This morning I begin, as I often do, by asking you if it's okay if I talk to you about something I've talked to you about before, something you have heard about before. Is that all right if I do? It's about, first of all, the basic in one sense it's basic, and in another sense it's ultimate. The basic and ultimate motive in Zen practice is the liberation of all living beings. Sometimes we might say the basic motive or the ultimate motive is to liberate all beings, but it's another way to say it is the liberation of all beings.

[01:18]

If we say liberate, it sounds like you're going to liberate them, which is part of it, but also they liberate you, which is part of it. So it's kind of the liberation of all beings together. Liberation from bondage, liberation from suffering. And then there's a basic Zen practice or basic Zen method or basic Zen training And there's different words we can use to try to point at the basic training in Zen.

[02:22]

One of the words that we can use is intimacy. Zen training is basically training in intimacy. Another way to talk about it is basic Zen training is in no grasping or seeking. And another way to say it is Zen training is to learn a way where there's no, what we call, outflows. No outflows.

[03:26]

So, using those kind of three different ways of talking about what Zen training is, you can also perhaps say, or I could say for you, that intimacy is no grasping and seeking. When there's no grasping and seeking, there's intimacy. And no outflows means intimacy, and no outflows means no grasping or seeking. Outflows actually is one translation of a word, a Sanskrit word, asrava, or a Pali word, asava. The etymological meaning of it is to flow or flood.

[04:38]

And some people interpret that it's a-sa-la. So the a before the sa could mean in or it could be out. So there could be an inflow or an outflow. And some other people don't translate the word etymologically as inflow or outflow, or sometimes floods. They translate it as cankers, or taints, or afflictions, or defilements, or impurities. I kind of like the etymological meaning because it, well,

[05:41]

Actually, it doesn't so directly point out to us that this flooding in and out is painful and disturbing. When we're intimate, there's no floods. There's no flooding out or flooding in. And no grasping and seeking, in intimacy there's no grasping or seeking. And that can be on the level of not trying to grasp something in yourself, or seek something in yourself, seek becoming a certain way, or grasping yourself being a certain way, but also not seeking

[06:58]

something in others or grasping something in others. But at a basic level it means not grasping the conceiving of yourself or the conceiving of others. So when we are aware of something about ourself or when we're aware of another person we usually conceive of ourself and conceive of the other. We also conceive of the category of self and a category of other. So ending outflows means ending or giving up the points where the outflows occur. and the points where outflow occurs are points of gain and loss.

[08:04]

When you see a gain or see a loss, to let go of that gain or let go of that loss is training in letting, in ending the outflow that occurs in us when there's a gain and we grasp it, or when there's a loss and we grasp it. In Thai, I think, in Thai Buddhism, they sometimes translate this term, not as much translate it, but I guess render it or gloss it as, how is it? outgoing exuberance, which doesn't sound that bad. The director of the Federal Reserve System spoke about, was it three or four years ago, about the irrational exuberance

[09:25]

of the stock market. There was a kind of exuberance in the U.S., in the community of investors in the United States. There was an outflowing exuberance. They were into gain. They got excited about gain. they were kind of like, yes! Gain! No end to it! Everything you've got, dump it in there and it'll grow! And then, you know, various things happened and then the people also, some of the people who worked for some of those companies that the people were investing in, they thought, well, since everybody's so excited, let's just like give them something to be excited about.

[10:30]

Let's create a picture that they'll really like dump a lot of money into our company. Let's create an image that they can really, a concept that they can really grasp. And then they also got into grasping something and then we have kind of unfortunate feelings in our country about this exuberance. As a sometimes as a warm-up, as a warm-up to the radical practice of no grasping and no seeking, as a warm-up to the practice of intimacy with yourself and with your environment.

[11:41]

Sometimes the Buddha says, there are five things that would be good to contemplate, or five contemplations that I recommend and I would comment. He didn't say it this way, but he said five things that are really good for a meditator to contemplate, and I would say in order to sober up, in order to end this exuberance, this exuberance which takes us away from intimacy, excessive excitement which takes us away from being present, This is a kind of warm-up form.

[12:47]

He said, one contemplation is the contemplation of quotes, I am subject to aging. The second one is, I am subject to illness. I, this person here, is subject to death. This person, me, will grow different from and separate from everything dear to me, and everything attractive or adorable.

[13:49]

And also, everything I do, everything this person does, everything this person is, all actions that this person is the author of, will have consequence, and all those consequences will come back to the author. These five contemplations are recommended by the Buddha. Now, what's the reason why he recommends these? Then he says, well, if you're young, and some of you don't have that problem anymore, but some of you, like, see, some of you are young, relatively young, like that guy. There are some young people here. from my point of view. If a youth does not do this contemplation, if a youth does not remember, if a youth is not mindful, I am subject to aging, then the youth will become intoxicated by youth, by his youth or her youth,

[15:11]

This of course, a little nuance on this meditation which he didn't mention in this particular case, which would make it 10 contemplations, or 15, would be, he, that young one over there, is also subject to aging. She is subject to aging. So you can apply this first to yourself, because you can also get intoxicated about other youths. So even though you may not have youth, you may have some young people around you to get intoxicated about. So either way, but particularly for young people, this is a good one, which will protect from intoxication. Number two, of course, if you're healthy, which, hey, Buddha's totally on what he called your side and would be happy for you to be healthy, but anyway, he's also concerned that if you ever happen to be healthy, that if you don't do this meditation you will become intoxicated by your health.

