They give me a muffin for giving the talk. Is there anything you'd like to discuss? Yes. Do you want to come up and talk to me? Did you say, do you have to? No, you don't have to. Do you want to come up here and sit here? You would? You're welcome to come, you don't have to go. Here, for you. Take your time. Did you come with Priya? What's your name? Yes, welcome. Thank you.

[01:03]

What can I do for you? I'm very happy with your lesson today because I constantly try to, I'm not going to hear what I hear part and a lot, but I attach to as hard as I can. That's normal. So I guess my question is how, what good way to practice The detachment or not... One way is, since you got the part about carrying down, maybe almost to be too much, like I just thought of my granddaughter, okay? I care about her. You know, my granddaughter's name is Frankie.

[02:06]

I see this beautiful little girl who I care about. So I just, when I look at her, I can remember the teaching. There's nothing more to her. I wouldn't say there's nothing more to her. There's no reality behind the words, adorable little girl. There's no reality behind that. There's just adorable little girl. And I care for adorable little girl. Or sometimes... Here's another joke. You don't call girls bossy anymore. Call them leaders. Okay? So there's no reality behind this small female leader. She's my leader, right? When I'm with her. There's no reality behind leader. That helps bring me upright with her.

[03:10]

Not to care too much. if she switches from reader to something else. So if you look at them, they're beautiful. You can even say so beautiful, but there's not a reality behind so beautiful. That's all the word is, is so beautiful. And the meaning of that is other words about what so beautiful means. There's not a so beautiful behind that. So you can be devoted to the so beautiful person or garden or whatever, and just remember there's no reality behind so beautiful. There's no expectation. Exactly. Thank you. I feel like I got that. And you said, look at that, right there it was. I feel like I got it. That's who you are right now. And there's nothing, there's no reality behind I feel like I got it.

[04:14]

There's no reality behind that. That's who you are. Those words. And then you don't abide in you either. But we have to train ourselves to not get caught. I just heard this story in the parking lot about somebody did something, which made me sad. And I was actually sad because I kind of believed there was some reality behind the story. It is a sad story. But I can also be upright with that story without thinking that there's a reality behind it. It's just that that story is being told. I hear it. And I'm going to just let it be that. And I'll take care of that. And then we'll see what happens next. So what you said was the second example. Do the same thing with yourself as you do with your words about other people. Yeah, I will too.

[05:15]

Thank you for your question. Thank you for listening so deeply. Anything else? While I eat my muffins? No. Does this work? This one too. Anything else you'd like to bring up today? Pardon? I need to go get something. Okay, thank you. Yes? Want to come up? Want to come up? You can sit. So tell me your name again.

[06:19]

Zalika. Zalika. And here is Kriya. Woohoo. Hi. Hi. Thanks for your talk. You're welcome. I don't expect you to have the answer to this. Okay. But... I've had a couple situations where I have deep appreciation for the idea of somebody and feedback that I'm getting by exploring new people, meeting new people, is that I am just too much. Like I'm too intense, I'm too expressive, I'm too, you know, and I just, I can't imagine being any other way. I want to, I guess, continue to be enthusiastic and be okay with others not being okay with my too muchness.

[07:35]

Or should I be? I don't know. That's it. So I hear, you're too much. I hear those words. So for me at this time, what I'm seeing, you're too much could be something that I heard somebody say about me, or it could be something I'm saying about somebody else. Or it could also be something that I'm saying about myself. So I could be walking down the street and a thought could arise in my mind, Reb, you're too much. And at that moment, that's what I'm saying to myself. Another way to say it is, maybe a better way to start with is, I'm too much.

[08:41]

And start with that, start with myself, I'm too much. And who I am is somebody who's thinking that right now. That's who I am. But it's not that there's a reality of me being too much. It's just that who I am is I'm thinking that. But that's who I am. I'm thinking I'm too much or I'm thirsty. Now if I think you're too much about somebody else, that's what I think they are. And what I think they are is those words. But there's no reality of them being what those words are saying. I'm just a person who thinks that. But there's no reality of them being that way. But it's not that there's no connection between them and my words, because they make me. And if somebody says to me, if I hear somebody say, you're too much, I listen to that, and I care for that,

[09:47]

And I want to not abide in that. And if I abide in it, I would like to confess, I think I just abided in that. So, it's possible somebody comes up to me and says, you gave a good talk, or you gave a below average talk. I hear that, and I can take care of that and listen to that respectfully, and I can dwell in it or not. And if I dwell in it, I think I can kind of sense some stress around my relationship to those words. If I'm open to them and don't dwell, I feel like this is the way I want to live. is to be open to you telling me that was not a good talk or that was a good talk. So when you said I got a lot out of it, I barely had time to see if I dwelled in anything there.

