The story about the monk called Darshan of Virtue Mountain. We came up to the place where he came to visit Dragon Pond, right? And he said, I've heard long about Dragon Pond. I've long heard of Dragon Pond. But now that I've arrived, I don't see the dragon or the pond. And then Dragon Pond steps out and said, Thus, you have really arrived at Dragon Pond. I just might say, when you come to Dragon Pond and you don't see the dragon or the pond, that's really meeting Dragon Pond. So at that point after he said that in Dragon Pond, said, you know, you've really arrived in Dragon Pond, Darshan said, Darshan bowed and withdrew from the presence of the teacher.

[01:20]

And that night he went back and stood in attendance with Dragon Pond. And at some point, Dragon Pond said, it's getting late. Perhaps you should go. So then he raised the curtains in the room and stepped outside. And it was really dark. So he came back in and he said, it's dark out there. And Dragon Pond lit a paper lantern and gave it to him. And as Darshan was receiving the paper lantern, Dragon Pond blew it out. And Darshan was awakened.

[02:25]

One might say he was awakened to the nature of mind. And he became an adept at the school of heretics, sometimes called Zen school. And then again he bowed to Dragon Pond. And Dragon Pond said, What have you seen that you bow now? And Dashan said, From now on, I will never again doubt what's on the tongues.

[03:32]

of the venerable teachers of the world. The next day, Dragon Pond went up to the teaching hall and said to the monks, there is one among you whose teeth are like a forest of swords and whose mouth is like a bowl of blood. even if you hit him with a staff, he wouldn't turn back. Another day he will ascend the summit of a solitary peak and establish my path there." Dilshan then took all his commentaries out in front of the teaching hall and raised a torch over them declaring, even to plumb the abstruse locutions is like a single hair in the great void.

[04:45]

To exhaust the essential workings of the world is like a drop of water cast into the vast valley. Then he burned his commentaries and departed. Later he heard about Guishan, that his teaching was flourishing in China. So he decided to go visit him. But now he was visiting, as I said, as an adept of the school in which Guishan taught. So he comes to see Guishan and without even taking off his traveling pack he went into the hall where Guishan was and he walked back and forth from east to west, west to east.

[06:04]

Teaching halls are usually in Zen oriented towards the south. So he came in and he walked east to west, west to east with his backpack on. He looked around and then he said, nothing, no one. And then he went out. The commentator says, tell me, what was his meaning? Was he crazy? One of the ancestors of this lineage is named Eihei Dogen.

[07:13]

He's called the founder of this lineage in Japan. And he said one time, in this lifetime it would be good if you made a copy of the Lotus Sutra and also if you carved a statue of a Buddha. So I'd like to today celebrate that one of our practitioners has completed copying the Lotus Sutra, and it's up on the altar there next to the Perfection of Wisdom. the ancient practice of copying the Lotus Sutra is still alive in this world. I'm very happy. You're all invited to make a copy of the Lotus Sutra. And I wonder, what do you think of the teaching that to the extent that perfect wisdom is a word,

[08:27]

to that extent is it perfect wisdom. And to the extent that perfect wisdom is perfect wisdom, it is to that extent a word. Another way to say it is, when perfect wisdom is a word, it is perfect wisdom. When perfect wisdom is perfect wisdom, it is a word. But the way the sutra says this is to the extent. So it kind of allows that, you know, we couldn't, maybe we're not quite there yet. Yeah, perfect wisdom isn't quite yet, it's not really to the extent of completely being perfect wisdom.

[09:31]

But when it's completely perfect wisdom, when perfect wisdom is completely perfect wisdom, it is completely a word. And when perfect wisdom is completely a word and nothing more, It is completely perfect wisdom. But it's hard for us to get to that extent. I think it would be easy for us to understand that it might be hard to get our wisdom, our perfect wisdom, to be really completely perfect wisdom. But another way is, can you see how hard it is for us to have perfect wisdom be just a word, to go all the way there? It's kind of hard. Couldn't it be just a little bit different from just a word? Well, yes, it can be. But then it's a little bit different from perfect wisdom. Can I make a little bargain with that? Yes, you can. So what do you think of that teaching?

