For a while now, I have been contemplating a sentence. One sentence. That sentence comes from this huge scripture. One sentence. And the one sentence in this huge book appears on page 747. In the 26th book of this scripture.

[01:04]

And it's about, it's a description of the way that bodhisattvas think. It says in the scripture, they think. This is the way they think. They think. Whatever exists in the three realms is just one mind. It also says other things that they think.

[02:11]

The scripture says, They also think, they also think, they also think, they think a lot, bodhisattvas think a lot according to the scripture. And I'm just thinking about one sentence that they think. That one sentence is... Whatever exists in the three realms is just one mind. They think that thought. And I mentioned the last time I spoke, this thought is a rather unusual thought. It's a rather unusual way to be thinking. And for the sake of this world, I have been thinking that over and over. I think that I join those bodhisattvas and I spend my days thinking whatever in the three worlds is just one mind.

[03:28]

I'd been encouraged to do that by the sutra, to copy the bodhisattvas thinking. And I was encouraged also, not just by the sutra, but by a number of Zen ancestors who also spent quite a bit of effort thinking about this new way of thinking, remembering this new way of thinking, and then turning it, turning the way of thinking, turning whatever there is in the world is just one mind. They think it and they turn it. And then they say things about what they think after they turn their thinking. There are some people who love me. And they would not kind of listen to me talk about this one sentence.

[04:36]

They're not interested. in me talking about this scripture. Even though they love me for studying this scripture and they love that I love this scripture. And they love me bringing up and discussing one sentence for a long time. But they don't want to listen to it. They'd rather go to the farmer's market and buy tomatoes. So you came here and you're running into somebody who talks about a sentence. What's the sentence? Whatever exists in the three realms is just one mind. And again, many of our ancestors worked with this one sentence for the welfare of this world. I now am working with it and I say this is a way of thinking which I

[05:41]

I think, can free me and you from thinking. Our main problem in life and the main problem in this world is the way people are thinking. They're thinking in habitual ways. And thinking in habitual ways is frustrating and painful. Most of us spend most of our time thinking in habitual ways. And a technical Buddhist way to talk about the habitual ways of thinking is to call it the three realms. The three realms are all the different ways that living beings think habitually. It's three realms of birth and death.

[06:43]

Three realms of deluded worldly activity where people are thinking in habitual ways and feeling frustrated and painful and then thinking in habitual ways about the pain and causing more pain by the way they're thinking about the pain. Which... I think most of you are a little bit familiar with the unkind ways that people are acting and thinking. I should say, first of all, the unkind ways that people think, the basic action of our life is thinking. And then following from the thinking is speaking and physical gestures. So... When I feel frustrated, if I don't take care of that frustration, if I don't think that it would be good to take care of the frustration, then I might say something from feeling frustrated and not being compassionate with the frustration that comes from the way I'm thinking.

[07:58]

So I would like everybody to become free of their way that they're thinking. And I would like to offer this one sentence and work with it in a way to free all beings from habitual thinking. The three worlds, again, is a technical Buddhist term, and it refers to basically three realms. And these three realms encompass all the different kinds of experience that living beings have. One realm's called Sanskrit, Kamadhatu. Another one's called Sanskrit, Rupadhatu.

[09:09]

Another one's called Arupadhatu. Those are three realms of experience. In the Rubadhatu, one of the realms of experience is called the human realm, which the humans here are familiar with. But there's other realms, like animal realms, hell-dwelling realms, hungry ghost realms, and competitive divine beings realms, and the realm of divine beings. Those are six realms in the first... Those are six worlds in the first realm called the realm Kamadatu, the realm of form and desire. Kamadatu, the realm of desire, which is the realm of gross form. That's one of them. Another one is fine material realm, Rupadatu. And that's the realm that people enter when they get into certain states of concentration.

[10:14]

The small percentage of sentient beings enter these realms of fine material experience. And an even more rare experience for human beings is the realm of no form, where there's no colors, smells, tastes, tangibles, sounds. But there are mind objects. In all these realms, all these three realms, and in all the realms of humans, hungry ghosts, animals, hell dwellers, and so on, in all those realms, there is an unceasing effort to make things into a self and to make a self into things.

[11:18]

And this process of trying to make our experience the phenomena of our experience into a self is painful. And the wishing and the attempting to make ourselves into phenomena is painful. And it's unceasing. And we live there. We are living in this realm. It's called birth and death. It's called the world of suffering. But even in those lofty realms of meditation... which are much more refined, there's still the attempt to make, for example, these refined forms into a self, or to make the self into a refined form. And even in a realm where there's no physical data anymore, there's just mental phenomena, like the mental phenomena of infinite space and infinite consciousness.

[12:41]

And there's even a special state called neither perception nor non-perception. Very, very subtle. Even there, there is a very, very subtle trying to make this state into a self. Even there, there is habitual thinking. A verse, which I often bring up, is found in a commentary, a verse commentary, in the Book of Serenity, Case 3. And the verse is, in the subtle, round mouth of the pivot, the spiritual works turn, or the spiritual work turns.

[13:47]

This is a commentary on a teaching, on a practice that Bodhidharma's teacher, Prajnatara, practices. What is the practice that Prajnatara does? The practice is breathing in, breathing in, breathing out, not abiding in anything. Breathing in with no abode. Breathing out with no abode. That's Bodhidharma's teacher's practice. And that teacher says, this is my sutra. This is my school sutra. My sutra is... Breathing in, not abiding in anything.

[14:52]

Breathing out, not abiding in anything. Breathing in and out without abiding in anything. This is my scripture. And I recite this scripture hundreds, thousands, millions of times. That's his one sentence practice. His one sentence scripture. And commenting on that practice, the great Chinese Zen teacher Hongzhi says, in the subtle round mouth of the pivot is where the spiritual work turns. In the pivot of your breathing, there is a subtle round mouth that spiritual work is turning in your breathing. So, here we have the three worlds.

