For the last several years, I've been studying and discussing with people the relationship between what might be called our central meditation practice and the bodhisattva precepts. How many people in this group are not familiar with the bodhisattva precepts? Could you raise your hands? Bodhisattva precepts are, in language, in speech, we often talk of 16 bodhisattva precepts. But there's also, like, of course, you know, the entire universe

[01:03]

Everything in the universe is the Bodhisattva precepts. Oh, is the sound okay in the back? Hmm? It's okay? Who's having trouble hearing me? You are? How about now? Still having trouble? Yes? Can people hear me in the back? So the sixteen bodhisattva precepts are, the first three are to return to the Buddha, the Dharma and the Sangha. The next three are to embrace and sustain the forms of practice

[02:06]

which liberate us from self-clinging. Next is to embrace and sustain all good that emerges from freedom from self-clinging. And the last is to embrace and sustain all beings. Those are the next three. And the last three are spoken of negatively, traditionally, as not killing, not stealing, not misusing sexuality, not lying, not using intoxicants, not speaking of others' faults, not praising self while not praising others, not being possessive of anything, even the truth,

[03:10]

not being angry inappropriately, and not in any way disparaging the Buddha, the Dharma, or the Sangha. The Buddha being, having many meanings, but basically enlightenment itself is the Buddha, the one who realizes it, is the Buddha, and the transformation of beings, the enlightenment of beings is the Buddha, and Dharma is the teaching or the truth which Buddha realizes and propagates. And Dharma is also all the ways the truth gets transformed into points of access for us, like words and written teachings and so on.

[04:18]

And the Sangha is the community of people who study the truth. And the Sangha are those beings who are in harmony and peace with each other. So the last precept is not to disparage those treasures, Buddha, Dharma or Sangha. So those are the 16 Bodhisattva precepts. And so we've been talking about how those receiving those precepts is the gate to what we call Zen meditation. receiving these precepts is the authentic access to what we call being upright. And being upright, once we enter into being upright, then these precepts will

[05:33]

sustain us in continuing to be upright, and in this state of being upright, which is supported by these precepts, we have revelation. Revelation comes to us. Revelation of Buddha's truth. And realization comes to us in this state of being upright. This is called waking up, bodhi. In this being upright, which is sustained and supported by receiving the precepts, we see the light of the precepts. When we first receive the precepts, we have some understanding of them

[06:37]

But usually the precepts seem a little bit outside of us, as though we're taking them into ourselves. And that we're here and these precepts are over there, and we try to practice these precepts. That's the way people usually start. But when we finally enter into being upright, the precepts are no longer outside. And then we see the light or the meaning of the precepts. And when we see that, we are awake. And then the precepts come out of us. So someone made a nice diagram of this, of how the precepts lead to being upright. is the channel of revelation of Buddha's truth, and out of Buddha's truth comes great compassion and the Bodhisattva precepts.

[07:46]

And it goes round and round like that. Can you see that picture? Precepts being upright, awakening, bodhi, great compassion, precepts being upright, round and round. If you want that diagram, you can get it in the office. I mentioned before that there was a young man, there was a man, a boy in France, I guess in probably the 30s. He was born in the 30s, I think in Paris, and he had an accident and lost his eyesight when he was about, I don't know, maybe five or seven years old.

[08:56]

And after he recovered from the injury and was somewhat adjusted to being blind, one day he realized that there was light. He couldn't see with his eyes the way most people do, but he saw light. Definitely there was light for him. And when he could see that light, he knew what to do. He had no trouble knowing the appropriate response to whatever happened. But as soon as he got angry or afraid, the light went out. looks like he discovered at a young age the light of the precepts.

[10:11]

And although he said that when he became angry or afraid the light went out, I would say if you become angry, afraid, or greedy, the light will go out. So by receiving the precepts of not being greedy, and not being angry, and so on, and trying to practice them, you can gradually settle into a place where greed and anger are not possessing you. Where you're in the present, and there's no fear, and the light comes on, and you know what to do. But if you or I become angry, the light goes out.

[11:30]

Angry again in an inappropriate way. Anger that's not helpful. anger that's based on selfishness. Turns the light of the precepts off, or at least closes your eyes to it. Using the precepts or not using the precepts, anyway, if we can enter into a way of being in this world where we're attentive, thoroughly attentive, in everything, in everything, without manipulating anything, this is being upright.

[12:48]

When we're that way, when we're attentive to everything, completely, devotedly attentive to everything, to every face we meet, attentive, without any manipulation of that face, by manipulation I mean without trying to make that face different, respecting that face, Sweet, smiling face. Respect it. Which means don't try to possess it. Sour, angry, disrespectful face. Respect it. Attentive. Ooh, what a sour face we have here. This person looks like they hate me. This person looks like they don't respect me. Ooh. Wow. Life. Life. I am attentive to this face.

[13:56]

I am attentive to its comings and goings and every little change in this face, now sour, now sweet, now disrespectful, now respectful, now trusting, now distrusting, now loving, now adoring, now disinterested, constantly changing faces, oceans of faces, oceans of glorious faces. I attend to them all and I don't disrespect any of them and I don't manipulate them to make them better or worse. I stay close to all faces and drop all my agendas. In this state of being upright, the lights come on and you know how to talk to those faces. You know when to be quiet and when to lip off. And not only do you see the light in every face that you respect without trying to improve or depreciate, but sparks come off your lips.