[16:25]

Oh, I forgot to mention something. Go back to the youth. If a youth does not do this contemplation, the youth becomes intoxicated by the if you excuse the expression, bad things. When youths are intoxicated by their youth, they often do bad things, like drive cars really fast, jump off tall buildings, swim across lakes right after lunch, big lakes, because I'm a good swimmer, right? Yes, you're a good swimmer, but your good swimming is subject to aging, rapid aging sometimes, in the form of cramps.

[17:31]

Your good swimming, in other words, can disappear like that. And then again, if you're healthy, and you don't do this contemplation and become intoxicated by this attitude towards your health, then you do bad things, like whatever, eat poison, you don't get exercise, or etc. Then again, the final one, which applies to all of us here in the room, as far as I can tell, When the living don't do the meditation that they're subject to death, they become intoxicated by life. So just being alive, you can be intoxicated just by being alive. And then if you're intoxicated, you do bad things, not because you're alive, but because you're intoxicated, because we don't remember that we're subject to death.

[18:38]

And then the next one, if we don't remember that we will be separated from what is dear to us, we will grow different from what we find appealing. If you have anything appealing about yourself, you're going to grow different from that. Whatever it is, anything appealing about you, you're going to grow different from. And all the things that you know that are dear to you, you're going to become separated from them. If you remember that, you won't become intoxicated. If you don't, you will be inclined towards intoxication about these adorable, dear things, and then you will do inappropriate, unhelpful activities. And the big one, finally, if you don't remember, if you're not mindful of the consequences of all action,

[19:42]

Again, we do harmful things, unskillful things. This is a kind of warm-up to the basic practice, which takes care of these also, of intimacy, of no grasping or seeking. we sort of have to get sober, and then when we're sober, or fairly sober, then we can work on the radical training, which again the Buddha gave as, train yourself like this. In the scene, there will be just the scene, and that scene could be, you know, everything you see. your face in the mirror, your hands, your foot, your arm, your skin, somebody else's face, the leaves on trees, the hillsides, the mountains, everything you see, in the scene there will be just the scene.

[21:03]

Train yourself like that. trying to see if when you see something, if they're going to be just what you see, period. You may notice right away that that doesn't happen, that you look at something, and you look at someone's face, or you look at your own face, and you don't just see the face, you immediately get into some comments on the face, and some feelings, and then some actions based on those feelings and comments, and you spend very little time with the radical experience of what you see. You look at the leaves on the trees, and you immediately think something about it. How lovely, I wish it was greener, or like on days like this, the hills look good, but if the sun was out, they'd look better.

[22:06]

wishing for a little bit more color in the hillside, or a little bit less salt on the rice, or a few more wrinkles, or less wrinkles on the face, more wrinkles on your competitors, less wrinkles on yours, that kind of stuff, that's like normal, habitual cleaning. around an image, some visual image. So train yourself so that it will be like in the scene there will be just the scene, and then in the heard there will be just the heard. As radical as you can be when you hear a sound, just hear the sound. And in the smelled, just the smelled. And in the tasted, just the tasted. And in the touched, just the touched.

[23:13]

And in the imagined, just the imagined. And actually, the first five categories are also imagined, but the last one means things that are imagined that aren't sensory things. So these sensory categories, like colors of the trees, those are also actually conceptual for most of our life. At the level of grasping, mostly it's conceptual. So all these different kinds of concepts, the thing is to learn to just let them be as radically the way they appear to you as you can possibly reach or be. And then, you see, you're starting to learn what it's like to not have any grasping or seeking around what you hear and what you taste. Of course, this naturally involves noticing that when you taste something, you do elaborate on it.

[24:23]

So you notice, oh, there is an outflow. So you see something, and then suddenly there's an outflow, because at that point of what you see or what you hear or what you think, there is some gain or loss. Oh, it's a little bit brighter now, and you kind of grasp it, or it's a little bit duller now, and you grasp it. Just start by letting it be the color it is, Now if it does become brighter, or it does become duller, rather than you wish it was different than what it is, then there too in that gain or loss around this color or this thought, no grasping. Just let that. So you see a color, and then you see a gain in the color,

[25:27]

then in that gain, don't grasp that gain, just let that gain be a gain, in this imagination of we just gained some color or we just lost some color or we gained some saltiness or lost some saltiness. At that point, right there, train yourself to just let that gain be a gain. Let that imagined gain be a gain. what is a gain to you is not actually a gain to everybody. Like watching a sports event, when one team goes ahead, gains on another team, some of the people think that's a loss, and the other people think it's a gain. When your home team wins a game, you think it's a gain.