[11:02]

But that's what I'm trying to do. So when people tell you you're too much, be respectful of that. be generous with that, be careful with that, be patient with that, and then look to see. You're caring for it well, maybe, and are you abiding in what they're saying about you? Because somebody could say, you know, there is this expression, right? You're too much, which means I want to hang out with you all the time. You're too much. That's one of the meanings, right? Right? Sometimes it's like a compliment. You're too much. Or you're funny. But if they say, you're too intense and I'm not going to relate to you anymore. And you say, I hear you. But that doesn't mean they're going to not relate to you. That just means that's what they're saying and you listen to that. Whenever you listen to what somebody says about you,

[12:10]

it changes you. And the way you listen also changes you accordingly. Whenever you listen to something and reject it, that changes you. Whenever you listen to something and affirm it, that changes you. But that affirmation and rejection, they tend to change you in a way that reinforces ignorance. that reinforces abiding. If you listen to people and practice non-abiding, that changes you to promote you to not abide and further talk so that you can listen and not abide and speak and not abide and listen and not abide and speak and not abide. And if you're actually achieving non-abiding, you do not dwell in achieving non-abiding. You know, you just were successful and you don't dwell on it and move on to the next challenge, which is the next word or whatever.

[13:21]

So the bodhisattva does not dwell or mull over that they just were successful at not dwelling. They just try to do it again. They aspire to do it again and again and again. And we do it again and again. Even if we get good at it, we keep doing it again and again because every time we do it, we show somebody else how to do it, which is really the point. So a couple of examples come up. There's two that come to my mind just now. Want to hear them? One is the story which I've told many, many times that I heard like 50 years ago. It's a story about it. a Japanese Zen teacher named Hakuin. And he lived near the Pacific side of the island, the main island, near a fishing village. And one time a girl in the village became pregnant and she told her parents that he was the father. And they came to him and they denied any goodness in him.

[14:34]

they really demeaned him and degraded him and depreciated him. They really thought he was a bad Zen priest. He shouldn't be having sex with people, unless he had a proper relationship with them. Certainly not young girls in the village. So they really said, you're a total disgrace to Buddha's teaching, and none of that, but when the baby was born, they're going to give it to him, and he can take care of it. And he said in Japanese, which means, is that so? It's like when somebody says, I don't know what, So-and-so did such and such. You say, oh, is that so? So-and-so did well. Oh, is that so? So-and-so did not do so well. Oh, is that so? Just like, is that so? And then, I think maybe two years later, the girl told the parents that actually he wasn't the father, somebody else was.

[15:39]

And they came back to him. And they highly praised him. They exalted him as a great teacher who not only did not you know, hate them for treating him that way. But he took care of their grandchild for two years. He, with the aid of a wet nurse, took care of the grandchild. And then they really appreciated him. And he said, So I thought it was pretty good to be insulted and just come back with a kind of like a balanced, I hear you. But what really got me was that he did the same thing when praised. And when I heard that, I thought, I want to learn that. So he showed me. There's this language. It's about language. And he's hearing that, and there's no reality behind it for him. So he just deals with it like, oh, this is happening. These words are happening.

[16:41]

And he didn't reject him, and he didn't affirm him. And the baby came and didn't reject her from it, he just took care of it without abiding in the baby. And then the same when they praised him, the same thing. And I thought, that's it. That's what I want to learn. And a few years ago I was in a... I was in a koan class, a class here at Green Gulch, and one of the students told me during the class, he said, I was talking about you, I confessed that I was talking about you at the dinner table downstairs... And I told the people at the table that I thought you were a crappy teacher. And when I heard that, I just joyfully laughed. And I was very happy that I didn't abide in being a good teacher and I didn't abide in being a crappy teacher. And I really felt good that he could say that about me. And I could just like go, wow, is that so?