[15:12]

And the precepts flow out of your breast spontaneously. They flow out of your breast when you see the light. And you see the light when you're in this being upright way. This is called happiness by me. It's called walk up the road on Sunday morning and be happy that you're alive because you know what to do. Because the light's there guiding you. You don't have to figure anything out anymore. You do the right thing without any deliberation. It comes before you can think of it. It's a good deal.

[16:26]

But you have to pay the price of entry into the realm of light by receiving these precepts and by not manipulating the life as it comes to you. And yet, being close to it, it's easy to not manipulate things when they're out of town. But when they're right up in your face, Maybe I should say it's relatively easy to not manipulate things when they're far away. Some people try to manipulate things, rumors they hear from long distance. But up close, especially those things which you're giving a lot of attention to, some being that you're really devoted to and give your very best to, sometimes when they act certain ways, it's hard to not want to manipulate them. Like your children, perhaps. who you're really devoted to and give everything to, and then they act certain ways, it's hard not to want them to be a little different.

[17:31]

But wanting them to be different and then acting out is not being upright. When you see this person and you're in the light, You don't want to change things, you just do the right thing. Now sometimes doing the right thing looks like changing something, but your intention is not to change. It's like this rain that sometimes falls from the sky. You know about that rain? Some of it was falling earlier today. You know what direction? Generally it fell down. Did you notice that? It was going down. Did it want to go down? Did it want to change its position in the sky? No, I don't think so. I think it just fell from the clouds and it went down because of that thing called gravity. And then it touched the earth. And when it touched the earth, the earth changed.

[18:35]

But the rain was not thinking, oh, I want the earth to be different. I want the earth to be all moist. The rain was drawn to the earth by various conditions. And the earth and the rain did this thing. That's what the precepts are like when they just flow out of you. They just flow out and touch other beings. Somebody's tense, for example. Your hand reaches out and touches their tension, and they relax, or they don't. And your finger, you know, comes right out from you and touches right the spot where they're holding. The exact spot. And you don't think there's something wrong with them at the spot you're touching. And the person feels that you're not trying to change them. And you're not.

[19:39]

And they change. And they receive the precepts. You wanted to give, but you didn't think that there was something wrong with them. And yet you went right to the place where they're suffering. And sometimes they receive the precepts and sometimes they don't. Sometimes they say, no thank you, I'd rather keep being tense. And that's fine with you. And then maybe you touch the same spot again. But not because you're trying to press the point, but because the precepts are using you to press the point. And sometimes you don't press again because the precepts don't want to do that. The light does not guide you that way. Anyway, you don't have to worry about this kind of stuff anymore. The light's working. Is it hard to...

[20:45]

arrive at that place moment after moment? All the ancestors said yes. Is it possible to arrive at that place? Yes. Is it possible to achieve continuity in arriving at that place? Yes. Does it take many years of intense practice? Yes, for most people. And for those who doesn't take many years, we say that they had many lifetimes before when they did it. It takes a long time to get to this place of light. This young French guy, some people would say he was a very good practitioner of the precepts for many lifetimes before that he was able to, at seven or eight years old, find the light. Now, here's a story about how it is.

[22:01]

It's one of my favorite Zen stories, and it's about two Zen masters who lived in China in the Tang Dynasty. These two masters turn out to be two of the greatest. This is when they were a little on the young side, like maybe in their 30s. 30s and maybe around 40. They'd been training a long time, both of them. One was, in a sense, the older brother. The older brother's name was Yanto. The younger brother was named Shui Fung. Want to say Yanto? Say it. Yanto. Shui Fung. Say Shui Fung. Shui Fung. How do your lips feel? Both these guys actually got to the point where they were Buddhas, actual Buddhas, or where the Buddha thing was like realized in them through their practice of the precepts.

[23:16]

They really got to this place of being upright. And even before they got there, they were outstanding people. Especially Shreya Fong was like what he called no slouch prior to arriving at being upright. He was like a world-class, hard-working meditator before he got to the point that I'm talking about. He had many profound insights before he arrived at the place where he could see the light of the precepts. So please be patient with yourself and your friends and your parents and your children and your spouses if it takes them a while to get to this place where the precepts come out of them spontaneously with no deliberation and with yourself.

[24:19]

Because even these great masters who practiced a long time and had great insights still took them a long time to get to this place of perfect balance where the precepts were not outside or inside, but spontaneously arose from the life of the practitioner. So Yanto and Shui Fung were walking, they were doing foot travel in the Tang Dynasty, China. And they were going to visit Qinshan, Qin Mountain, which was in Hunan. And they got as far as Tortoise Mountain. And they got snowed in in the mountains.

[25:21]

And they stayed at an inn for a while. Can you hear me okay? And while they were snowed in, Yanto, the elder, just slept. But Shui Fung, Mr. Diligence, constantly sat in meditation. Occasionally, Yan Tong would wake up and say, get some rest. Shui Fung said, touching his breast, touching his heart, he said, it's still not at peace here. I don't dare deceive myself.