[26:30]

visiting team think it's a loss. So the different people have different concepts of gain and loss, which arises because of various conditions, what town you live in and so on, your gender, your age, your meditative background, all these things come into play, but even if the thought, the imagination of, this is a gain, arises, the Buddha is saying, just let that gain be a gain. That's not a gain. That's letting the gain be a gain. That's not getting involved in grasping the gain or grasping the loss. Such a training is pretty difficult to do if you're intoxicated. If you sober up by doing those previous meditations, you might be able to devote yourself to this radical phenomenological approach.

[27:33]

And again, I suggest that to look at somebody, or look at something, to look at some action, of your own or someone else's, in letting that action, which again is probably a category of somewhat you're seeing it or hearing it, but also you're conceiving this action, you're conceiving this person as being this way. and in that, just letting that be what it is, is also ending outflows and being intimate. It's training in intimacy. The Buddha, after giving this basic instruction, the Buddha says, when, for you, When for you it's like this, in the herd there's just a herd.

[28:52]

In other words, after training yourself for some time, which might be a long time, but when you become so that when you see things, you've trained yourself to a point where when you see things, in what you see there's just a scene, and in what you hear there's just a herd, and so on. When you get to that point after quite a bit of training, then these points of leakage, these points of defilement, these points of outflow and inflow end, when you're that way with things. Then you're intimate with things. You're intimate with yourself, first of all, intimate with your own experiences, and then based on that you can be intimate with others. When that's how it is for you, when for you, in the seen there's just the seen, and in the heard there's just the heard, and in the tasted there's just the tasted, and in the touched there's just the touched.

[30:09]

And then the smelled is just the smelled, and then the imagined, just the imagined. Then you will not identify with it. You will not identify with the color, with the sound, with the idea. You will not locate yourself in it, or outside of it. And then there will be no here, or there, or in between. And this will be the end of suffering. And it can be understood that this will be the end of suffering for you, the meditator, because you're talking about when things are that way for you. When things are that way for you, the outflows have ended for you. you have realized intimacy.

[31:16]

But that's not the whole story. The next thing that's possible is that you can let go of this attainment. By this practice, we would also be able to let go of the attainment that this practice leads to, let go of the intimacy, let go of the non-grasping and non-seeking, not cling to those either, and join hands with all beings, enter the mud and water with all beings, and walk through birth and death with them. And in Zen text, when it talks about this letting go of the ultimate, which we just talked about, this letting go of this ultimate freedom and peace, which is realized in intimacy, and joining hands with all beings who have not yet realized this, and walking with them through birth and death until the world realizes this freedom,

[32:36]

And they say, how can they do that? Well, they can do it because they've ended these outflows. They can stand to let go of intimacy because of intimacy. So it's the training in intimacy which potentially someday would lead to the realization of intimacy. And then in the realization of intimacy, to let go of intimacy, and share the intimacy which you let go of with all beings. In order to facilitate this basic training, in the Zen tradition, we use forms.

[33:40]

Another way to put this is that Suzuki Roshi said one time, surprised me by saying, for your acquaintances, you can be informal, but for those who you wish to be intimate with, you need formality. On Sunday, when we have a lot of people in a meditation hall like this, you may or may not get this sense, but during regular periods of meditation when everybody's sitting in their seats, sitting upright posture and so on quietly, if you come in the room you may be impressed by the presence of the room or the presence in the room of all these people sitting still.

[34:57]

Like right now, everybody's sitting pretty still right now. If someone just peeped in here, they might say, wow, that's a lot of people, and they're sitting still. It's kind of impressive. But during meditation, I think you might find people are sitting even more still than they do during these talks. Like, for example, I'm moving my arms right now, and my lips and I don't move my lips during regular meditation. So you can imagine what that would be like. So it's kind of like some people really like that feeling of, wow, there's a lot of presence in this room, but then at the same time, people might feel like, oops. They suddenly feel like there's probably a right or a wrong way to come into that room. all those people are sitting in a certain way, there's probably a right or a wrong way to sit.

[36:07]

And actually someone may come up to you and say, let me show you the way to enter the room. You enter on this side of the door, please. They might even say, perhaps, this is the right way to enter the room, and every other way is wrong. They might say that just for fun. So these two people here These two priests here are sort of like in charge of the formalities of the meditation hall, and they instruct people how to come into the room and how to go out of the room, how to take their seats, which seat to sit in, and they also organize instruction about how to sit once you get to your place, and how to walk, and how to bow, and how not to talk, and how to think. And then I, today, have told you more about how to think. I've given you more instruction about how to think. Namely, in the scene, there will be just the scene.