[17:45]

You said that. That was nice. So I'm learning a little bit about what I want to learn. And then he followed up by saying, but then after that I said, but he's a great student. And I And that one I abided in. So some people actually are pretty good at not abiding in insults, but they abide in praise. Some people don't abide in praise, but they abide in insults. What we're trying to learn is not to abide in either. But again, not by closing our ears and turning away or dissociating, but really deeply listen to people. bodhisattva of great compassion is called the one who listens but she doesn't dwell in what she hears she hears the cries of the world but she doesn't dwell in them she hears oh you're the greatest bodhisattva in Marin County you know she doesn't dwell in that you're like not doing a bodhisattva job you're really cruel she doesn't dwell in that but she hears it deeply

[18:55]

Okay? So as a bodhisattva, when people tell you you're too much, you're too energetic, you're too beautiful, you're too smart, you're too intense, those are the cries of the world to listen to. And don't dwell. And if you don't dwell, your response will be wise. I don't know what it will be. You might say, you know, I'm thinking of having a lobotomy. And now that you've said that, I think I'm going to go ahead with the operation. And they can say, good, that's really a good idea. You say, but I don't have any health tests. It's going to take a while for me to save up the money. And they say, well, I'll give you the money. You know, in other words, you can come back with some wisdom. Like Cyrano de Bergerac, you know, when he got insulted for his long nose.

[20:03]

You know that part? Somebody said, your nose, sir, is rather large. And he said, large? Is that all you can say? Why don't you say it's a peninsula? You know, and so on. You don't reject it. You don't affirm it. You play with it when you're wise. And you show people how to not abide in what they say about you. You know, you think I'm intense? Let's work with that, shall we? Come and be friends with this intense person that's just too intense. Come on, you can do it. Okay? Yeah. I'll try to listen to you, too. The hot seat. Do I get up after I've done my question and answer? You could. Eventually you probably should leave there because that's my seat.

[21:05]

Tomorrow morning. Move because I'm going to sit there. It's nice to have you here. I think people appreciate you sitting in that seat. I'm not dwelling in that seat. Anything else this afternoon? Yes? Well, I have several... I have a question that I... Things that you said in the talk made me think of various things and... you know, some quotes and things, but one was when you were saying about not having a self-based size, like you were just this human being who was tired and... But I wasn't even a human being. That was not part... All I was... All that I was was, I'm tired. I wasn't a human being in addition to that. I wasn't a man. I wasn't a woman. I wasn't a frog. That's all I was. Now I could vibrate away from that and make more of it, but making more would be just more pictures of who I was.

[22:13]

But at that moment the only picture of me was, I'm tired. It was like a complete rendition of me. And it was just words. But it wasn't like, well, those didn't fully account with me. I was like completely, I'm... It wasn't like I was completely tired. I was completely, I'm tired. But nothing more. Not human, not... Just that. It was so sincere. Or it was so concentrated. It was amazingly compacted around those words. But I didn't feel like something was missing or I should be more of a person than that. It was really satisfying. And human beings can talk, so they can be like, I'm tired, or I'm good, or I'm right, or I'm wrong. But again, if you say, I'm wrong, if I say I'm wrong, and I don't go behind that to some reality, then we have perfect wisdom.

[23:21]

To the extent that I'm wrong is just a word, to that extent it's perfect wisdom. If you make more of it, to the extent you make more of it, you erode perfect wisdom. So my question, and this is of all the things that someone will give, the question is like I remember it, trying to understand the little treatise, I guess you call it, Time Being. So one was saying that... Because I was discussing the concept of time, you know, past. What we say is, oh, time has passed, you know. is that if you're, if, say you have lunch at 12.30, it's 12.30 because you're having lunch, you're sort of, that's all there is, it's really just you follow the schedule, being there on time, and that there isn't then an addition. So it's part of what you're saying. Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. To the extent that time is a word, it is perfect wisdom.

[24:23]

To the extent that perfect wisdom is just a word, it is perfect wisdom. Any other offerings? Yes. I've never used one of these before. What do you do with it? It's up to you. If you'd like any help, I would suggest holding it like that. This way? Okay. I'm having trouble... I'm getting confused between... Okay. I'm having trouble. Does that account for you at that moment? Yes. Good. Okay. So being wholehearted, I've been practicing that.