[26:33]

In other words, I don't dare deceive myself to think I'm okay and I can sleep at peace now. Yanto said, hmm. Yanto thought quite a bit of his younger brother. He thought he had come quite a long ways. He said, I thought that later on you would go to the summit of a solitary peak, build a hut of straw... and propagate the great teaching. In other words, I thought you were about ready to be a great teacher. You look good to me, but you're still talking like this." Shui Fung said again, ìI'm really not yet at peace. And Yantou said, if you really like this, bring forth your views.

[27:39]

Where they're correct, I'll approve them. Where they're wrong, I'll prune them away for you. Xue Feng said, okay. When I was at Yunguan, Master Yuen Kwan went up to the hall, which means he went up to the lecture hall, and I saw the meaning of form and emptiness and gained entry into the way. Does that sound pretty good? Well, it was. I don't know if it sounds good, but it was good. So what did Janto say?

[28:45]

Did he approve it? No. Did he disapprove it? No. What did he say? He said, from now on, for 30 years, do not mention this. Do you see why he told him not to mention this? Because it was outside. Then Shreyafang said, when I was at Dungsan, I saw a verse, a famous verse of Dungsan crossing the stream.

[29:50]

And I had insight." Yanto said, "'If you go like this, you won't even be able to save yourself, not to mention others." Still outside. Then Shui Fung said, when I was at De Shan, and De Shan is a name of a mountain, but it's also the name of a teacher, and De Shan was a teacher of both Shui Fung and Yanto. When I was at De Shan, I asked the master, De, do I have any part or do I have any role in the great drama of the teaching of the most ancient school or not?

[31:02]

Master De struck me with his staff and said, what are you saying? At that time, it was like the bottom of the bucket dropping out for me. Then Yanto shouted at him and said, haven't you heard that the family jewels don't come in through the gate? In the future, if you want to propagate the great teaching, let each point of the teaching flow out from your breast and cover heaven and earth for me and cover heaven and earth for me."

[32:28]

At this, Shreya Fong was greatly enlightened. and cried out, at last on Tortoise Mountain I've entered the way. At last on Tortoise Mountain I've entered the way. So at first, we have a ceremony to receive the precepts. And at first, we can't help it probably, the jewels of the precepts seem to come in through the front gate. Hey, it's okay. But after you receive them once, See if from then on, after you once say, I receive these precepts and I will practice with these precepts, I will live these precepts, I will be devoted to these precepts, from then on see if they can stop coming in through the front gate and you can be still and practice them without keeping this pulling in way, without taking the precepts.

[33:55]

without pushing them away, but find them in your own heart, in your own breast. Receive them once, but then from then on, don't bring them in. Practice them. Don't make not killing and not stealing something outside yourself. Understand that who you really are is called not stealing.

[35:03]

That's what you really are. You are not stealing. You are not killing life. You are not misusing sexuality. You are telling the truth. That's what you really are. That's what you are like when you are attentive and respectful of everything. Okay, this way of being upright, this way of being attentive and non-manipulative, all right?

[36:13]

So you meet living beings. Being upright means you're attentive to them, You don't manipulate them. That's what I would call intimacy. You meet beings and you don't have any equipment to manipulate. You've lost it temporarily. All you can do is meet them. You can be strong. You can strongly be yourself. But you don't manipulate the other If you meet some person or some plant or some animal or a rock and you pay attention to it without manipulation, that I would call being intimate with them. If you slip into manipulation, that diminishes the intimacy.

[37:19]

Manipulation is something we do when we can't stand the intimacy of We can't stand the intimacy of the meeting. Then we slip into manipulation. That brings the darkness back. And then we'd have to figure out what to do. What's the next manipulation going to be? In intimacy with other beings, of being attentive and non-manipulative and tolerating that intensity, the right activity arises spontaneously. Therefore, we do not kill a being. There's no being we could possibly kill. We meet beings.

[38:25]

We do not manipulate them from life to death. We do not do that. We do not do that. We do not get into manipulating a bug from life to death. We don't even get into manipulating the bug from right to left. We do not manipulate. We are intimate with the bug. We do not take. We do not take. We receive gifts, donations. Right here, donations. But we do not take in that intimacy. We do not cut the intimacy by stealing. Sexuality. We meet a being and there's sexuality there. We do not manipulate the sexuality.

[39:28]

We face it. We're attentive to it. We're devoted to it, but we don't manipulate it. We don't exploit it. We don't suppress it. We don't elevate it. We face it with empty hands. We face another person in the face of sexuality. And this person is not manipulated by us. Our ancient master says, in that way of being upright with another person and our sexuality, we are intimate. He didn't say this yet. It's still me talking. We are intimate with this sexuality. We are intimate with this person.

[40:31]

We have no recourse to this meeting. We don't slip into doing anything about this meeting. We just meet. It's intense. Nobody's in control. They're not in control. I'm not in control. Everybody's vulnerable to each other and to sexuality. It's all over the place. What do we do? What do we do? What do we do? Be upright. Let the precept of not misusing sexuality flow out of your breasts for another meeting and flow out of your breasts for another meeting. Not for a meeting you plan. Well, now what should we do? No, not that. Now where should we go?