[37:14]

That's the way to think. In the herd, there'll be just the herd. That's the way to think. There's other ways to think, which you know about, which you learned before you came to Zen. But in Zen Buddhism you learned this new way of thinking called, in what you think there will be just what you think, period. And this is a training. So anyway, when there's forms, people can, that can give rise to, on the positive side, put it positively, it can give rise to an awareness of our inclination towards, or our attachment to, or our concern about, or our worry about, or our terror of, right and wrong. So coming into a place where there's forms and where they're quite clear and where there's a devotion to them, those forms could be a way for you to become aware of

[38:24]

the variety of outflows you have around right and wrong, around gain and loss, around it is and it isn't, around I am and I'm not. I'm in accord with these principles, these forms, or I'm not. This kind of thing is going on in us all the time, but we may not notice it, and when we don't notice it, to some extent we're more comfortable. When we don't notice our worry, in some sense, we feel less worried. And then we go into a room where forms are kind of like offered to us, and suddenly we become aware, I think, of our basic anxiety, which comes from our basic attachment to gain and loss and so on. So actually someone said after the last talk I gave here, she said, this is the first time I've come to Green Gulch for a long time.

[39:26]

I stopped coming because I felt like, I think she said something like, I felt like if I made a mistake I'd get kicked out, or if I made a mistake I'd be punished, or it wasn't okay for me to make a mistake. Like if I walked not in the traditional Zen way, I would be ostracized. She said, �Can I come here and not worry about that anymore?� And I said, �Mm-hmm, sure. I'll hold your hand and walk through birth and death with you while people are telling you, �That's wrong! You're not doing it right! I'll hold your hand while they're saying, Oh, you're doing it right, you're doing it right, you're right, you're good, you're an excellent Zen student, you're a lousy Zen student, you're an excellent Zen student. Or while you're thinking that, I'll hold your hand while you're thinking that. I'm a great Zen student, I'm doing all the forms right.

[40:27]

I'm not doing them right. I don't know if I'm doing them right or wrong. And a lot of people have told me they'd rather know that they're wrong than not even be in the realm of right and wrong. to like come in here and like really let go of your basic sense of whether you're right or wrong or whether you're gaining or losing, that's scarier than, okay, I'm wrong and I'm losing, okay, at least I've got that. But that's what the intimacy is about, is when you actually enter the realm that's free of gain and loss, right and wrong, I am and I'm not. but it takes quite a bit of training to be able to stand the realm beyond grasping these categories. And these forms actually flush out these concerns, so we can see, I'm actually concerned with how I look as I'm walking to my meditation seat.

[41:35]

I'm actually concerned with what people think of my posture. whether I'm good or bad. And I'm also concerned what I think of my posture, whether it's good or bad. I'm like hung up on this stuff. And I think I'll go to another place to practice where I don't have to think about this. Well, there are other places to practice where you don't have to think about this. But are you really not thinking about it, or are you just unaware that you're thinking about it? Most people are thinking about it, but unaware. and becoming aware of it is an adjustment problem. We may love many people, many beings, and it isn't necessary that we be formal with all these beings. We can love people without being formal with them.

[42:38]

But in order to achieve intimacy with them, you may need formality. If you're already enlightened, then you're intimate with beings whether you like them or not. But prior to enlightenment, you like some people or love some people deeply, passionately, you think their life is, like, worth giving yours for, you really love them, you really think they're great, you really think they're adorable, they're really dear, and you feel very generous towards them. You could even be intoxicated about them. But to be intimate with them requires formality, unless you're already enlightened, but if you got enlightened, and you realize intimacy, I say you used forms to get there.

[43:43]

And again, the road to being intimate with people and using forms to get there means the road of becoming aware of right and wrong in the relationship. You can look at somebody and just love them. That feels great. But to move from that feeling of love to intimacy with that person means walking through the fires of right and wrong, correct and incorrect, good and bad, I am and I'm not. It means walking through that field and learning how to not grasp that stuff. Then realizing intimacy. with this person who you may still love, but some people who you don't like or who you naturally find repulsive or who you actually have a genetic allergy to, some people you're just allergic to. You can't actually be physically near them because you get hives or something, but you can be intimate with such a person by using forms and this basic meditation.

[45:00]

You can be enlightened with people that you're repulsed by, and you can be enlightened with people you adore. In both cases you need forms. And the forms will make the relationship difficult. And you will notice, and I will notice, we will notice. I don't know if I'm doing the right thing with this person. I think maybe I'm doing the wrong thing. No, I think I'm doing the right thing, and I'm kind of hung up on that and now I'm getting upset. I'm becoming intoxicated by that. And now I don't even know I actually have let go of right and wrong, and that's really difficult too. So this is hard. Intimacy is hard. Giving up grasping and seeking is difficult. letting go, ending outflows is difficult, but it is the basic training and the basic attainment of the Buddha way, strongly emphasized in the early teachings of the Buddha, strongly emphasized in Zen.

[46:20]

I have a A couple of grandsons, one of them lives in the Bay Area, so I get to see him quite often, and I find him, generally speaking, very dear. Astoundingly dear. And I can just love him, you know? Easy. But being intimate with him is not easy. And I watch him and his mother, and I notice that his mother has lots of forms with him. They have lots of forms, and those are difficult for him and her. But because of those forms, there's more intimacy between them than between me and him, because I don't use the forms as much as she does.