[25:25]

And I'm wondering how... You said you... Like if I drink a cup of water, I'm drinking a cup of water, and I'm wholeheartedly drinking this cup of water. Yeah. I'm not doing anything else. Yeah. I'm not even there. I mean, there's just nothing there. The cup's not there, I'm not there. Well... It's just totally engrossed in drinking the water. It could be that. Am I abiding in it? I would say that wholeheartedly drinking water is instruction for non-abiding. And you can also say, I'm not even there. But in fact, if there's just an expression, wholeheartedly drinking water, The structure of language is such that the structure of the event has an I in it. Wholeheartedly drinking water, when it appears in consciousness, there is an I in parentheses. It is not a self there participating in that activity.

[26:30]

It's not consciousness. So whether you say, I'm wholeheartedly drinking, or whether you say, I'm drinking, And you can say, I'm drinking water. And you can say that or think that wholeheartedly, and then that's perfection of wisdom. If you think there's something more to your life than, at that moment, what you're saying, and more reality to your life than that, then you veer away from perfect wisdom. And supporting perfect wisdom gives a checklist Okay. Karen is a recently retired nurse, right? Right. Yeah. She used to work in a hospital? Clinic, yeah. Clinic. And nowadays, in some medical clinics and hospitals, they have checklists, they have procedures which they go through, which they find are quite helpful.

[27:32]

She's making a face. And my checklist is, I see the face she's making. But anyway, when you're trying to be wholehearted, you can use a checklist just to check on yourself. Is there generosity? Like, I'm drinking water. Is there generosity there? Is there ethics? Are you being careful? Are you being patient? Are you being diligent? Are you concentrated and relaxed? So you do the checklist. You might or might not do the checklist, but if you want to know, I'm not sure you should say know exactly, but if you want to just sort of like exercise wholeheartedness, sometimes that checklist helps. But you don't have to go through the checklist. You can just say, I am drinking water. And then the ultimate test of whether you're wholehearted is, do you think there's something more to I at that moment than, quotes, I'm drinking water. If you do, there's probably some shortcoming in your wholeheartedness.

[28:42]

when there's just saying I'm drinking water and there's no further reality than I'm drinking water. In other words, when I'm drinking water, when I'm saying that, when that totally accounts for my life at that moment, and I don't think that that's anything more than a word, then we have perfect wisdom. But if I think that's referring to something, rather than just a word, then I'm adding something. Yeah. Any other questions or comments? Yes. Can I say something about what? Taking care of yourself? I heard you say, say something about taking care of yourself.

[30:02]

I heard that part. Saving my life? So I take care of myself and save my life. I actually save my life. I don't know what save my life means. The thing I want to do with my life is I want to live it fully. And it's changing all the time. I keep getting new life deliveries every moment. So I'm trying to keep up with my new life and take care of it in such a way that it's unlimited, unbounded, inexhaustible. That's why I'm trying to take care of it in that way. And that, I believe, I trust that that will liberate my life from any hindrance.

[31:06]

will liberate my life from dwelling, will open my life to perfect wisdom, which will liberate my life. So I'm trying to be generous and careful and patient and diligent with the life that's being given. And I'm kind of there with the life that's being given. and I'm not separate from the life that's being given, and being not separate from the life that's given, I find liberating. And I wish to continue that. You're welcome. You're welcome. Yes? Since we're focusing on semantics, I was just curious if you were using abide in a way that you're framing as distinct from attachment.

[32:08]

I'm using it as... It's kind of a synonym for attachment. Non-abiding... You're treating them as... Yeah, pretty much. Non-attachment is non-abiding. Non-abiding. But again, I point out again and again that detachment... or non-attachment, does not mean dissociation. So detachment does not mean no attachment. Like I can attach my hands to this muffin and be detached. Or also, as she said, non-discrimination is another word for not abiding. So I see a man, or I see a woman, and I don't abide in either, if I'm practicing wisdom.

[33:11]

And that way, I don't really discriminate between them. But I can also see, that's a man, and that's a woman, [...] and that's a man, and that's a woman. But if I don't abide in my discrimination, that's called non-discrimination. To be really good and careful and diligent and ethical with your discriminations is to be wholehearted with them. So I wholeheartedly discriminate and realize not abiding in discrimination, which we call non-discrimination. I wholeheartedly practice discrimination and then I don't abide in discrimination. and not abiding in discrimination, I use it like, it's not too hot today. But that's an opportunity to be wholehearted, to say that kind of thing.