[15:55]

The three worlds. And in the subtle round mouth of the pivot of these three worlds is where the spiritual work of the one mind works, is turning. So I'm offering you the strange activity of turning this teaching, of turning this sentence, of turning all the parts of this sentence. This one sentence, this teaching of the scripture says, this one sentence includes the entire universe. It's enough. In every particle of this one sentence, the entire universe is there. So turning this sentence, we're turning everything.

[16:58]

And the Dharma turns everything. And the Dharma is the turning of everything. And in this turning, there is the possibility of freedom from habitual thinking. Rather than talk about the one mind, which is the three realms, I'd like to start by talking about the three realms, which are the one mind. And it's not just the three realms, it's the three realms turning on the three realms. Because the three realms do turn on the three realms. the universe turns on the universe. And in particular, the universe of birth and death turns on the world of birth and death.

[18:04]

Now, what are the three realms? Whatever is appearing here right now is the three realms. And Another aspect of the three realms is, right now, what's appearing is something that's appearing in awareness. There's an awareness of what's appearing. What's appearing is, what is it? The three realms. And there's an awareness of the three realms. Right now. But the awareness of the three realms... is the three realms.

[19:25]

And part of the three realms is my own deluded habitual way of thinking. And according to my deluded habitual way of thinking, it isn't the three realms that's aware of the three realms. It's me. That's aware of the three realms. I see what's appearing here. This delusion that I see, this realm, the three realms here right now, that delusion is a very important part of the three realms. But it isn't just that I see the three realms. Everybody in this room sees the three realms. They think. Do you see that? Do you see that illusion that I see what's appearing here? I see what's appearing here.

[20:33]

I see what's appearing here. And what's appearing here, he says, is the three realms. So I see the three realms. Well, yeah. But that's a very narrow version of what's going on. And if I believe it, That's an habitual way. It's the habitual way is I see what's happening here. I see Rami's face. I see Aditya's face. I see his smile. That thought is a habitual thought. It's a thought which I'm not trying to get rid of it, even though it's habitual. I'm not trying to get rid of it. I might have tried sometime during the last 50 years a few times to get rid of that deluded way of thinking.

[21:36]

I might have, but I'm not trying anymore. I'm not trying to get rid of the delusion that I see, Helen. It's a very strong habit. I see Charlie. I see Rick. I see Patty. I'm not trying to get rid of that. But I don't see it. That's not true. That's just a thought. The truth is that the Three Realms sees Rick. The Three Realms not only sees Rick, But it sees the three realms. The three realms sees the whole three realms. What's appearing right now is not just Romy's face or Justin's face. It's everybody's face. And it's the idea that there's a whole universe along with this assembly.

[22:44]

And what really sees everybody is everybody. And everybody includes each person who thinks they see it. All the deluded people together and all the things that they see and think they see. All their habitual thinking is the three realms. The three realms is everybody's habitual deluded thinking. But that's not the whole story. The further story is that everybody's deluded thinking is aware of everybody's deluded thinking. And nobody's individual deluded thinking is aware of everybody's deluded thinking. And that... The three worlds, which the three worlds are aware of, is constantly, the three worlds are constantly turning on the three worlds.

[24:01]

The three worlds is aware of the three worlds and then turning on the three worlds. And the three worlds are containing the thoughts about the three worlds and turning... with the awareness of three worlds. And this turning is to where the spiritual life of Buddha is functioning. Another phrase from this tradition to go with the sort of round mouth of a pivot a pearl in a bowl rolls of itself the three worlds everything that appears is a pearl and it's rolling in a bowl of the three worlds the three worlds are rolling in

[25:16]

within the three worlds. And this rolling is one bright pearl. It's one mind. So again, I'm not recommending that I try to stop the thought. I see Tracy's face. I'm just opening to a different thought, which is everything is seeing everything, including Sarah's face, including Ray's face, including everything in the realm of habitual thinking. Everything's doing that, not just me.

[26:22]

All my experiences are not done just by me. They're done by all of us together. And what we are aware of is all of us together. And that is one mind. And I have the thought, and the thought I have, I don't have by myself. You all support me to have the thought. What's the thought? The three realms are one. Yeah, that's the thought. And the thought, and here's another thought, which is the three realms are not taking the form of a thought that each being in the three realms has their own mind. That each of you has a mind.

[27:24]

That there's many minds in this room. Not one mind, many minds. The teaching is the many minds are aware of the many minds and the many minds are turning on the awareness of the many minds And that's actually a mind. The many minds are one mind. And I'm not trying to get that one mind, which is the many minds. I'm trying to work with the many minds with aid of this teaching to realize that the many minds are one mind. And the one mind are all the different illusory individual minds, which are seen by virtue of a way of thinking, which again, I don't make up my own thinking.

[28:35]

However, there is an awareness, there's a thinking, this seems to be habitual. This has been thought before. There is such a thought. That's part of the three world realms. And there are stories about people who are talking to each other and trying to turn this teaching just like I am now. But before I bring those stories up, I want to ask you. Actually, I am bringing up a story. Here's a story I'm bringing up. But it doesn't sound like it used to sound. Yeah, it does sound like that. I'm going to bring up the first line of the story. but I'm going to address the story to you. Whereas in the old version of the story, it was directed to a famous Zen teacher in China. In the place of the famous Zen teacher in China, I'm now going to ask you the same question that she was asked.