[47:29]

He does not have, and I do not have, as difficult a relationship with him as he does with his mother. But I really feel encouraged by this talk this morning to stand up to him and not be just a total slave. Because being a slave is fun for him, it's fun for me, it's fine, it's great, it's lovely. It really is. But we're kind of acquaintances on that level. Adoring, at least one direction, adoring acquaintance, but not intimate. I just do the easy part. I just love this adorable thing. It's the easy part, and grandparents sometimes loaf like that.

[48:33]

Shame on you! Shame on me! Anyway, it's understandable. It's so nice, but it's not intimacy. It's a kind of indulgence in the intoxication of this youth, of this dearness, first of all it's not remembering this, I will be separated from this, this youth is subject to aging, this health is subject to illness, this life is subject to death, it's intoxication about not doing that meditation and then one step further after you get sober it's not using forms. So when grandparents start using with their grandchildren, standing up to them and saying, I want to set up a forum with you. What's a forum?

[49:37]

The forum is, I want you to listen to me when I talk, and I will listen to you when you talk. I will listen to you, and I want you to listen to me. Will you listen to me? And you work on that until there is a commitment to a forum between you and this dear person, and then there's a form and then there's difficulty. And there are other forms, but with these forms we can become intimate. There's also the forms of what's appropriate to a four-year-old and what's appropriate to a 6-year-old and what's appropriate to an 11-year-old and what's appropriate to a 60-year-old. There's these forms. They're there, available to be used for what? Not to control little kids and control grandparents, not for that purpose, not in the Buddha way.

[50:45]

They are there for us to become aware of any clinging in the relationship, any clinging to good and bad, any clinging to gain and loss, any clinging to I am and I'm not, which is there, unconscious, for unenlightened people. Excuse me, it's there, unconscious, for some unenlightened people and some other unenlightened people, it's there and they're conscious of it. Enlightened people, it's there and they're not attached to it. There still is gain and loss, but there's no attachment. And one level of ignorance is you have these points of attachment and you don't even know it. Another level of growing awakening is you start to become aware of these points of attachment around gain and loss. And you train yourself to become aware of them and to like be with what's happening so radically that you start to let go, at least for the moment.

[51:54]

you let go of attaching to gain. You see the gain and you go, loosen, let the gain, let it drop, I mean let it be, let it change, let it relax with it. Learn how that can happen, because I can't even make it happen and that's part of the training is to learn that you don't even make the training succeed. And yet, you hear about it, and your attention goes towards it, and if your attention goes towards it, you will notice, there's a point of attachment, there's the thing I see, I'm not just letting it be, and you see how that goes. And it's not easy to set up forms with a four-year-old, with a one-year-old, even younger mothers.

[53:06]

When the baby's in the mother's womb, when the baby's in the womb, there's a formal relationship between the mother and the child. It's a formal relationship. Things go according to forms. The blood circulates according to a formal principle. The nutrition goes in and goes out. The oxygen goes in and goes out. It's a very formal relationship. It's very intimate. When the baby becomes outside the mother, then they set up new forms, new forms of intimacy, nursing, biting nipples. telling them that you don't like the biting the nipples, training them to not do that. So the formality is always available, sometimes it's fully functioning, and then there's freedom, and sometimes it's not, and then there's an opportunity to work with it.

[54:12]

Setting up these forms as a person's growing is a real job, When they're full-grown in an adult, between two adults who want to become intimate, now it's another big job. How do two adults become intimate? Whether they like each other or not, with forms they can become intimate. Whether they're comfortable with each other or uncomfortable with each other, whether they find each other dear or not. they can become intimate and liberated together with the aid of the forms, which will show them the points of grasping. If people can be together and be aware of their grasping and wish to find the way where the grasping drops, it's possible. So I do intend to start working on that with my grandson, a person who I can have a very nice acquaintanceship with, but there's also the possibility of me someday becoming intimate with him if I keep living longer.

[55:36]

I'll have more chances to try to set up forms so that I can see my points of grasping, my points of gain and loss with him. You know, like, when it's time for a bath, we sometimes say to him, who do you want to take a bath with? And then whoever he chooses, that person kind of goes, whoa! Who do you want to take a bath with? Granddaddy? Okay. Now that can look like a gain to certain people. to some other people, it might look like a loss. Oh, he didn't choose me. Anyway, and then we get in the bathtub and there's possibility for forms there too. Like, you know, what can he do with soap? And what can he do with big wooden

[56:43]

scrub brushes. What can he do with the hot and cold water? He has various things he wishes to do. How much ... with the forms, and the forms then help me see if I have any points of clinging around him, around gain and loss. As you probably know, sometimes mothers and fathers tell their children to tell their grandparents that they love them. They say, tell granddaddy that you love him. I love you, granddaddy. Sometimes they won't do it though. I'm not going to say that. You can't make me. Or I already told him before. Give granddaddy a hug. I don't want to. Sometimes if parents do that, for whatever reason, they sometimes tell their kids to be nice to their grandparents.