[41:35]

No. Before anybody can talk, the next meeting occurs. I almost want to say we stand and meet each other in powerlessness, but it's not exactly powerless, like somebody's got the power and you don't. And there's plenty of power flowing through the situation. The juice is on. But nobody owns the power. It's a powerful situation, but nobody uses the power. The power is flowing in beneficial ways, but nobody's manipulating it for their own gains. We stand in awe of the power of the meeting. Upright. not killing, not stealing, not lying, and not indulging or rejecting this sexuality.

[42:39]

We bring our palms together, we bow to it, we respect its power, its immortal power. which is not there for me to use or be used by. It's there for me to be intimate with. And through that intimacy with sexuality, the precept of no inappropriate sexuality is revealed and realized. So this is what the old master said, where nothing can be brought in, that is where everything is inviolable. In the precept of not misusing sexuality, nothing can be brought in and everything is inviolable.

[43:55]

There we stand in the realm of sexuality. Nothing is brought in, and everything is inviolable. The sexuality is fully contained. No sexuality can be brought in or kicked out, and everything is inviolable. This, says the old Buddha, is exactly the great light Here you stand, immersed in sexuality. Not gaining or losing anything. Nothing gets pushed or shoved around by sexuality. And everything's changing. This is the great light. Here, we will not misuse sexuality. We're just intimate with it.

[45:04]

we are sexually satisfied. This can be called great sex. It is certainly the great light of the precept of appropriate relationship with sexuality or appropriate sexuality. I often end my talks here on Sundays with a song, but there's almost no songs about appropriate sexuality.

[46:20]

Okay. Actually, I said there were almost none, but actually I just heard one. You must remember this. A kiss is just a kiss. A smile is just a smile. Fundamental things of life as time goes by. You have another one over there? Let's hear it. From you I receive. From you I receive. Together we share from this we live. So I'm wrong. But the light's not wrong. the light is right so please find the light and if you don't find it today be patient keep looking for the place of complete attention and no manipulation where you respect everything for what it is and give everything your total attention without trying to gain or lose anything in the interaction the light will appear

[48:07]

to one who is completely devoted to this upright being. I'm sure. I've seen it in many people. It's wonderful but difficult because you have to give up all gain, all personal gain and loss. So it takes time. Be patient. But please persevere if you want to realize the great Bodhisattva precepts. Okay? Oh, and in question and answer, I'll talk about another precept called, was it, No Intoxicants. They are intention and equally perpetrated. particular tradition? Well, yes, it comes from the Zen tradition.

[49:13]

It comes from the Zen robe store in downtown Kyoto on a street called Temple Street. Yes? . Mm-hmm. . do you mean like would the precept mean that you wouldn't drink anything that had alcohol in it for example would it mean that

[50:35]

For some people, that's what it would mean. For other people, it wouldn't mean that. So, for example, let's say somebody offered you, I don't know what, one of those little candies that has rum in it, or fruitcake. Okay? Some people can't drink that. Even that, right? It would be poisonous to them. Other people could receive it with no intention of manipulating what's happening. And it wouldn't, I think, it could be very much in the spirit of doing the right thing, the thing that's appropriate to life. Even food, you can use food as an intoxicant.

[51:43]

You can use food as a way of manipulating situations. And food, if you're going to do it, it's somewhat better than some other intoxicants. Some yogis think that food is the best intoxicant. If you're going to misuse something, that food is probably the best. But some people, as you know, their lives are endangered by the way they use food. So you can misuse food, you can use food as an intoxicant, or you can use food in a way that's in accord with appropriate activity, doing the right thing. So alcohol, for example, an extreme example of, I heard of this guy one time, he went to Japan. He was a young monk, and he went with the abbot of his temple. to visit a big Zen master for his birthday party.

[52:50]

And these were American priests, American Zen priests going to visit Japanese Zen priest. And the younger priest was me. And so we're going to this birthday party and the Japanese priests were serving us a 20-course vegetarian meal. 20 courses. It was delicious. And they were constantly serving us beer and sake. And so they were serving it. Now, when I went to that, I personally went to that, I didn't go to that thing to get drunk. That was not my intention. I was not drinking the alcohol they served to manipulate my state.

[53:53]

And if you refused, if you took none, it would, you know... the monks who were serving you would probably show you a face of sadness. And their teacher kept pushing them to serve, you know, so they kept pushing you. So I drank some, and I must admit I had a slight inclination towards not getting drunk. I wasn't completely upright. I was leaning slightly towards... rejecting the alcohol. So in that sense I wasn't really intimate with it. Now, it is possible to refuse a drink being offered to you. Someone can offer you a drink and you can say, no thank you, without the slightest leaning away from the drink. And you can also receive it without the slightest leaning towards the drink.