[29:42]

Okay? So that famous Zen teacher's teacher... ask this thing as a teacher, what this person is asking you. So what I'm asking you is what was asked in China. So today, here we are, and I say to you, just like back in China, 1,200 years ago, I say to you, that three worlds, whatever exists in the three realms, the three worlds, is just one mind. Do you hear it? How do you understand? Excuse me. What? Excuse me. Whatever exists in the three worlds is just one mind. How do you understand it? That question was asked back in China between two wonderful bodhisattvas, Zen masters.

[30:51]

But now I'm asking you. Just like back then. Okay. And I see a face going like this, and I see some hands. Yes. Charlie. This reminds me of when I was studying physics, and they tried to tell us about string theory. And... that all the math that we learned and all the mechanics that we knew and all that stuff was fine, but there's a whole other way of seeing the whole world and it's all strings. So, I think I see the three worlds. I think I heard you say, but the truth is, the three worlds see the three worlds. And, when I said the string theory was, what's the benefit of thinking this way? The benefit of thinking this way is to free you from the way you already think, but not to free you from the way you have thought once.

[32:03]

You're not stuck in a thought that occurred never before and never again. That's not a problem. The problems of our life are habitual thinking. And this teaching is offered. The teaching doesn't mention it, that this teaching can free us from habitual thinking. But I say it's offered to free us from habitual thinking. It's offered to open us to the Buddha's wisdom. It's offered to let us demonstrate Buddha's wisdom, to awaken the Buddha's wisdom and enter Buddha's wisdom. That's what this teaching is offered for. That doesn't mean that we couldn't apply this teaching to string theory. String theory is part of the habitual thinking of some physicists.

[33:06]

We could apply this teaching to their thinking about string theory, and they can continue to think about string theory, but be free and unfrustrated. And their compassion can be unhindered by this way of working with string theory. Because string theory is an example of the three worlds. This room is an example of the three worlds. So this teaching is help us work with whatever in such a way as to open Buddhist wisdom. Demonstrate it. How we work with the three realms is how we demonstrate. How we work with language is how we demonstrate Buddha's wisdom. So the stories which I have not yet brought up today are stories of where bodhisattvas who are living in the three realms and know it, they've heard about it and they accept it.

[34:15]

In the deluded world of birth and death, they can talk to each other. there can be conversation. And they ask each other, do you understand this teaching? And then they turn with each other. And I think I could just bring up one line of the conversation which I'm now reenacting. What's the conversation I'm now reenacting from China, which was spoken in Chinese? In English, I'm now saying... The three worlds are just one mind. How do you understand it? That's the conversation. And the last line of that conversation is the teacher of the teacher says, no matter how much you look throughout the world, you cannot find one single person who understands Buddha Dharma. So now I'm saying,

[35:21]

How do you understand it? But no one person here can understand it. So even though I say, how do you understand it, it's kind of a trap. But we change it to, how is this understood? How is it understood? And then the person who's being questioned can answer. And that's how it's understood, by this turning. How do you understand? Yes? Are you answering how do I understand? I am, but I'm actually also going to ask the question if you may. The first thing I'll say is, the way I understand it sounds a lot like how you began, which is knowing that I see things as I, Knowing that I don't. Knowing that you don't.

[36:25]

Knowing that you don't see them as I, or knowing that you don't see them? Knowing that I don't see them as I. Okay. And then, do you also see an unceasing effort to see them as I? Yeah. That's good. So, now, I could change it to... Is there seeing, an unceasing effort, to make at least everything into I? Yeah. So then there's a seeing of the three realms. And it's not done by you. Even though there's maybe a thought that it is done by me. Yeah, that's... I don't understand what you mean by turning. Okay, so now the three worlds is appearing. The three worlds is what's appearing.

[37:27]

It's nothing intangible. Everything that's appearing here, that's what we mean by three worlds. And one thing that's also appearing here, besides your faces, and my thoughts about your faces, or the thoughts about your faces, like that's Ellen. There's the face and there's the thought, Ellen. That's part of the three worlds. And there's also the thought, I see Ellen and I think about Ellen. That's also part of the three worlds. And that thought, my thoughts about Ellen are appearing. You can't see them unless I speak, but they're part of what's appearing is what you see sort of outwardly and what you see in you. The turning is to realize that in the background of this I see the three realms is not thinking that way.

[38:31]

In the background of this is actually the three realms thinking that thought. So part of the turning is turning from foreground to background. So foreground, I see all of you and I see my thoughts. Foreground, all of this is being seen clearly, inwardly and outward. Everything's appearing quite clear and not any other way. And now it's another way. That's the foreground. But in the background, there's knowing all this too. But that kind of knowing is not this kind of knowing. That kind of knowing is currently quiet. It's annoying, but it's quiet. This is quite coherent. The background is incoherent. So I'm in the realm of coherence, where there's words which are coherent.

[39:42]

I have words which are saying, be aware that there's an incoherent background. There's a coherent three worlds and an incoherent three worlds. There's a foreground and a background. And so my thoughts about you are not the background. They're just the version of the foreground. But behind or supporting my thoughts about you are knowing of you. That's the way everything's knowing you. And I'm part of that knowing. And you're all part of that knowing. But you can't get a hold of it. But without it, there would be no foreground. I see quite a few hands. I think next was Homer. Respond to your question is, I see that.

[40:46]

Okay. I would love to try to see you. Who is next? Rick's asking you a question. Can you hear Rick? Explain that. Holmes repeating what she said for Rick was sitting next to her. I see that one. So, the way you see the foreground, you already have accomplished that. That's your habitual way of thinking. The way you see in the background is not your habitual. The background isn't habitual. Who's next?

[41:56]

Who's next? I think maybe Reiko was next. Red asks a question, Ray responds, or what the so-called three realms calls the three realms is aware of the three realms. Would you say that again, please? From the beginning? Yeah. What I almost said, and... Reb asks a question, Ray responds, or what the so-called Three Realms calls the Three Realms is aware of the Three Realms. Did you say whatever? What? What? I'll talk deeper. It's easier to hear. No, I just love her. I'll take my earrings out. What the so-called Three Realms calls the Three Realms is aware of the Three Realms.