[57:53]

And you know, it's not that bad if somebody tells this little dear person to give you a hug and then they come over and give you a hug, it's not that bad, right? Sometimes they do it kind of enthusiastically, it's not that bad. But it is kind of unprompted, you know, it's like they're instructed to do so, and who knows what rewards they get later from the person that they have a formal intimate relationship with, or who they have a formal relationship with, for whom intimacy is being worked on, day after day. And again, as you know, you might be successful and be intimate with your kid when they're four, when they're five, and then they're teenagers, and then sometimes some parents feel like they just can't see any intimacy, but that might be the most intimate time of all. In a way, it's so difficult, and forms are such a big issue.

[59:05]

Anyway, sometimes in the bath, when nobody around but him and me, nobody telling him what to say, sometimes he just looks at me and he says, I love you, granddaddy. Just says it, just like nobody told him to say it. It just comes out of his mouth. And he's not saying it to have a big effect on me. It's kind of like he's just real relaxed and it just comes out of his mouth. And it really seems like that's what he has to say. So you can see why somebody might want to be chosen to give him a bath, for this pure, non-manipulative ... you know, it's not just the words either, it's a feeling there, this word just sort of oozes out of that feeling of being together like that. I've been going on for a long time, but I want to tell you a story about the Buddha.

[60:21]

And one time, I heard this, okay? One time, the Blessed One was wandering in the country, in the Magadhan, in the country of Magadha, and eventually He arrived at Rajagraha. And there he went to a potter named Bhagara and said to him, this is the Buddha walking around by himself, wandering around. Can you imagine? The Buddha, Shakyamuni Buddha, just wandering around the countryside. No attendant, no entourage of thousands of monks, just the Buddha. on a walk, a fairly long walk apparently, because he came to this place and he went to this potter's house, who he did not know, and he says to this potter, he says, if it's not inconvenient for you, Bhagana, I will stay one night in your workshop.

[61:43]

The potter can see that this is a monk, that this is a yogi, because of his simple outfit and his demeanor. So, as far as he's concerned, this monk's walking up and saying, if it's not inconvenient for you, I will stay in your workshop. There is a formality there. by which he can achieve some, initiate a relationship with this potter. The Buddha is coming to meet the potter and stay in the potter's house because the Buddha wants to stay indoors that night. And the potter says to the Buddha, it is not inconvenient for me, venerable sir, I emphasize, venerable sir.

[62:52]

But there is a homeless one, another monk, already staying there in the workshop. If he agrees, then stay as long as you like, venerable sir. So I just wanted to emphasize that the potter says to the Buddha, venerable sir, out of respect for his practice which he can see. Oh, however, he does not know that this is the Blessed One, venerable sir. Now, there was a clansman named Pukasati who had gone forth from the home life into the way of the monk out of faith in the Blessed One. and was, on that occasion, staying in the potter's workshop.

[63:56]

So this monk who's staying in the workshop is someone who left his home to go and practice meditation under the tradition of Shakyamuni Buddha. But he had never met Shakyamuni Buddha. Just like some people now, you know, go forth and study under the way of Shakyamuni Buddha, who have never met him because he died a long time ago, you never met him, but yet some of you are actually going forth to devote your life to practicing his way as best you can. This time, however, the monk had gone forth, the person had gone forth to become a monk, and the Buddha was living in the same country as him, but he hadn't yet met him. So then the blessed one went to the venerable Pukasati. He's a venerable one because he's devoting his life to meditation. People appreciate this.

[65:01]

So he goes to the guy and he says to him, if it's not inconvenient for you, monk, I will stay one night in the workshop. The Buddha is using a form. to be intimate with this monk. The monk says, it is not inconvenient for me. No, excuse me. And then the monk says, the potter's workshop is large enough, friend, doesn't say venerable sir, says friend, kind of like, You know, it's kind of like, Potter's workshop is large enough, man. It's friendly, you know, but it's kind of like, yeah, whatever, man, you're welcome.

[66:07]

I've got plenty of room here. Kind of like that. He's not as respectful to him as the Potter was. not unfriendly, but just treating him as not really with utmost respect. The potter's workshop is large enough friend. Let the venerable one stay as long as he likes. Then the Buddha entered the potter's workshop, prepared a spread of grass, put grass out to sit on, at one end of the shop, sat down, crossed his legs, and sat upright, establishing mindfulness in front of him. In other words, he sat up and then he established in front of him what? His usual practice, which is intimacy with the room, the other monk, the entire world.

[67:14]

In the scene, there will be just the scene. In the herd, there will be just the herd. He established this practice that he recommended. He practiced it. He set it up and entered it right there in the room with this other monk. Then the Blessed One, together with the monk, continued this meditation through most of the night. And the Venerable Pukasati sat most of the night seated at the other end of the room with the Buddha. And the Blessed One thought, this monk conducts himself in a way that inspires confidence. Suppose I were to question him And the Buddha said, he said to the monk, under whom have you gone forth, monk?

