing to have a conversation. You need a conversation between the different views of what kind of country this should be. We're not going to have one deal. We can't possibly have a conversation and have peace. Yes. I have a very easy gift for you. Easy gift? Well, we'll see. So for six years I've been deciding a heart surgery in the morning. And I was thinking and I was going into this with no expectations. You're going into the recitation? Yes, thinking back. I'm not trying to get something. But I find myself somewhat disappointed that after six years, it's still an incredible mystery. And so when I was coming here, I was thinking, oh good, I can ask a question.

[87:27]

And then I also, a couple of weeks ago, I ordered a book from Amazon. about the Heart Sutra by Red Pine. I started reading it. But after listening to your talk, it seems that I want an answer when I ask a question, even if I can get to the part of wanting to save sentient beings with the answer to the question, but I'm still really wanting that answer. And I'm reading the book because I want more information. I'm wanting it so that I can get it. So would you suggest that I just close the book and not ask the question unless I can get to that place and just keep on reciting it? That's my question. Thank you. Well, I think what you said is perhaps the best way to go is to keep reciting and try to be open to perhaps you're expecting to get something from the education.

[88:43]

It's kind of hard to know sometimes whether you may be with an expectation you get something you don't notice for a long time, until suddenly you think, oh, six years and I didn't get anything. Maybe I was actually expecting something the whole time. So it might help you actually to read some commentaries on it, because as you read the commentaries, you might get more in touch with the fact that you're trying to get something. But you don't have to read the commentaries if you know you're trying to get something. So to want to get an answer is not the same as trying to get the answer. It's not exactly the same. But I would suggest that you read the Heart Sutra not to try to get the answer, but as a gift. Chan it as a gift to the Buddhas. Chan it as a gift to the Heart Sutra. Do it as homage and praise of Buddhas rather than you getting something.

[89:48]

Try to do it that way. I think that would be a good way to do it. Now, if you have questions about the heart, and you're reading it, and you go, well, I have a question. I've said before, having questions is the seeds of wisdom. But having answers leads to illusions. Yeah, I wish I could write that down. Tomorrow. I don't really remember. I hope someone could just write that down. Wisdom. Seeds of wisdom. Questioning is the seed of wisdom. Having questions about faith and asking them to find you. You can ask the believer, you can ask other people who are studying about it. Ask the question, but ask the question as a wisdom activity rather than just an answer. Which is delusion. To think Well, it's kind of deluded to try to get it, but when you have it, it's really deluded. I'm really all chat.

[90:51]

It's a dead end. Wisdom doesn't stop. Wisdom keeps working with what's happening and being with the ongoing process of evolution. So asking questions is good. and also ask questions as a gift. Like I was saying, bodhisattvas ask questions as a gift. They say to the Buddha or they say to the teacher, what does it mean when the heart-seeker says blah, blah? They do that as a gift to the person they're talking to and to the sangha who hears the question. That's what they're doing it for. They're not trying to get an answer for themselves. They would like to get the Buddha's response for the other people here. Let's see what the Buddha says there. I want to give them my question and give them the Buddha's response. I'm not going to get an answer. Because as soon as he responds, I'm going to ask another question if I can, rather than get the answer. I'm going to keep doing this for the Buddhas, keep exercising the Buddha, and to keep getting people the Buddha's exercise.

[91:53]

But it's also okay not to have a question. It's just a question. I think when we read the Heart Sutra and the question starts arising, then there's a wisdom response to the sutra. You're reading it. This is giving. You're reading, giving. Giving is reading. Reading is giving. Giving chanting, giving chanting, giving chanting to the Buddhas. Okay? And then suddenly a question comes. Oh, wisdom's coming along. What is this about? What is she reading there? Now the wisdom's starting to come out. out of his giving practice. The giving's coming up, the listening's coming up. And he's just working practice and not trying to get something. It's a gift, of course. It's OK to read the scriptures if you can read the scriptures and get. Read the commentaries and get, rather than read the commentaries to get. So when you read the commentary, there's a kick. I give my reading, I give my study time to the scriptures and to the commentaries.

[92:56]

And as you do that giving without trying to get anything, questions start coming in. Oh, there's something alive in me while I'm reading this. And you turn the page and there's the answer. But you weren't trying to get it. It comes. But you don't stop there. You keep reading and asking the question. Or that the question is giving to you. You're welcome. I have a question about something that you said in answering, or when you were done speaking in Dokusan. And I heard you say it out here, I believe, too. You said, are you complete?

[93:57]

And I wanted to know what you meant by that. I meant you feel that the conversation is complete. OK. You know, that we've talked long enough. You feel good about saying goodbye for now. That's what I meant. I was wondering if you meant, did I understand everything? No, I didn't mean, yeah, I didn't mean to understand anything. But by the way, Dave? If I say yes, I'll be in trouble. No, if you said yes, I think that would be very entertaining. Well, it's getting close to lunchtime again. so we could move on to other activities like service and lunch.

[95:14]

And I just want to say again that you have been wonderfully generous during these few days together. I feel very inspired by your by your graciousness with each other, with teaching, and with yourself. And I pray that you continue your practice of giving and your practice of vowing to save all beings. And if you don't, I pray that you and I will be gracious with you. Ya Adil al-Nahr, Salman al-Khawaj, Al-Nahr.

[96:06]

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