[43:05]

What the Three Realms calls the Three Realms is aware of the Three Realms. The Three Realms is aware of the Three Realms and then within the Three Realms there's the The three realms is what's aware of the three realms is the three realms. And within the three realms is the thought, for example, I'm aware of the three realms. But what's aware of that is actually not just I, it's the three realms that's aware of that. And that's the answer to the question, how do you understand? That And you ask a question and I give an answer. Yeah. Yeah. Give a response. But aren't we calling it the Three Realms?

[44:07]

Like I added to the front of that what the Three Realms calls the Three Realms. Somebody picked those words. Do you? Yeah. The Three Realms picked the words Three Realms. Somehow that happened. But it wasn't just the three realms that picked the words three realms, it was also the one mind that picked the three realms, the words three realms. So the mind, which is the three realms, picks part of the three realms to offer to the three realms. And part of the three realms are the words three realms. Another part of it then is are just one mind. Those are things of the three realms used from the one mind, which is the three realms. But the individual three realms did not give this teaching.

[45:15]

Individual? Hmm? Individual? Yeah, like the individual words, three realms, came from the one mind. Which was the three realms, not one part of the three realms. It's the mind that's the turning of the foreground with the background. That mind offered these words. And all the words are in the realm of this and that. In other words, three realms, four realms, That's all that's going on in the three realms. And the one mind uses the three realms to liberate the three realms. But it uses the three realms. It uses words to liberate it from words. It uses a sentence to liberate it from other habitual sentences. So there is an attempt to turn going on right now.

[46:22]

which I'm not in charge of. I think maybe Chia Ying was next. I have two questions. Two questions. The first one is, this teaching is reminding me of what Buddha needs a Buddha. Yes. What you were saying about, so maybe this enters the second question. So the first question is, can you say more about how you relate this teaching to when Buddha meets a Buddha? And the second... Can we do that first? Yes. So... The... The exhaustive study of all the dharmas the exhaustive study or the exhaustive investigation of the true marks of all the phenomena in the three worlds is accomplished by Buddha, is only accomplished by Buddha together with Buddha.

[47:42]

So in this case, where's the Buddha together with Buddha? Well, it's not just the one mind, It's the one mind in the interaction between the three worlds and the three worlds. So between, I want to call it, this person, this three worlds, and this three worlds, in that interaction, in that meeting, is where the true nature of the three worlds is investigated. So you ask that question, this is how we do it. We do it like this. Can't get hold of it, but we're doing it. And again, the story which I haven't told starts out by, how do you understand? And then the student says something. And then the teacher says something.

[48:44]

This is how we do it. And this is appearing in the three realms. However, the way it's actually working is one mind. So it's not Reb and Jai, it's one mind. Say again? So it's not you and I, it's one mind. And you and I are one mind. Yes. And us meeting and conversing in this way and not getting a hold of anything will realize the one mind and free us from our habitual ways of, I do things by myself. Like, I see you. I hear you. Without stopping that, actually embracing it completely and being turned in it. And I don't know who was next.

[49:53]

Can I ask my second question? Oh, yes, go ahead. So, I think, so when you're saying the front and the back, is it right that the front is more like our habitual way of seeing and thinking, and the back, the back activity that I'm imagining is more like the letting go? It's not about, there's another reality there. It's more like constant letting go. Okay. I think the constant letting go is the interaction between the background and the foreground. In the background, it's hard to let go of anything because nothing's coherent. So there's an incoherent, ungraspable way things are, which makes possible the way they seem to be. They seem to be graspable. So the graspable... three realms has a background of an ungraspable three realms which supports continually to make things into self into a particular thing so there is in the three worlds there is a discoverable constant effort to make

[51:22]

our life into something, into a self. There's an awareness of that. And there's an awareness that that's frustrating because we actually think we're being successful at getting things in these habitual ways. We're being successful in our habitual ways of thinking in the three worlds. But that's supported by something else in the background which is also part of the three worlds but it's the incoherent part which we can't see so like again here's the triple world and then there's the triple world thought that I see the triple world but simultaneously there is a there's an incoherent three worlds that's actually seeing what's appearing here And in that, nothing can be grasped.

[52:26]

The full story is that this incoherent background is working and turning with the coherent foreground, that they're turning with them. But the background isn't wisdom, it's just the background of delusion. which is hard to call a delusion because it's incoherent. It's like string theory. Nobody can find the background, because as soon as you find the background, the background has just become foreground. And then what was foreground before, you can't see anymore, it's been thrown into the background. So actually the foreground and the background take turns, but when the background becomes foreground, it has a new background. The foreground is deludedly imagined to be graspable. Like string theory is a delusion about how to grasp, but the subject physicists are saying, but we can't find, we know we must be able to grasp something, but we can't prove it because we can't find anything.

[53:41]

It's kind of like introducing this, to some extent introducing The background of the three worlds is part of the way we open to the three worlds being one mind. It's like, I think I know you, and in the background of I think I know you is an incoherent way of knowing you. Which is, I do know you that way, but I can't grasp it. I can't put words on it. As soon as I put words on it, comes into the foreground. But it makes me, you know, it humbles me. It humbles my habitual thinking. I'm going to continue to have my habitual thinking and be stressed about that and afraid about that. But now I have this new way of thinking about it which offers freedom without getting rid of string theory.