[68:27]

Who are you studying with? Who is your teacher? And where is the teaching, who is the teacher whose teaching you profess? And the monk says, friend, there is a recluse named Gautama son of the Shakyans, the Blessed One. Now I have good report of that Blessed One and have become knowledgeable that he has achieved full accomplishment, he's fully enlightened, he has perfect knowledge, true knowledge, and conduct, sublime knower of the world, incomparable leader of persons to be trained, teacher of good of humans and gods, enlightened and blessed. I've heard that about him and so I've gone forth to be his disciple.

[69:33]

I have gone forth under the Blessed One. The Blessed One is my teacher. I profess the Blessed One's teaching. And the Buddha says to him, but monk, where is the blessed one, the accomplished and fully enlightened, now living? And the monk said, there is, friend, a city in the northern country named Savati. The blessed one, the accomplished one, the fully enlightened one is living there. And then the Buddha says, But monk, have you ever seen the Blessed One before? Would you recognize the Blessed One if you saw him right now? And the monk says, No, man, I've never seen the Blessed One before, nor would I recognize him if I saw him.

[70:43]

person is talking to the Buddha, and the Buddha asks the person, how would you recognize the Buddha? And the person says, well I don't know how I'd recognize him because I never met him before. How would you recognize the Buddha if you never met the Buddha before? Well, you say, well I've seen pictures of Shakyamuni Buddha, I've seen photographs, I know what he looks like. But actually, you know, we don't know what Shakyamuni Buddha looks like. We don't know when we're meeting the Buddha. We think we do, but we don't. This monk was honest. He was a good monk. He said, I don't know. If the Buddha was right in front of me right now, I wouldn't even know it. And then the Blessed One says, this person has gone forth to become a monk to study under me.

[72:10]

So maybe I should give him some teaching. So the Blessed One said to the Venerable Pukasati, monk, would you like me to give you some teaching? And the monk says, sure man, go ahead. See the formality? They're using forms. Now through that whole process, the Buddha could have been getting into a lot of right and wrong. You know, this guy's talking to the Buddha like, hey man. He knew the guy was saying, hey man. But he still liked the guy because the guy was a good monk, he just didn't know who he was talking to. Just like us, we don't know who we're talking to. All day long, we don't know who we're talking to. The Buddha does. The Buddha knows who she's talking to.

[73:13]

And the Buddha uses formality to be intimate with everybody that she's talking to. and not grasping any gain and loss in the conversation, and using the forms to test, to see if there's any gain and loss, like the form of, I'm Buddha, yeah, right, and he doesn't know me, yeah, right, and he's talking to me, hey man, but he's a good guy, he sat there with me all night, he's good, and he wants to study with me, so maybe I should give him some teaching. That can flow out quite nicely. But the monks involved in this training with the Buddha, the monk went forth to study with the Buddha and now the monk is practicing with the Buddha just like he wanted to, but doesn't know who the Buddha is. But he's doing pretty well and the Buddha is using forms with him and he's sensing, the monk's probably sensing, you know, to some extent whether there's any gain and loss around this interaction with this other monk, and when the monk offers,

[74:21]

He doesn't think, well, you know, would that be a gain or loss? Maybe he does, but he doesn't get into it that much. He says, yeah, go ahead, man, lay it on. So, the Buddha is working with the forms. The Buddha can see gain and loss, but doesn't get involved. This monk, to some extent, is still involved in gain and loss. a little bit, but not so much so that he like walks out of the room or tells Buddha to get out of the shop or says, no, you don't give me any Dharma talks, man, I give you Dharma talks. No, he doesn't say that, he's not that bad, he's not intoxicated, but there's a little bit of funniness here because he's still saying to the Buddha, he still doesn't see the Buddha. The Buddha is right in front of him, he doesn't see it, so he doesn't talk like he sees it, he says, And sometimes we do not see that Buddha is in front of us and we say, hey man, you're not Buddha, you're just a man or a woman.

[75:38]

Hey man, I can't quite get into like opening up to you being Buddha. But in this training of in the scene there's just a scene and in the herd there's just a herd, then you can open to that this person might be Buddha. Not even is Buddha, but might be. So he's opening to that. He's saying, OK, you can give me a Dharma talk. You can teach me some stuff. I'll listen. And then the Buddha gives him a very nice Dharma talk, the culmination of which is where he says, conceiving is a dart. Conceiving is a canker. In other words, when you conceive of things and grasp them, that causes outflows. So he gave that very teaching in this scripture. When you conceive of things, but when you overcome your conceiving, when you overcome your conceiving of who you're looking at, you're conceiving people, I'm conceiving you, I'm conceiving you, I'm conceiving you, you're conceiving me, you're conceiving her, we're conceiving, but when you overcome that conceiving by letting that conceiving just be conceiving, period, and don't get involved in it, don't cling to it,

[77:00]

Don't grasp it. Don't seek something else. When you overcome the conceiving, then you achieve peace. I believe that's the culmination of the Dharma talk that the Buddha gave him. When the tides of conceiving no longer sweep over you, this is called peace. Conceiving, the tides still arise, concept, concept, concept arising, concept ceasing, concept arising, concept... The tides arise and cease, but they don't sweep over you. You learn how to ride them. You don't cling to them. You're a great surfer. And when you learn how to ride these waves of conception, when you learn how to ride the seen and the heard and let them just be what they are, that's peace.