[55:04]

If someone offers you a drink and you slightly lean away from it, you become somewhat intoxicated. If you lean towards it, you become slightly intoxicated or greatly intoxicated. So intimacy with intoxicants, alcohol or other drugs, is to have any bias whatsoever in regard to them. So in that case, anyway, when I first started to receive these drinks, I had a slight preference to not receive too much because I didn't want to get intoxicated. I didn't want to embarrass anybody. And I didn't want to be embarrassed in front of this teacher, who I think perhaps you could perhaps interpret that they were trying to see if they could get us drunk. there's some rumor that Japanese monks want to see how much alcohol Western people can take.

[56:09]

Because we have some enzymes that Asian people don't have, especially the northern Europeans, the Norwegians. Asian people actually have a lower tolerance often for alcohol because they lack a certain enzyme to process and they often turn red. Matter of fact, the Asian name for an alcoholic is orangutan, which means the red-faced person. They look like orangutan or orange face. So they like to see how much can these Americans or these northern Europeans absorb. I don't know if that's what they were doing, but it looked like they were doing that. If you didn't drink, if you just took the drink and let us sit there, they would still come over to you and tell you to drink it. And as soon as you drank it, they'd fill it again. So the senior priest sitting next to me said, you know, if you accept the drinks, they'll leave me alone.

[57:19]

So I accepted the drinks and they left him alone. Now I, on an empty stomach, you know, five in the afternoon, if I want to manipulate my state, if that's my intention, If I really want to, I can manipulate my state without ingesting any stuff. Okay? After many years of Zen practice, without ingesting any food or alcohol or drugs, on an empty stomach particularly, I can manipulate my state. into various other states. Okay? That's no big deal. Some of you can too, I'm sure. For example, I can take a nap. That will manipulate my state. I can stand on my head.

[58:32]

That will manipulate my state. I can sit cross-legged like this. My state will be manipulated. If I want to manipulate it, I can manipulate it. I can run up a hill. That will manipulate my state. Okay? I can talk to somebody and misuse sexuality that will manipulate my state. In other words, I know how to manipulate my state. If I want to do it, I can do it. Of course, I've learned that it doesn't go the way I want to, but anyway, we won't get into that right now. But I can also use things to manipulate my state if I want to manipulate my state. So for example, if I want to make my state what you call a little bit intoxicated with alcohol, if I want to, just like a few sips of beer on an empty stomach, and I can get manipulated by that. It doesn't take much. And I can tell the difference between the before and the after. Big difference from a little bit because I don't drink very much. Okay?

[59:35]

So I know what it's like when I get intoxicated and I know what it's like when I want to get intoxicated. I know because I can look inside and see that I want to. And I can also see that I don't want to. And I can also see that I don't care whether I am or not. That's the way I want to be. I want to be like, I don't care what my state is. I just want to live. So anyway, that occasion, I started out by a little bit not wanting to get that way. And then I switched from not wanting to get that way to just not caring whether I got drunk or not. And I drank an enormous amount of sake and beer. Well, for me and for them. And I did not get drunk. I didn't get drunk.

[60:38]

I didn't get high. The thought, you know, I had some interesting thoughts. Like, I remember it was a lovely temple. a very lovely temple, a national treasure kind of temple. It's a temple that was actually founded by Banke Zenji hundreds of years before. Now, we're sitting in the abbot's interview room there, having this wonderful meal, and I looked out through the open windows, I looked out, and I noticed that the garden was very lovely. Very lovely, green, summer, July birthday party. And the thought crossed my mind, well, here I am, visiting a Zen teacher, ingesting great quantities of alcohol. Isn't this interesting? This is not what I expected. And when the meal was over, I stood up and walked out. And by the time I got to the parking lot, I didn't feel any effects of the alcohol. So it is possible that the right thing to do sometimes is to accept alcoholic beverages and drink them or whatever.

[61:49]

It might be right. And if there's no intention to manipulate yourself, it doesn't violate the precept. On the other hand, even if you had that attitude and it wouldn't be appropriate then to get in a car, Or it wouldn't be appropriate to do that if you would go unconscious or something like that. But in this case, it worked out fine. And so I don't think that I violated the precept on that occasion. But some other times, with a tiny amount, I think I violated the precept. I think I turned away from intimacy with what was happening. I think I, what do you call it, didn't really respect and give my total attention to what was happening. I tweaked it with a little alcohol or a little this or a little that. So I think it's the manipulation.

[62:53]

It's the gain and loss thing. It's the power tripping on your state. That's what this is referred to and to use things for that purpose. And for some people, a tiny bit will throw them into that. They have a, what do you call it, a genetic predisposition so that the tiniest bit will set them off on some both physical damage and or losing or throw them into being caught by the vortex of manipulation. And they'll do it again and again. And so for them, it's appropriate not to have any. For some people, sexuality is like that. Some people go crazy on sexuality if they get involved in it in certain ways. They have to abstain in the literal sense. For other people, they can have dozens of kids without ever misusing sexuality. Matter of fact, some people could be having sex pretty much all day long in any old way you can name it and not violate the precepts.