[54:49]

without getting rid of any of these thoughts, any of these graspable thoughts. It's a way to sail across the ocean of graspable, familiar, habitual thinking in such a way to realize that that ocean is perceived actually by an ocean. and I'm going across the ocean, and part of the ocean is my thought, that I can see the ocean. But I can't. And so that reminds us of the famous image from Tolkien, which is, it's like going out in the ocean, away from the shore, and the ocean looks circular, and doesn't look another way. And I'll add, And you shouldn't try to make the ocean not look round.

[55:49]

Because you do, that's what you think. I see the ocean as round. But the ocean is not round. And I have a teaching which is the ocean is not round. And I've heard it. And when I really accept that teaching, then when I see the round ocean, or when I see the round face, I know something's missing. Namely. three realms are not being taken into account I'm just thinking this one little deluded thought is what sees the ocean and I can't stop it so we don't want to stop it but we take it with a grain of salt and I don't know who's next Tracy and Linda Linda and Tracy I was, if I pointed at what you said at the beginning, that you've been displaced by some farmhouse, farmer's market tomatoes.

[56:55]

And the whole time while you're doing this talk. Displaced? You didn't say displaced. I'm not displaced, it's just that some people would rather go to farmer's market than listen to this. I know, so I'm just hearing all this today and I'm answering some farmer's market tomatoes. Okay. and tomatoes tomatoes are sometimes really delicious I'm not going to say something by a lot I'm going to say something specific which is the I know that all of this came through language and through translations and I wonder if you would just tell us a few other ways of translating one mind and self those two I would like to know how other ways to... Translating one mind? Yeah. Another way to, not translate it, but another way to talk about it is to call it One Bright Pearl. So the teacher who asked that question back in China, the three worlds are just one mind, how do you understand it?

[58:06]

That teacher also taught the three worlds are just one bright pearl. All of this delusion is actually a pearl. And it's bright. All of this is really Buddha's wisdom. But we have to get into how these three worlds are turning and making and realizing the pearl comes from studying the turning of the world of habitual thinking. All of that is one life. Everything you just said, all that, is another way of saying one mind? Or is that one mind points to all that? All of that, yes. Well, we just said the one mind is the three worlds. And what I just said was the three worlds. Everything I say is the three worlds. When you hear me, you're hearing, you're seeing an example.

[59:07]

That's how the three worlds is appearing when I'm talking. And also, you have the thought, you hear me, but simultaneously the three worlds hears me. And that you can't think. But that's in the background of your thinking, which supports you thinking, I hear him. So the three worlds support you to have the three worlds which are the full story of virtual thinking. Three worlds are habitual thinking and habitual thinking, actually all the habitual thinking knows all the habitual thinking. And then all the habitual thinking includes every thought that Tracy thinks she's having. And for Tracy to bring forth her individual thoughts and believe them as

[60:11]

what she thinks, what she's able to think, for her to do that face-to-face with Buddha, then she had the chance to let go of that. Thank you. Is that one mind, what you just said? Is that what one mind is? But everything I say is the three words. Right. So no matter what I say, including... Some people would rather go to the farmer's market than hear me talk about the three worlds or one mind. They maybe agree with me, but that's enough. Just the one sentence, and I'll see you later. But maybe they only want to hear that one sentence. Going to the farmer's market is the three worlds. You keep talking about the three worlds. I'm keeping asking about one mind and trying to see is there... Are they the same or is there something else?

[61:14]

Are they the same? They are the same and there's nothing else. There's nothing beyond the three worlds. Just like there's nothing beyond the one mind. And it might be easy to think, yeah, I guess there wouldn't be anything, maybe there's nothing beyond the one mind, but isn't there something beyond the world of this unceasing effort to make things into a self? And translate, make things into a self, is make things into coherent, independently existing, independently existence. That's making things into a self. And that's going on in the three worlds. And so, when I say something, you say, is that the three worlds, or is that the one mind? Well, it's the three worlds, but no matter what I say, It's the three worlds, and no matter what I say, they're all equally part of the three worlds. If I say it's Saturday, that's part of the three worlds.

[62:16]

If I say it's Sunday, that's part of the three worlds. No, you keep talking about three worlds, and I keep asking about one mind. That's what I'm confused about. Everything I say is one mind. But it's not just that everything I say, the words I say are one mind. everything I say in the three worlds. So everything I say is not just by itself, it's together with everything. It's together with all the other thoughts and all the other talking people. All that is the one mind. My one thought is not separate from all other thoughts and feelings. So I should... It's not separate, so I should... really respect my one thought but my one thought is not all the thoughts of the universe but no matter what you say it is the three realms and it is the one mind and then I think Linda's next and then maybe Justin Justin has had way up before me it's okay go ahead okay

[63:34]

I'm going to be incoherent. Maybe that'll be wise. I don't think so. I don't know, but it's like a few images come up. The first one that came up when you said, well, would you respond, was I have hair, you do not have hair. Why did that come up? You know, I could say that One mind, somehow one mind, and you have the bald head. I have hair on my head. Maybe that's foreground and background. You don't look like you're really very happy with this. This so subtle thing that you're offering us. Another image that came up is like... The subtle round mouth of the pivot. The subtle what?

[64:34]

In the subtle, round mouth of the pivot. It is subtle. But in the subtle, round mouth is where the spiritual word is turning. And you're working with that mouth right now. Yeah. Well, even if we talk about it, it's three worlds, we're immediately caught in some delusion. Okay, question... I thought the three worlds are the same as when Dogen says the myriad things. Yeah. Yeah. But it's... The myriad things don't carry quite the same... What's the word? The myriad things do not carry the world quality of it. But the worlds, the three worlds are kind of containers. They're limits. No limits, really. There can't be limits. No, there isn't.