[78:11]

That's the end of the Buddha's talk. And part of what is mentioned in the scripture is that about three-fourths of the way through this talk, the monk thought, This is an awfully good talk. Oh my God! Maybe the person who's talking to me is the Blessed One. and he was utterly, utterly transformed to see the Buddha. First there was a Buddha, first there wasn't a Buddha, then there was a Buddha.

[79:14]

And he was right, it was a Buddha. One time I was driving over the road here, you know, on a foggy night, and I turned the radio on and I heard these people talking and they were speaking English, having a conversation in English, and I didn't know what they were talking about exactly. It was the middle of some kind of a play or something, it seemed like some kind of dramatic conversation they were having, and I wondered what it was, you know, and I couldn't really follow the story or anything, but I thought, This language is awfully beautiful. And I wasn't prepared, I didn't think I'd turn the radio on and hear people speaking beautiful English, but it was so just strikingly beautiful, and I thought, this must be Shakespeare. I don't know if it is Shakespeare, but it must be Shakespeare, and it was.

[80:23]

doesn't mean every time you think it's the Buddha talking that you're right, but maybe. Anyway, this monk woke up to who he was talking to about three-fourths of the way through the talk, but out of respect he didn't say, okay, it's enough, I got who you are, stop now. He let him finish the talk and what he said towards the end was actually pretty good. The end was a nice ending. And then he, after the Buddha finished, he formally said, you know, actually he formally thought, indeed the teacher has come to me, the sublime one has come to me, the fully enlightened one has come to me. And he rose from his seat. arranged his upper robe over his shoulder and prostrated himself with his head at the Blessed One's feet and said, Venerable Sir.

[81:34]

Not that big a deal. Venerable Sir. Transgressions overcame me, my old habits overcame me, in that, like a fool, confused and blundering, I presumed to address the Blessed One. Amen. Venerable Sir, may the Blessed One forgive me for my habitual way of seeing the world." And the Buddha said, transgression did overcome you. In fact, as a fool, confused and blundering, you did presume to address me as, hey man. But, since you see your transgression, your error, as such, and made amends in accordance with the forms of Dharma, we forgive you.

[82:48]

It is a growth in the noble one's discipline when one sees one's errors as such and makes amends in accordance with the forms of practice. According to the Dharma, one undertakes restraint in the future. They're using these forms at the end, when the monks become more or less enlightened, and they used him in the beginning. The function is somewhat different, but they're still using him. The difference is that in the end the forms are like just the forms. Just the forms. And now the Buddha has a real disciple. And then the monk says, formally, as to become a monk, he's gone forth as a monk, but he hasn't been ordained. He wishes to become ordained.

[83:50]

with the Buddha, so he asks the Buddha to do so, and then the Buddha gives him another form. He says, I do not ordain people unless they have the proper robe and bow. Do you have them? The monk says, no. He says, well, get them. And if you get them, then I'll do the ordination, still using the forms. And if you want to get ordained and the Buddha says to you, do you have a robe and a bow, you might think, well, what do you mean robe and bow? Okay? Gain and loss. Or, oh great, I'll get my... Gain and loss. Whatever the form is, there's an opportunity for gain and loss. Like thinking stupid form or cool form. Anyway, grasping, seeking the forms, using the forms to surface any grasping and seeking in the relationship. And so the Buddha used these forms 2,500 years ago and they've been used over the centuries for the sake of intimacy, not for the sake of really right and wrong, but to surface and become free of clinging to right and wrong, of being hung up on right and wrong, of being in denial

[85:12]

or pride around right and wrong, until finally, in the right there's just the right, and in the wrong there's just the wrong. Period. In the good there's just the good, and in the bad there's just the bad. Period. And then you will not identify with the good or the bad. You will not locate yourself in the good or the bad. You will not identify with the right or the left. You will not identify with the current administration or the next administration. In the administration there will be just the administration. And in the end of the administration, there will be just the end of the administration.

[86:20]

Then you will not identify with it, and you will not locate yourself in it, and then there will be no here or there or in between, and that will be the end of suffering. And then you can join hands with the administration and walk through death with it. And birth, and death. You can be intimate then, not just with the left, but also the right. You can be intimate, not just with those that you feel adorable, but those who you have a repulsion to. But it's not easy to be intimate with people you feel are harmful. or people who represent harmful tendencies, it's not intimate, but the Buddha finds a way to be intimate with these beings. Buddha can see, in the sober meditation practice, the appropriate way to relate, even to a murderer.

[87:36]

But this is not easy. It's not easy to. Intimacy is not easy. These forms are not easy to work with, because they raise all this good and bad, right and wrong, gain and loss. And then we notice all this clinging. It's embarrassing. But if we note it, as this monk did, for what it is, this is progress in the reality, realization of truth. But it's not easy for us to identify and express our awareness of our error. But again, that's a form that promotes intimacy. It's a form that promotes freedom. May our intention equate with the truth of God's way.

[88:56]

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