[64:00]

is possible. But such sexuality would be like emanating the Bodhisattva precepts. They would be showing people. Every sexual encounter would be demonstrating not misusing sexuality. They would be liberating people from indulgence in misuse of sexuality. Now, such people are not that common. They're hard to find because sexuality is so deeply built into gain and loss. We're so habitually goal-oriented around it because it's tied into our survival. So you've got to be pretty outstanding to be able to be involved in it a lot and have it always be beneficial to beings.

[65:05]

But, you know, enlightened people can have, you know, what do you call it, sexual intercourse and, you know, and stay enlightened through the process. And some people might say, well, they don't have much fun, do they? I would say they even have fun. They have the joy of expressing enlightenment through that human capacity. Enlightened people also can eat. They can eat food. Enlightened people can sleep, like Ganto slept a lot. Ganto slept a lot. Enlightened people also can practice very intense meditation. They can sit still for hours and hours and be awake and alert.

[66:11]

Awaiting people can be vastly, inconceivably compassionate and wise. Letting people can do whatever is helpful. And sometimes it's helpful to have a drink and then they should drink. Sometimes it's helpful to eat and then they eat Okay? And for starters? Yes? Uh-huh? What about some religious practices, particularly native practices that involve ingestion of substances that all are psychotropic symptoms? What about some people who have a religious practice of ingesting psychotropic chemicals?

[67:15]

You know, I think that it's possible that human religion may have started from those kinds of practices. I could, I could, you know, I can go for that history of the human race. But the first that, you know, we were, we were, you know, we were, you know, our ancestors were kind of like, you know, doing their thing. You know, they were doing their reproduction thing. Kind of like the guys were kind of like, these are my women, you know, and the women were going, this is my man. And these are my kids. That kind of thing that they did. And, uh, You know? And you get out of here. This is my feeding area. This is my cave. So, you know, it looks like we had these ancestors. And then maybe one time one of those ancestors popped a little...

[68:21]

Mushroom in the mouth right there eating mushrooms and they tasted one of these mushrooms and then suddenly one of them had this vision Kind of like oh geez all those other guys that I've been fighting with are actually like me And all those you know mastodons that I've been slaughtering from my kids they're like me Geez and I feel happy and I'm not scared and My feeling is that a long time ago, our ancestors had some similarities to us. One of the similarities they had was they were scared. They were scared, like other animals. They were scared. They were scared because other animals ate us. We used to live around other animals that were bigger and ate us. We used to get munched on, and that's part of our background. And then we finally even got so tough that we could beat up almost everybody.

[69:27]

But still, we were scared because they weren't us. And we ganged up, and we could beat up even huge animals. Anyway, we have a vicious background, which is still being enacted, as you see, among our people. But I think maybe what somebody did one time is they ate some of that stuff, which put a little bit of vegetable chemical in them. A little vegetable DNA started flowing through. We started feeling interconnected. And we started, for a moment anyway, when we were high on this stuff, they started to feel not so afraid and more loving. And they started to do that as a religious act, maybe. And this is probably after they started burying each other and stuff like that. That's maybe one's history of the thing, right? It was a religious kind of thing that it like opened the human, the little human animal mind to interconnectedness through chemical assistance. And that maybe was part of what people started to think. Do you feel really good when you feel interconnected rather than, you know, me and my stuff over them?

[70:33]

And I would say that religions that are still doing that are still like opening minds to that possibility. And I think in America, a generation of people actually got their minds opened up a little bit through ingesting stuff that made them feel interconnected in what is called the 60s and then since then. My first practice period at Tassajara, we did a little survey, and 100% of the males in the monastery had taken LSD. And a few of the women, and none of the Japanese had taken it. 100% of the American males had taken LSD. Now, I don't think it's that high in students that are coming now, but that's what it was back in the 60s. that a generation used these psychotropic drugs to sort of open their minds to the possibility of the fearless state of love that one has when one sees how things really are.

[71:38]

But I think Buddhism moved beyond that and not to use something because using something still plays back into that dualistic thing of being separate from the thing you're using. So, in fact, as part of the evolution, it may be helpful to some people to get a taste of sort of the interconnected reality of life through some chemical. But then, as the practice proceeds, those chemicals, if taken to get that vision, would be poison. they would poison your sense of interconnectedness because you keep going back to the drug to get the sense of interconnectedness. And every time you took the drug, it will be one more gouge in your faith in your interconnectedness. So as a starter, as an initiation into the possibility, you know, an actual experience of interconnection, it's okay.

[72:44]

But gradually one should wean oneself of any device to get a sense of how wonderful life can be. And that's what that story was about today. Did you hear that story? He had all these insights coming into him, but at his stage of development, it was time to stop dropping that stuff. But he grew up on that. He grew up on this thing of getting these teachings from the outside and having these insights, getting these teachings and having these insights, getting hit by the teacher and having the insight, deeper and deeper insights. But when you're mature, and I'm talking to you as mature practitioners, then it's time to stop bringing stuff in and just deal with whatever comes in your face. Stop trying to hang out with just nice, enlightened people. stop trying to hang out with just enlightened states of mind and deal with whatever comes up. On the other hand, if you're really getting discouraged and you haven't, you know, you feel like you're going to really freak out and quit practicing unless you, you know, have a sip of this or that to remind you to relax, then go ahead, take it, it's probably good.