[65:35]

Because it's really just one mind. So there's no limits. The ocean is infinite. But the three worlds are all the circles of water. Those myriad things exactly... You know... can be seen as round or as having no shape at all. That's right. And seeing them as round or having no shape at all, that seeing them is the way things are in the three worlds. It's to see them as circles of water. The ocean is infinite. There's one more little thing I want to say that's incoherent. That is going back, going the opposite direction from the way we usually hear it again, you know, to study, to the Buddha way is to study the self, to study the self is to forget the self, to forget the self is to be wrong.

[66:36]

Starting with a myriad of things, I came down to like some very specific thing, like you have no hair, I have hair, I'm looking also at your toenails, thinking the ideas, thinking things about your toenails. And underneath all that, I'm just wanting everybody in the room to really like me and think I'm really good, especially you. That thought is like my toenails. Yeah, yeah. I mean, it's like you're seeing my toenails, and now there's a vision of my toenails and the vision of this thought. And the last thing, if I can remember it, to be brought forth by all the things, myriad things, I have to study the self, the self that right here in the midst of this incredible conversation just wants everybody to like me.

[67:49]

Yep, that's right. You have to study that wish, which is a coherent wish. And But it's not all the three worlds, but it is one particle in the three worlds. Yeah. And in the three worlds, there is delusions about the three worlds, like their circles or their toenails or their thoughts of wishing for approval. Sometimes they look like circles. What's that other thing right there that Dobrik says, the ocean? Sometimes it looks like a jewel. Sometimes it looks like a seaweed or whatever. Yeah, yeah. But all those things are the three worlds. There's other ways too. And when you understand the tension of the three worlds, then you are beginning to let go of the circle that you see, of the face you see and the toes you see.

[68:55]

You're getting ready to loosen up a little bit and start to watch how the circle is pivoting with the ocean and how the circle is pivoting with the other circles. So everything everybody gives you is a little circle of the ocean. Actually, everybody gives you an ocean, but you see a circle of it. I mean, you see a circle of it. But I forgot, Kim, you had your hand raised a long time ago. I'm sorry. I have a memory that today you raised your hand a while ago. I did. And I wondered, I mean, I know that the conversation is quite out there, but I wondered if the mind is also what motivates, the big mind, is what motivates us to try and change our habitual thinking. Or, like, where does that come from?

[69:58]

I think our habitual thinking motivates us to try to change our habitual thinking. Because of the pain of it? Yeah. Or, you know, the pain of it, the lack of being famous for it. You know? The frustration of it. So, we're thinking away, and then we have a thought, maybe if I stop this, things would be more comfortable. That's also going to be frustrating. That would be frustrating to try to change my habitual thinking. That's a common habitual thought. I know so many people who would like to change their habitual thinking. I know so many people who would like to get rid of their self or who would like to stop trying to make everything into being about them. A lot of people want to stop that. But that's the same thing. I want to stop the pain that I have from making things about me.

[71:03]

And other people tell me that would be a good idea too. Do you have to make everything about you? And you say, oh yeah, I think I do. I have that, I have that ritual way, is I make everything about me. And some people, people don't say that to you. They say, they don't get called on that. That's too bad. Everybody's The three worlds, everybody's trying to make everything into about them. And some of them notice that's very frustrating and they want to stop it. It's the same thing. It's not to be mean to this, to the three worlds. Again, this teaching is given to people who are practicing compassion to the three worlds. And for those people The teaching is the things you're practicing compassion towards, all these suffering beings, the way they're all relating to each other, is actually just one mind.

[72:11]

That's what the Buddha is seeing and telling us. But when the Buddha tells us, not when the Buddha sees it, but as soon as the Buddha talks, the Buddha offers it to us in the three worlds. So then we work with the Buddhist teaching about the three worlds, in the three worlds, not to get rid of the three worlds, but to discover that they're one bright pearl. Meantime, there will be a recurrence of trying to get rid of the three worlds, or at least get rid of certain parts of the three worlds, like the way I think, or the way she thinks, or whatever. That will continue. The world's three worlds is not going to be eliminated, it's going to be liberated. I mean, that's the wish, to liberate the three worlds by realizing that they're one bright pearl. But we have to work with the three worlds and keep remembering that we're diluted in our study.

[73:19]

Yes, Justin? I think you kind of just alluded to it, but when Tracy was talking, I was trying to kind of reconcile the three worlds and the one mind. I thought that, you know, perhaps when these monks received this teaching 1200 years ago in China, that the three worlds had been introduced to something or they had received that teaching of the three worlds and then meditating on the three worlds that, you know, that could become a dichotomy or a dualistic way of seeing one world from the other, and that one big mind was an anecdote to that teaching. Yeah, but before they heard this teaching of the three worlds, they were already doing what you described. Right. So the teaching just sort of helps us. Sorry, they were seeing through a lens based on that teaching, but doing the same thing. Yeah, people have never heard this teaching.

[74:24]

Right. have their own lenses, but that's the three worlds too. And you hear the teaching and it's the same. However, once they start looking at the teaching, they start to become more open to the possibility of turning their lens, of being told that this lens is actually not the way you see it. What's going on is not the lens. But the lens is included And actually the lens is part of this whole situation which is not a lens. It's infinite lenses that see a little bit and think that seeing a little bit is the way it is, which is why it's painful. We think that what's seen through this lens is true. Now we're saying what's seen through this lens is part of the ocean of being seen through the lens and that's just one bright pearl and I just want to also say that that this talk has been perhaps quite turbulent and that's because we're recognizing the three worlds we're working with them

[75:53]

Yes, Pat. I was just wondering, Ms. Charlie, if it's correct to say that our self is not personal. Our self is not personal? Our self is not personal. No, our self is the delusion that it is personal. It's not, but we think it is. That's what we think, is the self, and we're trying to make everything into that personal self. That's our intention. And that's the three worlds, is this very diverse attempt to make everything into a personal self. And it's not. Everything is not seen by a personal self. And one of the things that's not seen by our personal self is the idea of a personal self. There is the idea of a personal self, but the self doesn't see it. I have the idea of a personal self, but my personal self doesn't see my personal self.