[34:16]

Not like, okay, I'm not going to wholeheartedly say it's not too hot today. But if it was super hot, I'd say, it's really hot today, I'll say that wholeheartedly. No. Every word is a discrimination. And every word you can abide in, and if you abide in, it's a discrimination. But it's not wisdom just to discriminate. Wisdom is to wholeheartedly discriminate. And wholeheartedly discriminating, you don't abide in discrimination. And that's called wisdom. It's also called non-discrimination. Attachment. To wholeheartedly practice attaching to a place. To wholeheartedly practice washing dishes means that you discriminate between this dish which has these little scallops in it and a dish that doesn't have the scallops.

[35:19]

By wholeheartedly discriminating between the scalloped dishes and the non-scalloped dishes, I don't abide in discrimination. That's called non-discrimination. By wholeheartedly attaching to this plate, I don't abide in attaching to this plate. That's the exercise. Get it? And it's hard to do it with everything, you know? Because every moment there's some words and you're like being lazy or you're being diligent. And a lot of times you think, well, I don't have to pay attention to every word I say. Well, you don't have to, but you could aspire to that. So would it be fair to say that all words have sort of equal power or equal... power is not quite the right word, but equal impact or equal ability to alter our framing?

[36:21]

All words have equal ability to awaken perfect wisdom. And when perfect wisdom, all words are inexhaustible and immeasurable. So two words that are both inexhaustible and immeasurable are basically the same. And you open to that by practicing with all words the same way, namely, wholeheartedly. Every word offers the opportunity for wholehearted practice, for non-abiding, for perfect wisdom. And one short version of that is, every word is just a word, including perfect wisdom, wholehearted, Buddha, and what's your name? Eric. Eric is just a word. I'm not saying you're just a word. You're, you are, is a word.

[37:25]

I'm not saying you're just a word, I'm just saying the word Eric is just a word. People might think, well, Buddha's not just a word, or good's not just a word. And some people might say Eric's not just a word, Eric's a person. Eric can be the identity of a person. But the immeasurableness of this person is not the word Eric. The immeasurableness of this person is that Eric is just a word. The word Eric is just a word. But when I say Eric is just a word, I don't mean you're just a word. I mean Eric is just a word. I could say to Martha, Eric is just a word. It's the same. But if I say to you, Eric, it's just a word, you say, wait a minute. You might, I mean. Or if I say to a Buddhist, Buddha's just a word, they say, wait a minute.

[38:27]

Buddha's more than just a word. It's subtle. It's subtle. Perfect wisdom is subtle. And it's hard to, you know, be present and still with that subtleness. But not impossible. And if you want to be a bodhisattva, this is an opportunity for you. Eric. I think I'd like to add or ask or say something to that. I'm having a little issue, I think, with the word love then. Because love to me... Yeah, there you go, love. It... Isn't there that song, love is just a four-letter word? Anyway, and then there's also a song, love is just another word for what? For nothing. Yeah.

[39:29]

Well, love too. Freedom, just another word for nothing left to lose. Love is just another word for nothing left to lose. What were you going to say? She had a problem with love. Issue with love. With the word love. You're not okay with love. It's the word love. Yeah. Because when I think of the word love just by itself, I attach things to it. Like when I think of the word love, it means affection. You attach things to it, okay? And the things you attach to it, there's two things you can attach to it. One of the things you can attach to it are other words. And if you attach other words to it, you can get meaning for the word love. But the thing that we're trying to try not to attach to it is don't attach a reality to it. I think that's where I'm having problems.

[40:30]

That's where the problem lies. So one time I was giving a talk right in this room, and I somehow found myself quite early in the talk, I said I wanted to talk about love. I told people I came here and I wanted to say something about love, but as I was about to say it, I realized I didn't know what love was. And I said, but I also realized I can keep talking about it. I don't have to know what it is to talk about it. But to talk about love and think that I know what that word's about, that's not the path of wisdom. It's to say, I want to talk about love and I don't know what it is and I would like to talk about it some more. May I? May I? No, I can't? Well, one person says, okay, thank you. I'm shaking my head, yes. Yeah, so we can talk. I read another book one time. It was written by a mathematician. He was talking about consciousness. He says, we don't know what consciousness is, but we can still talk about it.