[10:32]

Yeah. Because I think that what the meaning that we impute or put on top of that word or associate with that word is subjective. So then it's not perfect wisdom. Right. That's right. But when perfect wisdom is just the imputation that you put on, to that extent it's perfect wisdom. So we get to use words to understand perfect wisdom. But again, there's a limit to the way we use the words. And what's the limit of the way we use words? What's the limitation on them? The extent to which we substantiate them. Yeah? And how do you substantiate them? Huh?

[11:38]

Yeah, we think they're not a word, right. Or we think that they have a referent and that the referent proves that they're substantial. So we can use language, but if we use it this other way of connecting the word, connecting the word, drawing the thread out from the word to the object, that's not the way that will help us understand perfect wisdom. But there is a way we can use words to understand it and that's the way we use the word and stop there and look at how does this word function rather than what does it get connected to to be real. Over and above the reality of how it functions and it functions in a certain way. That's the conventional reality. What do you think of that teaching? I ask again. Did you change the time on the clock?

[12:40]

I did. Yeah, she changed it. So did we lose an hour when you did that? So what time is it? 5.15. It's 5.15. We have 15 minutes, unfortunately. Did you say unfortunately? Before I said it, you didn't say it? She said 14 minutes. She said 14 minutes. I thought you said unfortunately. Yes? He said nobody, nothing. Actually, he said nothing, nobody. Nothing, nobody. Yeah. He said that in the presence of the great teacher. Yes. Sanity. Actually, he said nothing, no one. Yes? Sanity. Sanity? Yeah.

[13:42]

This is sanity. It's rare, right? Yeah, it's rare. Rare and wonderful. Also, I just wanted to tell you that this guy named Dushan, he became famous for saying something like, if you speak, you deserve 30 blows. If you don't speak, you deserve 30 blows. And I recently was introduced to the idea of what 30 blows means. But 30 blows means you deserve the gift of the truth.

[14:44]

You deserve the great kindness of all the Buddhas. If you speak, you deserve it. If you don't speak, you deserve it. And the way Dushanth put it was 30 blows. If you speak, you deserve my whole life effort. to help you realize the truth. And if you don't speak, before you speak, you don't speak, and then you deserve the same thing. So, as Darshan says, you deserve, all of you deserve the real truth and nothing but the truth, no matter what you do. How about you?

[15:44]

What do you have to say? There's 12 minutes left now. Yes, yes. Yes, yes. Ladies first. I'm thinking about a word. You think about a word? And I'm hearing some teaching about inquiry around the use of the word. Inquiry around the use of the word, correct. And as I inquire, I find a couple of directions of meaning. One, it has sort of a lateral feeling to it, where the usefulness It comes throughout the subject and with the elaborations and so forth. And then the other is more vertical that, for me, sort of points to what is the intention underneath the usefulness of the word.

[16:58]

And in that Intention is a possibility of a vow that gives rise to a word. And that makes me think about how usefulness is also like ceremony. And it's ceremony in a ceremony of words. that every thought, action and spoken word is a ceremony of some sort and that it is worthy of inquiry as to the intention underneath that ceremony.

[18:04]

What about that ceremony? that it's worthy of investigation into the intention around the ceremony. Yes, and also you can investigate the intention of the teachings. And part of the way you might discover the intention of the teachings is by investigating the way the words are used in the teaching, because the intention is not the way the words are expressed. But by studying the way the words are expressed, you get to the intention, and the intention is inexpressible. But although the intention is inexpressible, the inexpressible can talk. And then we study how the inexpressible is talking as a way to realize the inexpressible.

[19:12]

And that's the only way to realize it. You can't realize the inexpressible by the inexpressible. We must use the conventional to realize the ultimate. When we rely on the conventional, we can receive the teaching of the ultimate. And the teaching of the ultimate is what liberates beings. Can you tell me your name again? Breton. Breton? Yes, Breton. In my spiritual seeking, I really enjoy the idea of the world and all physical things coming into existence through spoken word. And it seems like your teachings today are exploring what the power of the word is and how it comes close or it fails at revealing the perfect wisdom.

[20:23]

And some spiritual teachers have put out the idea that The goal of humanity is to reach a point where our use of words can reveal and express our highest creativity and bring things into being, into life through the way we speak our words. Yeah. Buddhas, awakened beings, speak and it brings their enlightenment into existence. Even though their enlightenment is not in existence, their speech can bring the enlightenment into existence in the form of instructions to other people of how to be enlightened. Last time we were here, you were talking about the Buddha Mind seal and studying the mind.