[77:01]

And I could also have the idea of a personal self and the idea that the personal self sees a personal self. That's not true. That's just two ideas. They're both delusions and they're both painful. The idea of a personal self that there really is something existing on its own And there's the idea that something that exists on its own sees something that exists on its own. But this is not talking about getting rid of that. It's saying all of that is just one mind. One mind allows this infinite ocean of delusion. This infinite ocean of beings who are trying to make their life into a self. all working together as one mind. And that's Buddha's wisdom.

[78:02]

So in a way, his teaching can put a lot of emphasis on taking care of the realm of affliction. And noticing, oh yeah, that thought's there, and that's a delusion. I'm not disregarding it, I respect it, but I am... I am a delusion. And the three worlds sees that I am a delusion. And that's part of the path to realizing that the three worlds are one mind, is to admit that the three worlds is full of delusion, And working with this ocean delusion, we realized that this whole ocean is one mind. Yeah.

[79:07]

The Three Worlds appears as a quiet assembly. The Three Worlds appears, and now there's Oscar. I'm part of the three worlds. I said, and now there's Oscar. I didn't say, I said the three worlds appears as you. And Green. And Mark. And Manda. And Kriya. It appears as everything that appears. That's how it appears. So is this a... There's another way of expressing this teaching. Is this teaching saying that everything in the universe, every atom, every star system, is linked in a dance of cause and effect.

[80:12]

Nothing is outside that. Yes. And... And also associated with the idea that I am not it, it is me? Mm-hmm. And this universe that you just described allows a realm of delusion. But in the realm of delusion, that interdependence which you described is not showing up. What's showing up is independence. Independence. habitual thoughts are showing up. Not the interdependence of my habitual thoughts and yours. My habitual thoughts are interdependent with all of your habitual thoughts. My painful thoughts are totally intimate with all your painful thoughts. So interdependence doesn't mention that.

[81:14]

It just talks about the one mind. Interdependence is the one mind of all of our delusions of independence. But, in fact, the interdependent universe is the one mind. Yes. And the incoherent part of it that you mentioned, is that called arupa? No. Did you say the incoherent? Yeah. The incoherent background... of this world of delusion is also the three realms. It's just that it's very subtle and you can't really find a name for it. But that's part of it. The background is part of the pentacle arising of the foreground. So part of the foreground of our visual thinking, that foreground,

[82:18]

as a background. And both of them together are the three worlds. But it's the three worlds of the foreground and the background of delusion. The foreground and the background of habitual thoughts. And all of it's interdependent. The whole universe is interdependent. But in the three worlds we ignore interdependence. The three world is the world of ignoring interdependence. Ignoring interdependence. Like you think, well, I heard the word interdependence, I'm paying attention to it, but that's paying attention to the word interdependence. To actually open to interdependence is to open to the ungraspability of all of your grasping tendencies. So is the incoherence the inability to comprehend the vastness of the way things work?

[83:24]

The incoherence is ungraspable, and the foreground is also ungraspable. Both the background of deluded thought, the background of the coherent three realms, is ungraspable, and the foreground is ungraspable. The arubadhatu is ungraspable. The formless realm is ungraspable too. The triple world of delusion is not graspable. It is the realm of thinking that things are graspable and trying to grasp them. That's the realm. There's a background of that which is also not graspable, but which we're vaguely, just very vaguely aware of.

[84:25]

But it makes possible our foreground, which we're quite aware of, our foreground delusion, because there's a background of delusion, a foreground of delusion, and neither of them can be grasped. They're interdependent, and because they're interdependent, you can't grasp either. It's just more information about the process. But the dependable arising of the foreground of delusion depends on a background of delusion that's ungraspable. We don't even try to grasp it. It's too subtle to even try. That's where all the frustration goes, disappears. It just goes. Yeah, if it goes, that's another delusion. The going. Somebody said to me, there's no going. earlier today, and it was you. You can't grasp going. But in the three worlds, we think, habitually, that there's coming and going.

[85:32]

We think that habitually there's coming and going. And we're not trying to stop that. I mean, the Buddha's not trying to stop it. The Buddha's trying to illuminate how deluded this realm is. And to teach that this realm actually is ungraspable radiance. It's just one mind. But we have to keep working with this world and keep noticing that we're being caught by it. And be kind to be caught. And remember the teaching that there's really nothing to be caught by or anything to catch it by. Yes. What comes to mind is Bodhidharma saying to his student, or the student coming to Bodhidharma and saying, please help me, my mind is torturing me or my way of experiencing life. And Bodhidharma says something like, okay, bring me your mind and I'm going to pacify it.

[86:38]

And he says, I cannot find it. There you go. Actually, I could not find it. He went away and came back seven years later. He really looked thoroughly and could not find it. Just like the great master in China looked for somebody who understood Buddha Dharma and couldn't find anybody. This is what somebody said in the three worlds. He said that. And so people wrote it down. It happened in the three worlds. And he said, in the three worlds, No single person can understand it. But the one who said it was not a person who understood it either. No single person understands this teaching. But in the three realms, we want at least one single person to understand this teaching. And it would be nice if it was me. But if it can't be me, it could be one friend of mine. I'd like somebody in this world to understand Buddha Dharma.

[87:39]

Well, there isn't anybody. that understands it. That's what the ancestors said. You can't, but you don't also, it's not that there really isn't anybody, you just can't find anybody. There is somebody who understands, you just can't find her. She's called the one, the one that understands is the one mind. And what's the one mind? It's the three worlds of delusion. Understanding one is the three worlds of delusion. But the understanding is not a single person. The one mind is not a single person. The one mind is the one mind of all the single people and all the married people also. But there's not a married couple in the whole world that understands. And there's not a single person that understands. You can't find them. Yes.