[41:33]

And then he continued to write the book he wrote about it. So we can talk about love, but remember that it's just talk. The word love is just talk. But we can then talk about it with words. And we can see if we get caught by the words, and if we do, well, we're caught. If we don't get caught, then we're using the word love in relationship to other words in a way that promotes wisdom. Various people have different words where they say, wait a minute, this one, I can't not get stuck on this one. I got to know what this one means. In other words, there's got to be a reality behind this word. And that's, okay, there it is, I'm stuck, I'm abiding. Okay, well, just be kind to that. And again, I'm abiding is another thing to do the same thing with. Is there a reality behind I'm abiding? Well, Nobody is really abiding.

[42:36]

If anybody says, I'm abiding, there's no reality behind that. But easy to think there is. Easy to think there's reality behind the words. And we know how to do that, to imagine that. Words are just unreal images. That's all they are. But they come together to make meaning, and we like that, and it's very useful. And in Zen we don't avoid using them to play with creating meaning, like, I'm thirsty. That can be quite useful. It can be useful to get a drink of water, and it can be useful to check to see if we're practicing perfect wisdom. It can be useful to having lunch, helping people across the street, changing diapers, driving a car. All this stuff can be useful in those ways, but also can be used to test to see any abiding.

[43:40]

And you can also drive the car and change the diapers without abiding in the words that you use to do it. Anything else today? Yes. Yes. Could you come up here, please? Yes. Come over here. I have a microphone for you. Thank you. You're welcome. I met an old friend out there, so I got here a little bit late. So I'm sorry if this has already been addressed. I just wanted to see if you could help me understand Going to the care bearer land of care a lot. So if I care deeply about a person, but I don't want to abide in them, I don't want to be too attached. Are we talking about sort of the notion of unconditional love? Like I love them no matter what, and even if they disappear, I'll still be okay.

[44:42]

I'm still... whole. And I think maybe this also gets to the question about taking care of myself versus taking care of others. Not versus. It's not versus. You do need things from people. As a matter of fact, as you meditate on how part of Part of what's the reality that's revealed when you don't abide in things is how much other people are supporting you and how much you're supporting them. Each of us probably now can see to some extent how other people are supporting us. Like I can see how Kathy and Carolyn support me. I can see how Amanda and Martha and Shokichi support me. I can see that. But what I can see is just actually a little linguistic, a little picture that language makes in my consciousness. It's not actually how they're helping me.

[45:44]

It's just a picture of how they're helping me in language. And there's not a reality of how they're helping me behind those words. But there is a reality of how they're helping me. And the reality of how they're helping me is they're helping me have words about it. The words are not it. If I don't abide in the words I have about how they're helping me or how they're not helping me, I open to live the reality of how they are helping me, which is inconceivable. And I also open to the world of how I'm supporting them and helping them. So we are helping each other. It's not that we don't need each other. I am nothing but needing you. And the nothing but needing you that I am helps you a lot. The way you're helping me is inconceivable and the way I'm helped by you, which is inconceivable, is inconceivable help to you. That mutual relationship is reality. It's immeasurable, incalculable, inexhaustible, empty, worthless, insubstantial, insignificant,

[46:59]

and wonderful beyond all conception. It's the fullness of our life. But we have to find out where we're limiting and our consciousness does limit and we have to be kind to that limiting and notice where we're clinging and notice where we're abiding and be kind to that. And we realize that it's not really anything more than just a limiting. All it is, is words. And realizing that is liberating. You're welcome. Anything else? Going once. Yes? There's so much actually going on in my mind.

[48:24]

So when we talk about taking care of ourselves, I kept thinking about ways in which I'm taking care of myself recently, which has been noticing the suffering. And And take care of the suffering? Taking care of the suffering. Realizing that all my suffering has been caused by attachment. And so... So if you take care of your suffering, you get to realize that. Yes. If you don't take care of your suffering, you might not realize it. You won't really realize it, really, unless you take care of it. You have to take care of stuff in order to realize what you're doing with them. Right. In the past I would do anything I could to either push it away or find something else to replace that feeling of emptiness.

[49:37]

And so the pushing away, we need to be kind to the pushing away. And we need to be kind to the trying to find something else. Because when we push away, that's what we're doing. We need to be kind to that. When we're trying to get something else, we need to be kind to that. And when we're neither pushing away nor trying to get something, we need to be kind to that balanced position and not cling to that. Oh, finally, I'm balanced. Don't cling to that either. But in order to not cling to it, you have to be kind to it. Finally, the way I wanted to be has arrived. And I got to like, just say welcome. And I can't hold on to it. And now it went away. And I say goodbye. And here it comes again. Exactly. Exactly. Because being like that now, it's like, wow, I found a wonderful way to have less suffering in my life. Exactly. A wonderful way.