[74:01]

Okay? Okay? So I still think these practices are some help. They're like feeders into the central practice of being a real human. OK, there were several hands and stuff. Bump, bump, bump, and bump. Yes? OK. He's going to talk about anger. Something which is occurring to me now is that it is starting to come up fairly regularly. And I think the reason for that is that sufficient layers have been uncovered in practice for that to be explored. And back here to four, it was simply not present in my life, and I didn't allow it.

[75:05]

You mean you had buried it, sort of? Yeah, I buried its expression. I didn't have any means of its expression. So now here it is. It's what comes out. very far for me, both in the moment and outside the moment, to know what to do with it once I've got it. And I'd like to add a couple of things that do happen. One is that having the ability to express it for perhaps the first time in my life is an extraordinarily seductive situation. And at the same time, it's very frightening. And there's the third element in that it is not right. That it's expressionless. I'm likely to cast a judgment upon it almost immediately.

[76:05]

Okay. Well, I congratulate you on becoming aware of it and sounds like it's aware of various aspects of its working and being aware of it is not it. Being aware of anger is not anger. Okay? No? Being aware of a cup is not a cup. Being aware of greed is not greed. It's an awareness. That looks like you still don't get that. No? In other words, every moment there is the possibility of you being aware. There may or may not be anger arising in your awareness.

[77:17]

All right? But you may have awareness every moment. All right? Sometimes anger may arise, but awareness of the anger is not the anger. That's something I'm just suggesting to you that has been pointed out and which I found helpful to be aware of and be convinced of that awareness is not the same as anger. Although anger can arise in the midst of awareness. And you seem to have some now awareness of anger. And there was a time when you didn't have awareness of anger. even though you are suspicious that maybe there was anger there but you just weren't aware of it. Is that right? Yeah. Like a lot of people are what we call passively aggressive and sometimes they don't even know that they're being aggressive even though their passive aggression might be more harmful than active aggression.

[78:29]

So my first point that I just wanted to say to you is that congratulations on being aware while you're angry. Some people are angry and don't even notice that they're angry. They scream at people, they hurt people, they get carried away by the anger, and they don't even notice that they're angry. And if somebody says you're angry, they don't understand what they're talking about and will even say, no, it's not true. I'm not angry. Even though They later maybe would be able to see, as their awareness develops, that they were angry, but they just couldn't stay awake in the middle of the anger. Now you seem to be coming awake in the middle of your anger. The more awake you are in the middle of your anger, the closer you're becoming to become free of it. There is a certain kind of anger that can arise, and it looks like anger, But it's actually not really anger. It's not really harmful, inappropriate anger.

[79:36]

It's anger which is like a rage or a saying no to certain things which really life does say no to, like cruelty. That's an appropriate thing to have rage about and say no to. But anger, which is really trying to hurt beings, is not appropriate. And it is about the worst thing that we can come up with, is wanting to harm life. That kind of anger really is like the worst of all worst things. It's really bad in terms of emotions. But that does arise, and when it does arise, if we can become intimate with it, it will gradually lose its power. There will be awakening in the middle of it. So your awareness that's starting to grow in the middle of these angry moments will gradually become intimate with it and you'll become free of it.

[80:42]

As you become more and more intimate with anger, you become more and more intimate with your impatience with some pain. As you become more intimate with impatience, you become more patient. As you become more patient, you protect your consciousness from anger. As you become more patient, you start to appreciate and pay attention to the pain which was originally rejected in anger. So the patience gets stronger, the anger gets less frequent through awareness of the arising of anger. And be patient with the rate at which you become patient, too. Because it may be a slow process. There may be a very large number of angry moments ahead of you before they stop. But again, I've seen people practice over the years and I've seen the anger go down gradually and not because of suppression but because of increased patience and tolerance and appreciation and attentiveness and selflessness.

[81:59]

Okay? Good luck. Good luck to us too. Yes? Yes? When Yantou said to Shui Fung, let the teaching flow out from the grass and cover, have it enter for me, the for me, when you said it this time, seemed like extra. How is it that it's for me? Yeah. Did you hear what he said? He said Yantou, Elder Brother Yantou said to Shui Fung, Let the, you know, let it, you know, let the family jewels, let the light of the precepts flow out of your breast and cover heaven and earth for me. And that for me is kind of surprising, wasn't it? Why didn't you just say cover heaven and earth? Just let it go at that. So Linda thought it was maybe extra. I thought it was surprising. And so...

[83:05]

And there it is for me. So I have various interpretations for me. One is, you know, do me a favor, brother. Would you please, you know, be the Buddha that I know you can be so I can go back to sleep? You know, I feel bad here sleeping while you're sort of slaving away on your cushion, when actually I can see you're just perfect if you just sort of like, you know, stop trying to get something out of practice. For me, you know, do me a favor, would you? Here I am, a poor, you know, a poor Buddha who's trying to, you know, take a nap. But I can't sleep as long as you're meditating, trying to get something. You know, give me a break. Be a great master. Something like that. Or another way to put it is, What is it? Mr. Sandman, bring me a dream. Make her the cutest that I've ever seen. That kind of thing.