[88:43]

I'm thinking about the metaphor you look at, because the ocean looks like a circle. Yeah. You're saying that's similar to each person in the view? Yeah. But it's not possible for one person to see the whole ocean or see the world, right? No. So is that, do people learn that faith in that? Well, faith in it, but also accepting. Kind of like a more humble approach to reality. Okay, you mean I'm not going to be able to see what's really going on by myself? Yeah. Can I help you accept that? It's not like people are like, oh, there must be an ocean, and they figure out by deduction, right? Yeah, right. There's many stories about people figuring out the ocean by deduction, which is, it's not this circle, it's not this circle, it's not this circle, it's the actual ocean. Just keep up rejecting all the circles as the ocean, and maybe then, then... My circle could be the ocean.

[89:45]

After I eliminated all the little circles, then my circle would be the ocean. No. But people had tried that. Right. But the point is that you never can see the whole ocean. A single person cannot see the whole ocean. However, the whole ocean can see the whole ocean. And does. And we can open. By compassionately and humbly working with the circles, we can open to the one bright pearl, the one mind, which is completely embracing that circle. But you can't experience the pearl either. You also can't experience the pearl? No, you can't, what's the word, you can't by yourself realize it. But your real life is the pearl. Your real life is the one mind. Your real life of delusion is the pearl.

[90:47]

But in delusion, we keep slipping from, okay, I'm living delusion, to, hey, I'm not deluded anymore. And everybody loves me. Wow. I kind of always wanted it. I kind of was secret about it for quite a few years. I thought if I didn't tell anybody, I could actually be the one. The first kid on the block. To understand. No. You can be the first kid on the block to think you understand me. No kid on the block understands by herself. But all the kids on the blocks, with all their delusion, together, they are the understanding. He said... realize something's missing. So what is the thing that's missing then? I mean, it sounds a little bit like if only you could see the whole world, you wouldn't have any problems.

[91:53]

If you could interpret it that way, but I don't think that's what it's meant. The thing about if you could see the whole, how do you say it? If you could see the whole world? Yeah, it's sort of like you only can see a piece of it, and then you realize that you only see a piece of it. It would only fill your mind. But seeing that you only see a piece of it is starting to have the diamond take up your body and mind. Right, so then, I mean, just... I mean, this is sort of very out. Then if you can see the whole world, then... It sounds like a dark planet, and you don't have to see the whole world. You can't see the whole world. You cannot see the whole world. The whole world sees the whole world. And that, the whole world of illusion, sees the whole world of illusion. And that's one mind. That is the scene. And there is that scene. It's there to be... It's there to open up what we're doing. We're opening up the whole world, seeing the whole world today.

[92:56]

We're trying to demonstrate it in this conversation. I don't know if we quite got to the next stage. We used to awaken to it. But we're opening up the... the many, many circles open up the many, many circles that we're working with in the many, many circles we're working with the many, many circles and in this way we open to the many, many circles which we cannot see are worth seeing that's already going on But we are ignoring it. So that's what we're missing. What is it that we're missing? We're missing that the whole world is seeing the whole world. We're missing that. We think I see the whole world.

[93:58]

Even to think you see part of it is part of it. Part of the world of delusion is to think you can see part of it. But some people in the world of delusion think they can see all of it. So then they think that the circle they see is the ocean. But some people see the circle and they think they can see the circle by themselves. Even that is the delusion. But let's just start by seeing the delusion that what I see is the whole ocean. There's something missing there. But some people actually do think that the circle they see is the whole ocean. Don't you think that? You know, some kind of immature people go out in the ocean and they see the circle and say, oh, this is the ocean. But as they practiced more, they realized, oh, now I see that it is not the ocean.

[94:59]

Matter of fact, they see there isn't even an ocean. So when I first was practicing, I thought the circle of water was the ocean. Later I realized there was no circle and no ocean. Now I realize the circle of water again. So the advanced Buddha can still see the circles, they just know. It's just a circle. I think this was the longest talk we've ever had. It's all one talk. Yes. still could ask a yes or no question. Yes. Yes. Do you want to ask another one? It will never end. It will never end. It's exhaustive investigation. Here's a question. When we awaken to what you've been talking about, will we be more

[96:07]

able and likely to help beings who are suffering violence and cruelty? Can I change it? Rather than when we awaken? But the we includes everybody. Okay, so if you say, when everybody awakens to this... Oh, no, no, no, no. When I... Okay, never mind. You are not going to be able to... This cannot be understood by one person. But when it is understood, it is exactly the purpose of this understanding, is to protect all beings from violence. That's the whole point of this understanding. But there's not a single person in all of China or Russia or the Western Hemisphere, there's not a single person who understands. But this understanding three worlds are mine only.

[97:10]

That understanding saves the world and protects all beings. So I just need to give up me doing it by myself and me having the understanding by myself, which is very difficult because we have the world we're not going to get rid of. We're not going to get rid of, we're just going to give it up. The impulse that I'm going to understand that I'm going to awaken to this. That impulse is going to keep coming. I'm not trying to get rid of it, but I just said, I'm not going to. It's not going to be done by me, even though that impulse may keep arising. Okay? Yes? Could you just go back to what you originally said, what you were contemplating? Could you... The one sentence says, the three realms, whatever exists in the three realms is just one mind.

[98:19]

And what exists in the three realms is thinking that there's not just one mind. What exists in the three realms is there's my mind and your mind. That's the three realms. So in the three realms which... ignore and more or less disagree with the teaching that this is all one mind. All of that is just one mind. The world of ignorance is just one mind. Yes, and now we have set our new record.

[98:59]

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