[21:35]

Yeah. And now we're talking about studying the way words work. That's another way of saying it. Uh-huh, yeah. The Buddha Mind seal is to study the mind. The Buddha Mind's death seal, what's being transmitted is pointing to the mind. You study the mind and then you see its nature. Studying words is studying the mind. Studying mind is studying words. You might want to study the mind that wasn't words. It's just that the way to study the mind that isn't words is by studying the mind that is words. Yes. This afternoon in your words, it feels so like freedom. We're talking about freedom.

[22:35]

Yeah, we're talking about freedom. Freedom, not this, not that, yes, this, yes, that, neither this nor that, both this and that. That came up for me when you're saying perfection of wisdom is a word, but it's not the referent. What we think we're talking about is not the referent. It's not that the perfection of wisdom is the word. I thought you said that earlier. It's that perfection of wisdom is a word. Is a word. It's a word. It's not the word. It's just a word. It's different than the perfection of stupidity. That's another worry. It's not the perfection... But when you say the perfection of stupidity, you might also think that refers to something. That's not the way to use that term. You shouldn't use the word perfection of stupidity thinking that it refers to some object. That way of using the perfection of stupidity word will not take you to the perfection of wisdom word.

[23:36]

But if you deal with the perfection of stupidity understanding that it doesn't have a referent, then you might be able to shift over and do the same with the perfection of wisdom. And this teaching is for people who are looking, who are listening to the suffering of the world. We should be listening to that. We should listen to the word suffering. Listen to the word pain. We should practice with the word suffering. Practice with the words. We should hear all those cries. then this teaching will be appropriate to those who are listening and caring for this, who hear the cries and wish beings to be free and realize, in order to do that, they have to realize that there's no beings beyond the word being.

[24:41]

No beings exist apart from giving them the word beings. We have to do that if we want to help them. And we do want to help them. We have to keep in touch with them if we do want to help. And that's a big job. Because we sometimes think we have other things to do. And those beings are asking us to do something. But don't do that. Do this. Don't just be concerned for my welfare. Do this. I don't want you to do that. It's hard not to be caught by the words. As we say, even a highly evolved person is still turned around in the flow of words, in the river, in the stream of words. They do turn us. We have to learn how to stay with the word and not lose track that this has no reference while the word is spinning us around.

[25:44]

I just want to say also that... Well, maybe I'll let Breck speak before I talk. Yes, Breck? Yes. Right. Well, he was turned. The story is the monk was blamed, was criticized, and he was criticized for something which, in some sense, the words say, he was falsely criticized, he was falsely accused.

[26:46]

Those are the words. And then he was correctly praised. Those are the words. But I think he was turned by the words. But while he was being turned, he was saying in Osso Descaminis, is that so? He was turned by the words, but he kept wondering, and kept watching the words, and I don't think he was disoriented while he was turning. I don't think he was into like, well, they're saying this and that's false, and that's the way it makes sense to me. They're saying this, I didn't do that, that's false, they hate me, and so on. He was in there being turned, but I think he didn't think that that situation was referring to something other than that, what he was going through. So when it happened the other way, he's praised, and that makes sense that they would praise me because now they found out that they were misled and so on.

[27:49]

He was being turned around that, but he also didn't think that that referred to something. So he can say the same thing in both cases. Is that so? No, is that so? Is this so? Is this so? Is this so? All day long, no matter how much we get spun around, We don't think that the spinning, which only exists because we give a word to the spinning, refers to something other than the way the words work. And he learned that. And when I saw him, when I saw the demonstration, I thought, I would like to learn that. And I still would. And at the beginning of the day, I had a thought. What a wonderful group of people. And then I had another thought, but I didn't want to say it until later. And now I think you're ready for it.

[28:51]

What a wonderful group of people. What a wonderful group of people. What did you say? What a wonderful group of people. Yeah, what a wonderful group of people. We can say it three times, right? As no wonderful group of people does the Tathagata teach. Therefore we say, what a wonderful group of people. Thank you very much. That's a Diamond Sutra. And this is a clock. This is a clock. And as no clock is this taught by the Tathagata, therefore I say, this is a clock. And it's very precious, so be careful. Thank you very much.

[29:43]

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