[84:12]

You know what I mean? In other words, make me a success. Mr. Shravan, make me a success. Here I am trying to teach you the Dharma, and you're not giving me any rest. You know, that kind of thing. It's kind of like personal. These Buddhists can say me and, you know, it's cute. But it's surprising. It seems more elegant just to say, just let the things, you know, cover heaven and earth. For me. For me. I don't know. I thought that was interesting, huh? I've got me too. For me. But there is this kind of like personal thing that each Buddha actually has a personal problem with us, you know. Each Buddha personally needs us to get it together. And they're all personally saying, would you please do me, Buddha so-and-so, a favor and do the practice? Because like, you know, I need you, I personally need you to do it.

[85:14]

And just the fact that all the other Buddhas need you too doesn't like relieve me. Just like each of you is responsible for everything, but that doesn't mean like the rest of us aren't just because you are. That kind of thing. But, you know, maybe there's also some petty ways to see it, too. I tend to give these guys the benefit of the doubt. Let's see, who else was ever ahead of those two people? Was there somebody else ahead? Oh, you, yeah, you then, then those people, yes. I remember when I first, I'm going back to intoxicants. Okay. When I was first studying the three selves, I was also reading the poetry of Ryokan. And I just remember thinking, is this guy a lusher? What? You know, I really was questioning that in regard to intoxication. Hi, Stella. Hmm? Yes? I'm sorry, I... Yeah, you thought, you said, is the real kind of lusher what? Yeah, and so I thought about it a lot.

[86:15]

I thought about his poetry and what he was doing and... And I found myself starting to judge him. And I thought, you know, the whole universe is pretty intoxicating. Your relationship to it is one of getting intoxicated. Right. The whole universe is intoxicating, and what you want to do is get intoxicated. And so I really stopped thinking of him that way. As a lush? Yeah. Good idea. But it just seems to me that it's very confusing to kind of, when you're studying the precepts, to think of it, to think of the intoxication as being things that you ingest that chemically alter you, when it's just such a small part of the intoxicating universe. She feels like it's a little misleading or a little confusing to think of intoxication just in terms of these things you ingest when it's an intoxicating universe.

[87:20]

Well, yes, because it seems like oftentimes the line of questioning is, well, is it okay for me to drink? Yeah, right. Or is it okay for me to take LSD? Mm-hmm. Because I really want to do that because I think it will somehow be beneficial to me, but the rule seems to say that it's not okay. Right. And so there seems to be so much focus on that when you could look up at the Milky Way and that could be intoxicating. Yes. And it would be any different from a chemical substance? Well, to say that it wouldn't be any different is carrying things a bit far. In terms of being intoxicating? Well, I think it is a little different. But you didn't get drunk drinking all that sake? No, but I think if you want to get drunk and you use chemicals, I think the effect is different than if you want to get drunk and you use the sky. Maybe. I think so. It's my experience. If I want to get drunk and use a face or a sky, usually it just lasts for a second. And then if I look away from the sky, it's over.

[88:22]

Whereas if you use a chemical, after it's over, it lasts for a long time, sometimes for weeks. So it's heavier to use the chemicals. It's just heavier. It's more gross. So the precepts are kind of like putting the grossest out there. That's all. I think you're right. We don't want to skip over the grossest and mention the most subtle, except to the people who are ready to deal with the most subtle. But it really does come down to that when you see a face, that you don't like, you know, wish the face was a little bit, had a little bit more of colors. You don't, you know, you see the autumn colors, you don't wish that they were a little brighter or the moon was a little fuller. It comes down to like that kind of thing. Basha and who else?

[89:24]

Was there somebody in between Basha and Daniel? No? Basha? That sort of leads right into my question is that I find myself often looking at something and wishing that it was more or less than what it is. There's awareness. Yeah, there's awareness. And yet I get that awareness a lot. Especially lately I've been really seeing that that's sort of how I've run my life in a big way. Good, that's awareness. I'm complimenting you on awareness. Thank you. Okay, well that's just like I like it. But, like, with the story that you told, and you said, for me, when, it wasn't Schweikmann, it was... Janto. Janto said, for me, now, is it, Is it because he really wasn't attached that he could say, I want you to be different from me?

[90:30]

I mean, it sounds to me like he was sort of saying, I want you to be different so that you can spread it out to, you know, everything. Oh, I didn't understand him saying, I want you to be different. Well, okay, see, the way I was hearing it was that he wanted him to wake up or to see the Buddha that he was already. for me the Buddha point of view is you want somebody to wake up but you don't want them to be different so if they're sleeping and you want them to wake up isn't that different pardon if they're sleeping and you want them to wake up isn't that wanting them to be different I can see if they're asleep and you want them to wake up that someone would think that you want them to be different okay But I'm saying that you can want somebody to be a way that they are not now and still appreciate the way they are right now and not want that to go away. But appreciate them, really appreciate them for what they are now.

[91:32]

Just like it's possible to look at the moon and appreciate it for the way it is and wish the moon will be happy and enlightened and become Buddha without wishing the moon would change.

[91:45]

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