[50:41]

But at the same time, there is... I don't know how to go about it. But my question was, So in this taking care of myself was a different way of being because the attachment and the suffering and the choice to be present with the suffering is really difficult because the suffering and the attachment is so conditioned and so based on years of trauma or childhood trauma. It's an incredible amount of effort. Yeah. But so in this new way of caring for myself, am I also taking care of all beings? Is there a duality? You're also taking care of all beings because all beings are supporting you.

[51:43]

Just like if your daughter takes care of herself, that supports you. And if you take care of yourself, that supports your daughter. But obviously, when your daughter's taking care of herself, that really does take care of you. But even if you look at her and you don't think that she's taking care of herself, and when you don't think she's taking care of herself, then you don't think that she's taking care of you. Still, in reality, she's taking care of you. And in reality you're taking care of her. So when you take care of yourself, actually everybody's helping you take care of yourself. You're making everybody a success when you take care of yourself. Because everybody's helping you do that. And you're helping them. So the way we discover how we're helping each other is by noticing how we're helping ourself And then we notice how we're helping ourself, and we notice, well, I am helping myself, but I'm doing it in kind of a tense way.

[52:46]

I'm not doing it in a relaxed way. I'm abiding in the caring for myself. Everybody's helping me do that, but also everybody's helping me see that I'm going too far. I'm caring too much for myself. I'm not relaxed. I'm abiding. And for me to see that is because everybody's helping me, and when I see that, I help everybody. My awakening is because everybody's assisting me to awake. My awakening is how everybody's assisting me to be awake. And that awakening awakens everybody else. We're doing the same practice together and When we notice how we're helping ourselves or how we're helping others, when we see the pictures of that and we abide, we know, okay, that's creating stress. When we do it and we're not abiding, we don't even necessarily notice it, but there will be a lack of stress which will pervade. Which you might notice, but in the not abiding...

[53:51]

You're welcome. I know a Zen priest who also teaches Vipassana meditation. And the Vipassana student said to him, do the Zen people have concentration in their practice? And he says, yeah, they have concentration, they just don't get to have it. So in Zen we do have enlightenment, we just don't get to have it. Because It's our relationship with everybody, and we can't have that. But that's what we really are. So we just don't get to have all this good stuff. We just are all this good stuff. So, please take care of it all. Oh, Sala! Sala, great to see you. Yes. I thought you... Whoa! I thought you... No. No. Without saying. We're glad that you're still here in this world with us.

[54:57]

So, goodbye. Oh, it's now goodbye. It is goodbye. This is it. This is it. And Catherine's going to say goodbye today, too. Yes, yes. So, I don't know how many years it's been. 30? 30? Great. Let's say 30. Yeah, 30 is a good number. Listening to you say words today and watching them come and go and, you know, abide. That's a good word to hold. Yeah, I've got to remember that word. I wrote it down. Not abiding. Abiding. Noticing one is abiding. All those things. all those things. Being sad and then letting it go.

[56:03]

Not making it go. Just, okay, I was sad and then sometimes I'm sad again. But sadness and joy. You know, joy, joy, just, you know, and then that goes away too. Listening to the cries of the universe, that seems like a really important one to remember. Yeah, it's really important to remember, and if we don't abide in it, it will promote remembering. That's right. That's right. Give space for remembering, too. Like remembering telephone numbers. Right. Yeah. So the most important things are the most important things not to abide in.

[57:04]

Uh-huh. Uh-huh. So, um, I... I envy, just for a moment, because I even know how to let go of envy, but those of you who are meeting him for the first time, there's so much here. There's so much here. There's so much here. There's so much here. There is so much here. Please take care of this place for me. I will be back. I will look. I'll criticize. If it's not Walter, I can care of. But take good care of it. Take good care of this man. And you know I love you more than the moon and the stars. Thank you for sharing your farewell with everybody. And I love you more than the moon and the stars, God. Even as I said that, I saw faces that I haven't seen, so...

[58:08]

Take care of yourselves. I agree. Thank you for coming.

[58:38]

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